Belle

Yeppers! And they would probably react worse than the priest and the Levite from Luke 10 who walked past the man who had been robbed and beaten. They would have spit on the man and kicked him while he was down for not believing to be safe and protected from thieves and physical harm. Good Samaritans they ain't!

2 more days! :D-->

How are our new non-smoking friends doing today?

Got all my free postage boxes, labels, customs forms, etc. from USPS yesterday. I'll be getting some goodies in the mail this week-end! :D--> I think I'm going to have more fun putting the packages together than the people who receive them!

Oh that sounds like a blast!! But shouldn't our Flat Stanley be a line cook or a waitress? ;)--> Maybe we should start a new thread for this idea. Count me in!!

I don't want to derail CoolWaters' thread but I would like to hear more about this.... What's the difference between "talking" to Jesus and "praying" to Jesus? From what I remember being taught, you don't do either and there never was a distinction taught between the two. I'm not trying to pick a fight or tell you that you're wrong, WhiteDove. I just think that we (you and I at least) got two different messages from what was taught. :)--> I don't question your integrity and I'm certainly not trying to mis-represent what vee pee taught, I just think that he either changed his tune or craig mis-represented what vee pee taught about having a relationship with Jesus. Basically craig didn't want us to have any kind of relationship with Jesus and, to my knowledge, they still haven't changed that doctrine in TWI, although they did start singing the "Jesus" songs more often the last year that I was in.

Catcup, in defense of the person who initially posted the information, he/she is still "in" TWI and since the information wasn't publicly announced ministry wide, he/she may be concerned about getting caught coming here. I know I was one paranoid mutha when I lurked and didn't post - posting opens a whole nother can of worms... There are a few "innies" who contact me with information because they know full well that information is released sometimes very specifically to "catch" people posting here. Pretty pitiful actions for a group of people who are supposed to be representing God. --> They enjoy "spying out our liberty in Christ" way too much.

But you know that when the truth is told.. That you can get what you want or you just get old

Oooh, Ooohh, Ooohhh, Mister Kotter!! I KNOW! I KNOW!! Ole Blue Eyes - "The Second Time Around" Love it, Sharon! unsolicited trivia: Barry Manilow also sang this. ;)--> And, although I normally choose Barry over anyone else, this IS Sinatra's song.

WD, I did not become involved until after 1990, however, it is my understanding that VP once taught the trinity as well. I'm saying that from what I remember being taught VP and craig taught that you do not pray to Jesus. I could have been taught incorrectly, but that's what I remember hearing (that you don't pray to Jesus and that it was taught by VP and Craig). Like I said, I lost all the way rags I had, including some from before my involvement, but I have some tapes and will do my best to document what I've posted. I stand behind my words. I'm not saying VP never said to talk to Jesus and I never meant to imply that, I just think he changed his tune somewhere down the line and Craig took that and ran with it. My point was that just because VP wrote that letter doesn't mean that he didn't teach it differently at another time. Just like he quit teaching the trinity. Not putting words in his mouth, just stating the words I heard of coming from his mouth. It seems to me Craig took a lot of what VP taught and exaggerated, stretched and embellished it. Talking to Jesus is one of those subjects I remember falling into that category.

So I can do that so y'all don't have to hunt me down once I make a guess?

If it's a longer quote I look it up to make sure I got it right before posting it. If it's a short one I just type it, usually it's a line that my friends and I have quoted a million times to each other, so I vividly remember it (and the memories associated with it). If y'all post a quote I have no clue about, such as the one up for grabs now. I'll look it up and watch to see who does get it. :D--> That's not breaking any rules, is it?

"I can see clearly now" ? Do you have to know the singer?

Mr. Hammeroni on the law of believing:

I hope this thing doesn't recoil too much...

I think that's one for the Gems Thread, Mr. H. :)-->

What VP said and what VP did are two entirely different things. Besides that, it's implying that a person is sick because THEY did something wrong. THAT'S FREAKING WRONG!! And how do you explain the things that happen IN SPITE OF our believing?? I just KNEW I was going to get a ticket when I got pulled over by a cop for speeding. Was BELIEVING to get that ticket, the points on my license, have to go to driving school, pay a huge fine......I got a WARNING! :D--> I didn't get what I was honestly believing to get. I have many more examples of this than I do of examples where I specifically told God what to do and really and truly believed He was going to do it......getting my husband to see TWI for what it really is being one of them. :(--> Edited to add: And another thing! ;)--> That's NOT what craiggers taught. Remember that his regime did not even pretend to be loving, kind, gentle, longsuffering, meek or good.

I wasn't involved, but I do remember during Y2K and again during hurricane scares that we were setting up "safe" homes for people to go to if there was trouble. One girl in our branch is married to someone who has absolutely nothing to do with TWI, but to my knowledge has never spoken evil of them, just doesn't care for them. The wc, including Moneyhands, told this woman that she was welcome to go to X's home for protection should she need it, but her "rank unbelieving" husband was not welcome because he would endanger the lives of all the other believers and didn't deserve the "protection of the household". Many other things along this line were said to this woman. Why she sticks around, I'll never know.

OM, I don't think anyone implied that they didn't teach what you said, we're just saying they were wrong and they were teaching incorrectly. For me the proof is in the pudding. While I was in TWI I was starving despite trying to "believe" correctly and live the "Word" they taught. Now I have more pudding than I know what to do with since I've changed my "believing". :D-->

The Elephant Man Anne Bancroft The Micracle Worker

Rascal, I prayed several times asking God for His will to be done or for something to happen..."if it was His will" and was yelled at for praying wrong and for not believing God. Jeepers Creeps!! Am I supposed to tell God what HIS will is????? Of course, that was shortly before I left. Now I freely and gladly put everything in God's hands and have found He does a much better job of figuring things out than I ever did. :D-->

A friend who quit had this saying taped to her computer and said it helped: "The urge to smoke with pass whether you smoke or not." Good luck, guys!

I LOVE Shea Butter products!!! :D--> I don't know much about website design, but it looks good to me. I would like to see the price of the products with the descriptions, but that's just a personal preference and has nothing to do with the site design. Make sure she gives you a cut off the GSpot sales she'll be getting! ;)-->

Sunesis, I had exactly the same realization and it was such a relief to me and my heart. I just trust God to take care of things and I ask him to but I don't tell him WHAT to do or HOW to take care of me. :)--> There's a BIG difference!! TWI taught us arrogance in so many areas of life. We were arrogantly "confronting the world with the Word" - we were arrogantly bossing God around telling Him what to do....geez!! No wonder we were getting answers and living the "more abundant life". My prayers are much more different now. A catalyst, I think, for me was seeing 1 Ti 1:5 in different versions. It just "clicked" in my brain that the purposes TWI taught were diametrically opposed to the true purpose of the Word.

WD, see the date on that letter? See who wrote it? That's NOT what we were taught while I was in TWI. ;)--> Remember, vee pee once believed in the trinity as well.... We were taught that it was idolatry to pray to Jesus (and you don't call him Jesus - you always call him Jesus CHRIST because there are devil spirits who answer to the name of Jesus). At one point craig had us almost hating Jesus because of all the glory he was getting (taking away from God, I guess) and wanting all the songs praising him taken out of the songbook. I don't have any way rags left, lost em in the divorce, but I do have a boatload of tapes. I'll try to get some quotes for you.