socks

In addition to public declarations of who we're ignoring, I'd like to recommend a public record be kept of who: - we don't ignore - who we like - who we don't like - who we might like if they weren't so weird - who we read, but only to the 2nd or 3rd paragraph - who we would read if they'd ever post but they don't - who we wouldn't read if h-ll froze over but don't actually have on "Ignore" I think knowing this information before I even begin to read anything on GS would help a lot and go a long way towards building communication, trust and respect. All in favor say "YUK!!!"

Hey Sunesis. There were a few reasons why I didn't walk out of the infamous "clergy meeting" at the Way Nash, with Geer. I went with 2 other guys from the city I lived in. The Way Corps got together a week or so before the meeting and discussed concerns, what questions everyone had at that time, etc. One of the aims of our going was to come back with any information that was available. So one reason I wanted to stay if I chose to was to come back with as complete a picture of the proceedings as I could. I wasn't expecting much but I wanted to remain positive about the possiblities. So I went prepared to support anything I felt I honestly could. In fact there wasn't much to the whole proceedings that amounted to anything practical or constructive, but I also decided to stay to get to see people that came in from around the country. It was the last time I saw most of them and I knew that would probably be the case. Still, we 3 spoke about our plans before going and we could envision a possible situation where any one of us or all of us would choose to leave. So we each had our own personal thoughts about what and why and figured we'd wait and see, and hopefully support whatever individual decision anyone made. One thing I didn't want was a violent situation to develop. Tempers were high, there was a lot of frustration and concern. If the Trustees chose to stonewall, and people took physical action to overthrow the meeting and the Trustees it could have gotten out of hand in a minute. Some people talk like that would have been a good thing. Not if you'd have been there and knew the people assembled. Once someone crossed that line... I don't think it was the right thing for anyone to do and I'm glad no one did. I was seated about 8-9 rows back for the opening meeting, a few seats inside the center aisle on the right side. I never saw Geer's gun that others say he hauled out. He may have, but I didn't see him do it. Some people stood up when he hit the podium, others didn't. My view may have been blocked. If he did it wasn't as if he held it up and waved it around or I'd probably have seen it. That may contradict what others have told you, and I don't say this to debate, just to say I didn't see it. It's odd, because no one that did see this said anything to me about it or that I heard during the break or later overnight or at breakfast the next day. Everyone wasn't running around saying "did you see his .45!!! what's up with that???" Not at all that I remember. Again, I may have missed out on it entirely. Most of the people I knew that were there that I talked to were having a tough time deciding what to do. It was obvious the Trustees were whupped and of no use to anyone in their assigned job duties. Some had done background on how to get them out, legally. It wasn't easy to do, not based on what we were actually dealing with in concerns and likely wouldn't be successful. Geer was in some paranoid fantasy world and mostly interested in declaring his views on the condition of everyone and everything, and most of that was bad. His manner indicated to me he relished this opportunity to set the record straight according to his opinion with his usual pseudo-heavy muggish manner. Plus he made the Pillsbury Dough Boy look lean and tanned. He just had a bad look about him, not healthy. So it was tough - you want to do something to help, but the door's shut. I had made a personal vow to leave that night and day with diginity, whenever I left. I wasn't going to throw my chair at Geer or the Trustees and cuss them out or attempt to commandeer the meeting. Nothing would have been accomplished by that, besides having an interesting story to tell here now. I intended to look for possible ways in the existing environment to see if I could have an impact. I didn't find any and I had none to pass on when we came back. He spoke, we broke for 15 minutes or so and came back in, expecting to begin to discuss what the h-ll was going on. Instead the trustees rehashed what Geer had said and we put on some Advanced Class tape segments. I got up after awhile and went out for a smoke and the meeting broke awhile after that so I don't know exactly what happened, other than that. The next day we did something else, more tapes I think, don't remember, more smokes. At that point, it was mostly a matter of the weather, it was cold, it had snowed there that week and it was pointless to head to the airport early and wait it out there. I'd had a lot of good times in the BRC, and with a lot of these people. It was sad personally because like I say I doubted I'd ever be back again. I saw Howard before I left and we talked but nothing came of it. I think he expected us all to just go along with it all, but I let him know we were figuring out what we were going to do and I didn't like the whole thing we'd just done. He sent his love to my wife and family and that was that.

I'm a Beatles fan! John Lennon's death - at the time it seemed impossible. Why would anyone kill him? He's just a dammed singer and musician. You'd have to be crazy. I was working at the Way Nash, and was surprised at how calloused the reaction was. It made me remember that a lot of people believed the Beatles were the Devil's boys and somehow of Satanic influence. As if saying "I want to hold your hand" or "I Am the Walrus" were the worst things that could be imagined. John Lennon was the one who said the Beatles were more popular than Jesus, thus proving that you have to pick carefully the icons you compare yourself to. I guess if he'd said "the Beatles sell more records than Jesus ever did" he'd have really gotten crucified. What he said was pretty close to the truth, based on the 1,000's of kids who burned their records, which I guess they were using for prayer mats before that. But it did show from what perch he viewed the world as an atheist, and the tight view he had of the world from it. I remember reading his reaction and his response, as if he was surprised it would be so offensive to some people. But it was probably more innocent than anything and he's not the first or last person to think so, just one of those who's said so. The story of his early life I've read is sad, tragic really. His father left his mother and he and never came back. His mother left him with her sister to raise, and visited him as if she was a friend, not a mother. Later when he reconected with his mother as a young adult she was hit by a car and killed. I like a lot of the songs that bore his stamp the most - "I'm Only Sleeping", "It's Only Love", "Julia", written to his mother and perfectly captures that elusiveness and lost love he must have felt. And I remember when he came back after so many years of not releasing any music with the single "Woman". The verses to that song illustrate his mastering of the modern song form as well as any, I think. It's simple, almost casual, as if it flowed out of him, no biggie, did it before lunch. One of my favorites that I think is a true classic is "Norwegian Wood". The bridge is poignant, the music turn it makes. The lyrics are dry humor and the last line leaves you guessing: I once had a girl, or should I say, she once had me. She showed me her room, isn’t it good, norwegian wood? She asked me to stay and she told me to sit anywhere, So I looked around and I noticed there wasn’t a chair. I sat on a rug, biding my time, drinking her wine. We talked until two and then she said, it’s time for bed. She told me she worked in the morning and started to laugh. I told her I didn’t and crawled off to sleep in the bath. And when I awoke I was alone, this bird had flown. So I lit a fire, isn’t it good, norwegian wood.

I understand Belle. And one of the things you've reminded me of is that in the Way there were worse things than never hearing their teaching and that was believing it and than changing your mind and not believing it. People who chose to do that were always considered to be the biggest losers in the world. Quite literally, that God was going to be unable to tolerate you let alone love you and that you were nothing more than an accident waiting to happen at best, and an active agent of the "Adversary" at worst. Or both just for good meaure. That completely devalues a person and it isn't based on "God's Word" at all. So, you'd get bible quotes about Paul and how he looked at those who disagreed with him but still preached the gospel, but in action there was little of that in evidence in the Way when it came down to cases.

Belle - Excellent!

Indeed. Way back when during Summer school, some of the people at the Way used to observe birthdays by throwing you in "the pond". Everyone would sing Happy-Happy birthday to you at lunch, then you'd get hoisted off to the pond back by the barn. Mostly young folk, the yungins. It was fun. Although it bore a striking resemblance to an ancient Aztec ritual of baptism where adults were tossed into pits of ground cocoa bean and poppy buds for the yearly Sacrifice to the Coke God, it was basically just a fun thing.

jardinero's gonna whippit good!.... Glad to provide inspiration! :) Rottiegrrrl, you crack me up. :D I didn't want to chase you off Church Lady! I was hoping Rottiegrrrrl would 'pank you into line! Anybody know how old Heidi is? Just wondering, have to look it up somewhere. Hey, maybe she'll get Charlie Sheen to do some celebrity TV infomercials!! Weinie roast Tom? Tom, Lad!! Tom! It be good to see you fella! Somehow weinie roasts on this thread sound....severe. I can picture - well, let's not go there, but someone at the grill saying "Your weiners ready, we have 12 kinds of buns - which kind would you like it in?" :P :P :P :P

mstar, cookies alone could never drag me from a PFAL session. Cookies and COFFEE, maybe. Speaking in tongues was taught as being a manifestation of holy spirit. It's axiomatic - now there's a word that you don't hear everyday - that holy spirit has to be present at the time of the manifestation. If a person doesn't have the holy spirit they won't be able to "operate" any of the manifestations the PFAL series taught about. A person "gets" born again, receives holy spirit (the gift) and then learns what's available and how to receive it. In the case of speaking in tongues a person learns what is is from the bible, that they can "operate" it as a spiritual manifestation of their new life and then they believe and speak in tongues. Session 12 "led" people into speaking in tongues. PFAL taught that speaking in tongues is perfect prayer, perfect praise and worship to God. For "private" personal prayer life of a believe who was born again. In PFAL only a person born again with holy spirit could pray perfectly in the manner that Corinthians speaks about. The quote, with the addition of the "really" is from I Cor. 12:3 as you know - Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. When speaking by the spirit, no one curses Jesus and in addition to that no one can say that Jesus is the Lord but by the Holy Ghost. Paul's the one who makes the distinction I think. Reading it a person could easily think, hey, I can say Jesus is Lord right now. Jesus is supreme. There. I said it. Paul makes a distinction about saying Jesus is Lord. No one can say he's Lord but by the Holy Ghost. Whatever it means it doesn't seem to mean that I can't say it, because I can. Jesus is Lord. Anyone can say it regardless of whether they believe Jesus is Lord or not. A person who's accepted him as a redeemer and messiah, who's considered and believe that Jesus was killed and then raised from the dead is said to be "born again" when they believe that and choose to follow Jesus Christ in a new life. That person receives holy spirit, something new, something different happens in that person's life as they proceed on. Saying Jesus is Lord by the Holy Ghost takes all of that into consideration I think. Paul does seem to be saying that fwhen a person speaks by the Holy Ghost they wil be saying "really" that Jesus is supreme in their life and it's more than just a tacit or superficial recognition of Him. In the context of 12 Paul's talking about spiritual things, gifts, "manifestations", whatever. I don't think Paul meant that if you don't speak in tongues you're never really born again. Put another way it might read "When a person speaks by the Holy Ghost his speaking will be a recognition that Jesus is Lord, His Lordship will be recognized". The "really" isn't even necessary.

You guys're scaring me. :o JL, take that pant suit off right now! You'll look much better in the pink slip. Rottiegrrrrl, make him behave. :P If Heidi succeeds I imagine her place will be filled with music, dance, laughter, food and drink and women will be bonding and partying and trying on riding boots while they playfully snap their ridiing crops and wait for the Dungeon Room to open up and still others struggle to pick between "Bob The Brick Layer" and "Jerry, The Disrespectul Delivery Boy". They'll leave flushed and laughing in buses and head back to the casinoes for some late night one-armed banditry proudly weaing T-shirts that say "I Got Some At Heidi's!" on the front and "Next Time He'll Pay ME!" on the back. It will be a lusty celebration, strange but wonderful in it's own way. Meanwhile down the road at the guys place they'll be nervously eating stale potato chips and avoiding looking anyone in the eye while they pace around with their buddies and talk about how "hay-ull no this ain't my first time!" while a woman named "Delilah" with Winstons on her breath and a tatoo on her shoulder of a shark says "you're next". ;)

Side note material questions - "What is The Way?" and "What does it mean to be taught by the Way?". Addendumb - "What is an authorized representative of the Way"? Extra credit - question: If a Way leader sneezes in the woods and there's nobody there to hear it, is he still catching a cold? When people of the Way who present themselves as leaders offer insights into the bible, a case can certainly be made that the Way "taught it". I've come to realize this about my own business, er, I mean Personal-Improvement and Growth Ministry, which is why I only offer my own great insights when I'm really really sure, such as the material contained in my next book "Everything You Wanted to Know But Didn't Want to Pay to Learn". It's available completely free of charge, as all my books are for a nominal handling fee of...okay, that's getting tired. Belle, I think what you're pointing out is that the collective material of what is taught officially in a class like WAP by a person of mediocre communication skills and what is retaught and rehashed to support and expand on it forms a total message, the meaning of which can be vague and fluid. The Way has slowly developed a doctrine over many years that the space between a person who is "born again" and a person who knows the "accuracy of the Word" AND stands with the Way on it AND is born again is huge. It's gotten wider and wider, IMO. There is, by the sounds of it, still a thin fragile thread between the two and God but it's not worth much if you don't walk in the Present Truth being taught by the Way, whatever that is (and I'd bet a taco right now they're not even sure what that is but they're anxiously waiting for it to be announced at lunch). That has to be true, otherwise they wouldn't single out those who don't accept their teaching word for word when they find them and kick them out. If you go along quietly, you're fine but they seem to want to keep the official blood line clean. Small, and incestuous, but clean by their standards. (pass the soap). I would offer gently that if people got the impression that it was true that S.I.T.'s was an essential component for salvation in Christ, it came from somewhere, something said, something considered. I'm sure that isn't what VPW taught, but he taught a lot of stuff over the years as did everyone else who took his material and uh, "worked" it. A lot of things came down the pike as gospel. If a person was in a "limb" and heard primarily the people who came to that limb teach and that was the Way doctrine for them, they're qualified to speak about what the Way taught, certainly whatever classes they took as well as everything else they heard. It may be vague, it may be a rehash, it might be of local invention that wasn't even really documented but it still could have happened. My 2 cents. Worth 1.00 towards my new book if you believe it now!!! (okay, I'm leaving)

Sounds to me like the deep discontent is indeed a matter of content, not travel or activity. There's always been a lot of activity in the Way, things to go to and do. But are they meaningful? Do they fulfill, interest, challenge? Is there growth, development. And, are they for everyone? Does everyone have to do the same things, the same way, at the same time, all the time? The Way loves to latch onto some little word-play twist in the bible and beat it like a hammer on a tack. Family/household, faith/believing. Godly love/emotional love. Move the Word or Sit and die. Go WOW or Be a spud. It's as if life and love are finally found - in a dictionary. When it all shakes out, what really counts? What do you take away with you? If it's not enough, then of course you're going to be disatisfied. If someone's happy, they should stay, keep doing what they're doing, have a ball. If not, it hardly means they're screwed up somehow. It's really humorous - being in the Way - once - is like going on the date-from-hell where you have a good time, hope to do it again sometime but the other person starts calling 5 times a day and doesn't understand why you don't want to see them now everyday and ends up telling everyone you're a creep because you don't see that You're Their Soul Partner For Life. "I keep telling him/her that I need to see them but they just won't call back and I don't understand what's wrong or what I did except I'm sure it's not me so it must be them and I'm really concerned!!! ...!" It's just funny. Weird but funny.

Ted. that's sweet!!!!! Congratulations, Kathy and Ted. I'd love to see the two things you both put together to send. Post that puppy! I know it seems to a lot of people like VP had an I.V. to our brains and that's how all the songs were written. That piece - I remember all the time you spent on it, crafting the words, the rhythm, the delivery. Craft and art, all in one polyster suit! (y'know I can't let that die. Every rose garden's gotta have it's thorn, and we had two counting me!)

exraydio, I love ya too. I'm thinking of reading it myself now, but no promises. But don't call me good. You haven't seen my office, which right now is "clean", which would sound like the word "heard", as in when the disciples heard Jesus curse the fig tree....they heard it. I had to finally hang 3 of my guitars on the wall as their complaints were so loud concerning their personal safety. And Donald the cat - don't get me started. That be Good Seed, of the booooo-rn again! tune jardinero. When you listened to America Awaits (no cd's Dave and Jim, sorry) you got to hear Pressed Down music though. Grave and the Glory was a Downer tune. Katie Fowle-boy. Katie. She was so funny, her take on things sometimes and an expression that could say "you gotta be kidding me" perfectly. Very nice woman. 76 was an active year, I think signifiant in that we/the Wayfers, focused on our communities, country, politics, etc. There was a surge of development that came together that year in business, commerce, politics, other stuff. It brought out a lot because it had some focus on -how- we could "move the Word", as part of society. In a certain way it took the focus from inward to outward, for some people. But Protocols of the Elders of Zion???? Counterfeits abound. The Order of the Sock has long battled these enemies of the True Path!!! Read the only true and viable plan for world domination in the "Protocols of So Crates, soon to be published in all it's glory!!! Sure to thrill, it will be available soon.

Most of my involvement was with the America Awakes release by Joyful Noise, and the travel we did around the country. I appreciate that people enjoyed it and got something out of it and I do understand anyone who didn't, for reasons musical, message or otherwise. Music is a personal choice and I'm sorry anyone was pressured to listen to it to that didn't want to or more than they wanted to. I mean, enough's enough after awhile. Nothing's that good. :blink: :D From my view, America Awakes was a continuation of a theme that we'd worked on the year before that was titled "God in America". One of the center pieces of that period was a spoken word composition that Ted F. wrote titled "The White House Across the Street", with Ken Mac's piano composition accompanying. him. The house was the White House in D.C. of course and it was probably Ted at his best, IMO. It also contained a composition by Mary A. D. on piano, and a song by Stevie K, "Chosen Gems". The chorus went "We are chosen gems, polished by God and His Word...we are beautiful in God's sight". I remember lighting candles we each carried and went into the audiences with and passed along to people. Between those two productions I think I remember it as J.N. at their best. When we weren't fighting like cats and dogs over some minor detail to make our work better we were - there's really no other way to say it, the people in Way Productions were the greatest people, among the best I've ever known or worked with. It's a time I wouldn't have missed for the world and I was glad to be a part of it. I'd left another musical life entirely to be there and while we were all very different people we were I think all the same in that we were excited to have a chance to build something. Not to mention all the Way folks. Wayfers, gotta love 'em. I can't recall the numbers of great people I met that year as we travelled. You guys're alright. :) Mostly it was for you, your music. It was on your dime and it honored the music that people like you heard it. From my view the message of what we were doing was a positive one, coming out of God in America to America Awakes. Recognizing that our country was a wonderful place, with a history that spoke to the best and the worst men and women could do. Given our Constitution, our freedoms and our prosperity, we were in a very blessed spot in the planet's history. What were we going to do with that? We felt we had something to offer each and every person and in J.N. I think we saw it that way. Night after night, person by person, a chance to reach out and remember the good, look honestly at the bad and declare a new day and a new way. Well, we were young, maybe that explains it. B) I remember all the stuff about impending doom, but - I'd have to say honestly I couldn't get much traction on that. I believed most of what was coming out, but I've always been a get-up-tomorrow-and-do-it-again person. Maybe more stupid than anything else, that's all I know to do, get busy, get creative, move-it-on-down-the-road one more time and keep at it. I wrote a song that didn't last long in performance, titled "Where Did It Go" with the chorus "let's forget all our tomorrows and yesterdays and walk on in the light..." I think when I looked at our American history I felt if we took the best of our past we could invent a new future based on fairness and equity, and less greed and more meet-the-need. Well, I was young. I took the whole thing personally, as I know many of us did. I remember that year Stevie Wonder's "Songs in the Key of Life" was out, won a grammy that year. He opened the 2 disk album with the song "Love's In Need of Love" and it really reached me...."Love....Don't delay, send yours in right away...hate's going round breaking many hearts...stop it please, before it's gone too far...." I think that and "Isn't She Lovely" were bookends for me. Get busy loving, get busy making love and life. I experienced some mis steps that year but I felt the efforts of good people everywhere to take even the smallest of steps towards making our country a better place wasn't wasted time or effort.

It was, exallente'. It was. I laughed, I cried, I chuckled. I wish you'd seen it in the original, but alas, even as I tapped it out I myself dozed off for portions of it. Still it must have been awesome based on the drool trail that I found on my keyboard after I came to. I'm sure many have been helped by it and will want to know where to send Love Offerings, so it would be selfish at this point to not allow for the wellspring of giving that's bound to occur, so for those who were helped and you know who you are, please get the relief you deserve from your burden of debt and send money now to "itonlyhurtzwhenidontgivetosocks@dollarsandcentz.com" Thank you, you'll be glad you did, and you'll love the signed foto (by me, yes me) of the cover of my next book to be titled "Relief and How to Get It", that comes to each and every person who does The Right Thing, printed in vintage black and white on clean white paper and sent at no additional cost or expense to anyone. Be one of the first 100 givers and this one time, once in a lifetime offer will be included. Just send along 15.95 American for the nominal shipping and handling charges. Please be aware that, of course, these minimal handling fees are not True Giving, so don't be fooled and let that effect the amount of your normal Love Response. We want to keep it...honest here. Thank you.

Cool, Ya got moxie, tonto. :) Nice that Mrs. Ford accepted your offer graciously, too. And you made Time Mag! as "the impetuous young girl"! ;) I always felt she was one cool First Lady, in fact most of the Pres's wives seem to have more on the ball than their husbands. Maybe that should be an option - if the Mr. gets too weird, the Mrs. steps in. Dunno. Her husband Gerald Ford seemed a good man too, who responded to the challenge of his duties with dignity and intelligence. Thanks, I appreciate that tonto. Here's a short bio on Better Ford if anyone's interested. HERE.

themex, I don't know the group in Mexico at all that are using Geer's class, or the USA for that matter. I've been told by a few people and there's posts on GS to this effect, that he lives up in Maine somewhere and has a class he produced that is very similar to PFAL. People can get it by paying a yearly franchise fee, to use it. I was told several years ago it was about 4,000 bucks. If you pay the fee, you can get his Foundational class and run it for a year as many times as you want and I think - charge whatever you want for it if you do charge anything. I've never seen it or know anything about if first hand, I assume there's some kind of handshake arrangement or perhaps a contract to that effect. Maybe someone knows the specifics, but basically it's a user fee, and it sounded to me like a kind of franchise arrangement. You may already know that much, or more . (and for my part I think all these people who repackage PFAL and sell it for money are blood-sucking tics) You already know this - for a few years Chris Geer was giving copies of PFAL to people in the USA, maybe other countries too, since the Way in Europe had rights to it and other Way books and materials, so they weren't "illegal" copies, they were legal. There's a bunch of those copies floating around I've been told. Haven't seen any of them first hand but at the time I was told that they were being run and people were taking and/or retaking it from those copies. I think some people who wanted to keep going the way they had been but didn't want to stay associated with the Way and Craig Martindale saw it as a reasonable way to reorganize and use these other classes and books, etc as their central doctrine and teaching media. There's a lot of different "flavors" of Ex-Way groups in the U.S. as it sounds like there are in Mexico. My own personal decision for myself and my family was to get away from these guys and their various ministries and literally disconnect from the whole organization, formally and informally. That included Geer, The Way International, and any and all major and minor "offshoots" and splinter groups as they're called. Some of the people I would still consider friends, although they might not feel the same way about me, but I hold nothing personal against them. They did what they felt was good for them, that's their business. So did I, and it's my life to live as I see fit. Life goes on and if we cross paths again I hope it's under friendly circumstances. I don't trust Geer or the Way International and that's directed what I've done. Many people took what he wrote in Passing of the Patriarch as the truth, word for word. If you read it, there's no substance to it, little specific information. It's basically what Geer says VPW talked to him about and told him prior to his own death while visiting Geer. It amounts to a very dismal view of VPW in the last few years of his life, in which he is sick, weak and critical of nearly everyone he's worked with over the years and has little to say as to how to address any of those criticisms. If you believe Geer, VPW told him to watch the They Way of U.S. for a year and if things didn't get "better" then to come forward and pass on VPW's concerns, posthumously. The problem is that of all that I heard and read that came out of Geer there was never anything specific as to what could be done to make things right. If all it amounted to was pray, believe and get your heart right, fine. But he knew - he had to know what his actions were going to cause in the U.S. And if he didn't he's so dense as to be irresponsible. But as others have said, I believe The Way was an accident just waiting to happen. Geer became a flashpoint for awhile, and a new leader for some. But what happened in 86-89 was just a very unfortunate and ugly version of what would have happened anyway. I believe inevitably age, maturity and growth on the part of the people would have brought changes over time. The Way was a system that wasn't built to change, so it's rigid structure would have broken from the stress. That's my take and I believe it because that was already happening in our family and others that I knew. The specific comments Geer did make were rediculous. Anyone who was interested in doing good and actually making things better that they thought were wrong would never have handled it the way Geer did. So I don't trust him. He was like a bull in a china shop, with no goal or mission other than the stated one of passing on VPW's remarks and concerns. Whatever conversations he had one on one with the Trustees I can only imagine. Based on what I saw I doubt they were coherent enough to produce any real clear communication. You might wonder why, if I was involved at the time and felt this way, why I didn't mount some grand effort to save the Way. Reasons - 1 - information was so sporadic and incomplete, it took awhile to find out what had really happened, let alone was happening. For example - LCM was never supposed to take his initial conversations with Geer and make them public. He did and blew the whole Way International staff out of the water one night with no warning. I had a couple people call ME, in another state, the next week to see if I knew anything about what Geer was doing....??? Unbelievable. So it took most of 86 to for me try and assess what was possible, if anything. I was at 3 meetings at Way Headquarters and by the 3rd, I felt it was time to leave as nothing was getting done and Geer was so abusive as to be hateful. It was time for change. 2 - We had our fellowhip of about 10 people and our friends and family. I felt most responsible to those peopple, that knew me. That's the group I took care of, and I did my best. They've all come out very well, and even a couple have been back with the Way, from what I've been told. I hold no animosity towards them for that. They're good people, they have to make their own decisions. Oh my. Did this get long or what?????

I'd like to hear what Betty Ford was like? And did the polyester suit increase the receptivity? :D :D

oh the stow reez I could tell... the...horror......the horror....

Awww, cool Belle! I bet he'll love it. Christmas - gotta LOVE this time of year!

Aaah, the smell of blasphemy in the morning....muwhaaa! "There can be only one". Little known fact: I myself am a Vice President. Of our home. I serve under The President, AKA "My Wife" ( praised be Her Name ). Thus I can speak with some authority and experience on the duties, demands and rewards of the position. It's actually a pretty sweet job, I must admit. When things get out of hand, Questions being asked by the kids, plans, dates and arrangements under scrutiny, I always know the answer. "Where's your Mom....?" While The President doesn't deal with specifics, she is able to address Big Issues and keep things moving in the Right Direction while leaving me free to deal with important homeland issues, like The Garage (hallowed be that place of Storage), The Roof (may it remain over our heads) and philosophical questions like "Why Does The Furnace Heat The Rooms We're Not In More Than The Rooms We're In?" It's a good job if you're with the right company. I'm very happy. But foolishly, I digresss.

I think it's very understandable Belle. There was, in a phrase, "too much teaching". The whole culture of teach teach teach, listen listen listen rolled like a snowball, quickly picking up speed and buik over the years. Of course there was "do do do", too. But if all your time is spent in listen mode, when do you "do"? :huh: Well, there's always teach teach teach. :blink: It's a cycle of activity that's self rewarding, aggrandizing and self supporting. Not a lot else gets done. It's not hard to understand that isn't going to work for very long, and it didn't in the form it was set in.

Tom - Maybe the plan is to slooooowly add 3 or 4 VP's every year until there's a V.P. for every person in TWI. Done over long enough periods of time, no one will really notice. Eventually, each person will have their own personal Vice President. So yes! Maybe this is a real turn to a more caring and service minded TWI, as each person in TWI will someday have their onw personal "Vice Server". I'm sure there's lots of useful chores they can do, with a little supervision and encouragment of course. :P

Well, I agree excareeski. I don' t know about anyone else but I think I finally feel I'm beginning to start, if not actually wake up for once in my life, to at least sort of do that little snort you do first thing in the morning. Now - rickyo, call me stupid, call me - whatever, "Theodore the III" is fine. It would be a help if TWI would publish the specific areas their vice pres's handle. Others have commented to that. That way, those involved who care can know who does what. Generally speaking. When you have one, they do - whatever Vice Pres's do. That deserves some description, maybe. Could be, kind of sorta. But when you have 3, as themex originally noted - it would be nice to know who's doing what and if it's changed, what that means. Because if they're single handedly carrying the entire weight of the Way properties and interests on their shoulders, well it would be nice to know so anyone who cares could send them a card, like those that have the little kitten hanging from the tree branch and the caption reads "Hang in there!" Not necessary, no. And not even expected because as you know I'm sure TWI publishes very little about itself or what it does. I'm sure this has been handled in some tapes, or assigngment-year information. Right? A simple statement to the outside world would be nice. Kind of like "here who we are and here's what we do! and we're proud of it!" But there's not much of that. Which certainly gives the impression that - well, not much is going on or being done. No news is - no news. And thus the question, what about 3 VP's? It's sort of a cycle, goes round and round. Anyway, your information didn't add much for me, since I don't know 4 of the 5 names from a can of paint and wouldn't recognize them if they were trying to give me 20 bucks, and less about their background and what they do, don't do or would do if called upon to do. It.

I found these words in an online Thesaurus Rejoice. The bold words are ones I found interesting and of possible use in this context. agent, alternate, alternative, analogy, archon, backup, chancellor, change, changeling, chief executive, chief executive officer, comparison, copy, counterfeit, dean, deputy, double, dummy, equal, equivalent, ersatz, exchange, executive, executive director, executive officer, executive secretary, fake, fill-in, ghost, ghostwriter, imitation, locum tenens, magistrate, makeshift, management, managing director, metaphor, metonymy, next best thing, officer, official, personnel, phony, pinch hitter, prefect, president, prexy, provost, proxy, relief, replacement, representative, reserves, ringer, second string, secondary, secretary, sign, spares, stand-in, sub, substituent, substitute, substitution, succedaneum, superseder, supplanter, surrogate, symbol, synecdoche, the administration, third string, token, treasurer, understudy, utility player, vicar, vice-chairman, vice-chancellor, vice-consul, vice-director, vice-governor, vice-king, vice-legate, vice-master, vice-premier, vice-queen vice-regent, vice-warden, vicegerent, viceroy, warden John Garner, United States V.P to FDR, may be an appropriate role model here. He once described the office of the vice presidency as being "not worth a bucket of warm pi$$" - the quoted version was cleaned up to fill that bucket with "spit". He ran for Pres against FDR and joined the ticket as V.P. only after realizing he would lose the nomination to FDR. I have to assume that these 2nd tier underlings to the President of the Way must have important work to do not readily evident to the out-of-the-present-truth observer, in addition to being ready to step up to the throne in time of need. Gotta love 'em. Tom, although I haven't actually seen any of them, I'd guess Harry Potter....? Second guess - Clockwork Orange.