socks

And may you have a chocolatey day, Krysilis! Smooth chocolate bunnies, melting in your mouth! jardinero, thanks! Cools sites. I didn't see that program this morning but it sounds like the word is out! The Power of the Peeps! Always good to meet a fellow Peep! We have a small basket this year. Peeps rule! Here's one of those links jardinero to their site - I recommend a visit to PEEPSVILLE! for anyone who hasn't been there! Peeps are year round goodness, too, available in a wide variety of styles and shapes! Nothing beats the little yellow birdies though, they're lip smacking sugar shacking good and always a delight! Happy East-ah all! Check it out - He's Risen!

Back at ya Radar! --> Peeps, SO good! Excie, I know it's been awhile since I had any new peeps so I wanted to bring these special ones. Soft, sugary and SWEET!

Happy Merry Easter! I brought some new peeps with me today! Have a great Sunday!

Thanks house. Based on that, it seems that Martindale's saying - Eve "committed" homosexuality, and sinned. Adam "accepted the concept"....he didn't really do anything but he agreed, uh, conceptually. How exactly does someone agree to the "concept" of homosexuality? What's he think Eve did with Luciferanne? And what did she say? "She's CUTE, huh?" and Adam nodded, drooling? Does he actually describe how he pictures this record playing out, as if Adam and Eve were real people? If I were going to go along with his conclusion, I would think that Adam would have had to have done the same thing as Eve, in "concept". But the problem is there's no other men around for Adam to uh, conceptually do the no-no with, or think about doing it with. Is Adam's sin that he thought "dang, I with I had a buddy with big beefy arms and a hairy neck?" . Lucifer is, according to Martindale, a babe and one hot one at that. Eve's never seen another woman before. I guess, there's no indication in that record they've had children at that time, and if she had they'd be her kids. As I juggle the possibilities I don't see the pieces fitting together like a hand in a glove. Oh wait. Old wineskin! No problemo for Martindale, it just has to fit in his ample head. I think another place where he's pulling pork here, to coin a phrase, is in the conclusion that all of these "earthly" and "sexual" connotations in the Hebrew words restricts the interpretation to a sexual one AND that the sin would be, perhaps by default as there's no conclusive or clear statement to support it, that Eve and Lucifer-ette had sex together. Those words have to have earthly connotations, and could be used in sexual contexts, of course. But we also know that Hebrew words have multiple meanings, shades of meaning, and sometimes similar and opposite meanings, which he eludes to in his half-baked reference to ayin and it being a "homonym". I'm not a Hebrew language expert but if that's all he said about it, he's got cards he isn't showing, perhaps because he knows full well they're not deal-makers. I've read a few unusual interpretations about Genesis and "the fall" and his isn't even the most far out, but the real question is, why would he present this as THE meaning when it's at best a very weakly upheld theory and more accurately a hypothesis, a wild a@@-guesstimate likely cooked up in some late night poring over his personal problems. ("Stupid studid stupid me!") Maybe. That would be my wild-a@@-guesstimate. Weird. But interesting. -->

I have long sensed, lo for many years now, a void for the allegiance and disposable income of many an Ex-Wayfer. For those troubled souls I offer a partial solution, a truly worthy and trouble free place to deposit their dough - The Socks Collection Plate. Benefits - many! No meetings. No classes. No sales people will ever call! No tax deduction. No rules or regulations. And most important- No obligation! From me, to ever do anything, ever! I accept PayPal and cash. Cash works. Send cash. I make this offer in the interest of helping only. I'm here to help. Let me help you. Help is on the way! Accept the help and feel the love!

Thanks house, never seen dat before, laid out in all it's glaw-ry. Sooooo...did Martindale suggest this all ended up in some kind of funky 3-way? A sexual Do-Re-Me Too? I'd have to wonder, if Eve's sin was homosexuality and she gave it to Adam and he ate it too (don't go there!!!) then why wouldn't it mean his sin was homosexuality too? Did he cover that? If the sin was a sexual relationship with the Devil-in-a-blue-dress-and-spikey-heels, and the original sin was homosexuality and she gave it to her husband (sounds like a cold or something) why wouldn't that mean that his sin was homosexuality? It wouldn't be if he was sharing the love with two women. I think Martindale might have ayin messed up too, amongst other things. Compared to his teaching an apple sounds much easier to swallow. (don't go there!!!!) :D-->

Give it time, give it time. I think that's the idea they've got. Leave the Way, 37 years later something happens... See? We tooooold you.... I hate to sound mean but after looking at that one video they had on their website, the one where Harve and others were on camera and spoke, geez. They looked like pale, glazed vampires. Their skin looked like it hadn't seen a decent day of sunshine in a loooong time. That can't be good, if that's what living their does. That's slow death, death by inactivity or something.

Mr. H, I read this in a little book I got once. I'm not a Buddhist, but these little writs and sayings were kind of cool- "The whole purpose of religion is to facilitate love and compassion, patience, tolerance, humility, forgiveness." I don't know that I'd take that as a complete list or anything, but the idea resonates with me. That religion, if I consider it a way to organize and practice a godly awareness and pursuit in my life, does something - 'facilitate's' things, makes them easier. Not harder. And the first things I'd list would be items like on this list - things that reflect and inspire the type of life that Jesus taught and lived. It's so weird, but I don't think that in the rush to perfect "our walks" as Christians that we're led enough towards the intrinsic value of the quality of life that Jesus Himself taught and lived. We're taught abundance in the wrong context. There's value in love in and of itself. Humility, in and of itself. Giving, for the sake of giving, not for the sake of receiving. AND that the reward for those things are the things themselves. That the humble person has his reward in that his life is balanced and true in his humility. He is at peace, no struggle, if only for a time. I think "the genuine HAS to be easy" is a true saying! Easy in that it is what it is. If the Truth is in us it will grow with a little space and food. We're like gardners, I think. Happy in our little gardens we've been given. :)--> Teachers want students. Preachers want an audience. But a godly life in any amount is it's own reward. Or can be. "...Godliness with contentment is great gain".

Fish heads, fish heads!

3 Cents has a good take on that. So you were in the 5th corps, hey? Leave me out of the "Jesus Freaks" and all of that. I never considered myself a "Jesus Freak". :D--> :D--> Just a freak. If Jim D's around and has the time, his answer will be illuminating, I'm sure. Jim E D - I bet it would interest a lot of people to know your beginnings, how you came to Jesus Christ, and what you were doing when you got hooked up with VPW, just before the "Way West" came on. If you have the time and inclination and read this. Hard to miss, y'know. Personally I don't want to rehear Karl's books version. I think he may have gotten a little whitewash from some of his sources, but for someone reading it who has no idea at all of a lot of the events of that period, it has some of them.

If you don't fill anything in and hit Compute my score you get "100% Dixie". Not sure what that indicates. How do you pronounce creek? Rhymes with meek Rhymes with kick Either Don't know ??? RESULT: Don't know??? :D--> Cute test!

Yes it is, just spoke to him a little while ago at that number. I hope he finds more time to share his thoughts here. Jim married my wife and I. (y'know, the ceremony) He had a strong, positive impact on our lives at the time. He was a friend. We were kids. I didn't fully recognize it at the time but Jim, you were that rare person who, when you shake it all out, gave a lot more than you took. Love ya!

For the record (sounds of scratching aa needle goes on) I don't know if this is Mssr. Jim E. Doop. Could be. I'd like to think it is but I don't really know, eggsackly. :)-->

Hmmm, you won? Okay, if you say so. I'll split the difference - WE WON. We're here, we're still breathing and that alone is cause for a toast, hey? WE FRIGGIN' LIVED to tell the story! They can't tell me there's no God! :D--> And He's got a sense of humor too, that's for sure. Jim E. , there's a side of me that isn't quite sure if this is the Jim E. Doop from the Haight I met with Howie in the 60's, but if it is brother, you know. You know. We've seen the bottom of the dark pit and hung our legs over the side and thought what the hell, it'll be a short ride down. But God makes a way, yes He does, a better way. What made you pick this thread? Dunno, doesn't matter. Welcome.

You are ex10. You are so wonderful, Sky you are. We all are. We're so wonderful that there's only one of us, now and forever. You're the only one of you the world gets, after that, no more like you again, ever. Just realizing that makes it easier to understand why a God would allow our lives to be and go on and on. I really do think that God must see us as so much more than we allow for, every one of us. But even a little bit is nice.

Hello jimdoop. Man, you can't type worth a $hit! ;)--> That's okay. Just kidding. Where're you at these days there jimdoop? If you get a sec, email me at soques@hotmail.com Got a question for you. Been a long time.

I don't know the context of the statement HCW made. What're we talking here, rebel against "the Word", against their parents, wazzit? Rebel how, against what?

Maybe. Vanity turns the mirror inwards and marvels at nothing. Humility sees the nothingness and is broken by it. Love fills the emptiness with it's light and sheds abroad to everything near it. True love won't ignore or refuse, it will recognize and fill from a source that never goes dry.

I agree with Oldiesman, the purpose of going in the Way Corps was to receive training towards a "lifetime of service". I think a lot of us clearly had it in mind that meant service, of some kind, through activity, of some kind, with the Way International of New Knoxville. It took me my first year in residence ini 73-74 to realize that wasn't going to happen. I ended up having an interim year and it was that year, going over the teaching series we'd had on the Itineraries of Paul and Early Church History and Timothy, that I realized in a kind of "ah ha!" moment that the Way International that I was in then wasn't going to endure for my whole lifetime. Nothing heavy, no lightning bolts, I just realized how temporal everything we were doing was and that inevitably all of the things that would occur in the natural progression of our lives was going to reshape the Way of that day in to something different down the line. It would have to change and it would be good that it would, bad if it didn't. I didn't expect things to go the way they did but it hit me that after VPW died, which he would have to of course at some point, we'd be on our own. At the time my life very much revolved around VPW and the Way Corps program. I just realized that someday it wouldn't. I felt fine about a lot of things after that even though it was still a struggle at times. I was perfectly willing to deal with certain kinds of things that weren't ideal, knowing that "leaving" at some point wouldn't be the end of the world or my "committment" - my committment couldn't get sidetracked in to relying on the day to day stuff that was inevitably going to change whether I liked it or not. In fact, leaving the program as I knew it was more likely than it staying the same till I was 70 or something. When I was 22, I thought I knew what that meant. As far as what I could see in front of me and for the future, that's exactly what it meant. Way Corps discussions always contained a lot of the word "committment", as if to a specific activity or function, like a job. But that only a part of it. The investment people like Oldiesman put in people like me will always be appreciated because the opportunity was for personal development and growth. And look at us here and in whatever capacities people are in now in their lives - in a very unexpected way you have life as we knew it serving life as we now know it. Weird. Weird but interesting.

Belle, that's the truth. Myself, I relied on the Way for most of what I trusted...that's the key word. I trusted the information I was given, not blindly, but as "friendly" guidance. Most of what was taught or dealt with back in the 70's was basic stuff, pretty sound. Live on what you earn. Don't finance for frivolous non-essentials. Don't go into debt and pay 15 per cent interest to buy a new stereo, etc. Save to buy. Etc. Etc. That was a good place to start, for anyone. But we very quickly grew up. Within 10 years, we started having families, children, schooling, etc. etc. Our extended families grew, got older, etc. etc. There were a great many topic and issues that we could have started training in to PREPARE us for the challenges and opportunities that were going to come over the years and cycles of life. Some of these things were proposed, but frowned upon as wastes of time. Why talk about financial interests when you can be teaching "the Word"? The Way had our ears and hearts for many years. How much of this kind of thing was done, presented, encouraged, fronted? The only way to do it was on a local level. But I can say from first hand experience if you tried to branch out in to other areas you'd get push back for getting too "off the mark" of the target. Problem - for awhile we were good at "getting people". But what about "living with them", for 50 years? That's what bugs me so about the Way's "teaching" ministry and how it's gone. They've had millions of dollars, years of time, 1000's of people...so many resources, so rich a field to till. But they lack one, vital, essential thing - Vision. They have a small vision, based on a very small sickly view of what it means, or could mean, to be a Christian alive today. So they take all those resources and meander around, no sense of urgency or responsibility to the people they have whose lives are ticking, ticking, ticking along one day at a time. They define "underachiever". But, off that. Your Dad sounds like a really great guy, he does. You must have a great family. It's good to see. It really is.

Thanks Belle, that's good information. I appreciate you posting it. At the expense of picking at Bobanar's emails, I have to say again, one of the rubs in the emails is that Bob seems to carry the tone that while you, having a Dad who can ably advise and share good quality information with you, the average Way Beleaver doesn't, or wont' or can't. In fact, any person so inclined can do their homework, read up, ask around, get advise, go to a bank, etc. etc. etc and get the information they need to make an infomed decision. They don't need the Way, or Bob, to provide that. It might certainly help if the Way could ever get their stories straight on what the bible says, but in the meantime there are plenty of Christiain churches and ministries who DO have, at the very least, information to share based on sound financial info and biblical information. So if that's what a person wants they don't need to wait till hell freezes over and the Way's Special Research Group manages to come up with something. There's lots of information available, and a person would probably do better to NOT have a Certified Way Leader holding their hand in the whole process. The last couple years I was in the Way I noticed how little information and experience there was amongst Way people who had followed Way advice in regards to financial affairs. If Way people are ignorant and incapable it isn't because the information and guidance isn't available. It's because they're being directed away from it. Again, hit or miss, depending on where a person lives and fellowships, but overall that was the state of Way World.

If the axle's bent, the wheel won't ride straight no matter how many times I change it, house. My point - the Way, IMO, doesn't really do research or even serious review of anything let alone it's own material. They rearrange furniture, that'a about it. I am being very cynical about things like Eve's lesbianship, a topic which amounts to much less than a hill of beans to someone with real life problems and needs. If they're not teaching and wasting people's time with that tripe, hear hear, kudos! Are the basic keys you had offline keys that you think the Way have offline too? Similar, or different ones? How did you get them back in line? How do you think they're methods compare? Not better/worse, just do you think there's been any improvement or correction, that you know of? One of the Way's techniques for learning was "the school of life". Take what you know and put it in to real application and see - not how the information holds up - but how you hold up. That's pretty much what the Way does, in addition to public presentations, "teachings" where people sit and listen to someone else talk. You learn it the stuff and apply it. But when you apply it you don't ever end up looking critically to the material, only to your performance. That mode of learning is used as a way to evaluate performance, not material. That's okay, to some extent. You can learn in a siloed environment like that. You're not expected to "reinvent" the wheel. Rather the expectation is that you're testing yourself and your ability to apply creatively certain accepted standards, ideas, instructions, etc. But when the term research is used it implies scrutiny, study, comparison, tests, yada yada. Advanced Classes in the Way don't do that or didn't and this one sounds like it's par for the course. Their research is the definition Oaks referred to - it's review, of the most cursory kind.

"learning is a repetitive venture". Diggin' the new smilies! --> Oaks, you're right. The quote about the person not reinventing the wheel...odd ring to that. Of course, anyone would want to make use of existing materials and resources. Hopefully that isn't a new idea to their grads or else they've really gone retro. But it sounds like intellectual incest. Cross-breeding amongst mental brothers and sisters. No wonder they end up with ideas that have 7 fingers and 12 toes. Eve was a lesbian! What next?... Judas was a trans-sexual! It fits with Rocco Banadorci's Way Magazine article titled 'Shellfish in the Word' from 2001 and you can see it all through the Staff Newsletter Bless Notes of 1998. It's amazing! Really! Learning is more than endless repetition. That's for babies. Don't touch the stove. Don't touch the stove, it's hot. Don't touch the hot stove. *OW!!!!! waaaahhhhhhh!!!!!!* Okay, from the top, don't touch the hot stove... If you're 48 years old and still can't get it into your head to check the stove and that the stove is hot when the knob says "ON", that's enough, y'know? Put that person in the Special Crib, they need watching. Oh sure, we all benefit from a regimen of healthy reminding, the revisiting of information. But are they being challenged? Truly? Reaaaaaaaally Rosalie, can we read the newspaper today? No? It'll break my brain? Okay, maybe tomorrrrrrrow. But such is The Way of The Wayfers.

Response number one: Is she an active grad? Response number two: Don't get distracted by the affairs of this world. Response number three: If you have time after praying for the outreach of the Prevailing Word, the health and safety of the Trustees and all Way Leadership, the well being of our properties and holdings, and all of the wonderful Way People Worldwide including (fill in names here) those in your local area, you may then enjoy praying for other miscellaneous items.

Thanks Ala. Sky - it is extortion. It takes the parable of the Good Samaritan and rewrites it to include a class registration and advance payment. :D--> To the thread, Consuelo! I was there when he did that. Now years later, a question: How does a non-profit organization "aggressively work" to eliminate a debt? Exactly how does that work out, on paper? New money, old money? Who's money are we talking about here? Who worked so hard to get it paid off? What was the aggressive work exactly?