Abigail

I love it when people make references to David, Solomon, etc. to justify VPW as a man of God. First, David was NOT the man of God, spiritual leader of the people, nor was Solomon, though he was considered to be wise - they were Kings not prophets. Samuel was the prophet in David's time. VPW wanted to act like a King who owned all the women in the kingdom and make claims to being a prophet at the same time. Second, David lived in an entirely different culture from ours. In our culture, having multiple wives and harems is unacceptable. If David had sex with a 13 year old, it would have been acceptable in his time. In our time, I suspect even the VPW defenders would be appalled by such behavior from an adult man. (I am not saying VPW had sex with children - I am simply pointing out cultural differences). Mary gave birth to Jesus when she was what, 13 or 14? So, does that mean you think it is okay for 13 and 14 year old girls to be having babies in our culture and society? Third, David and his people paid a price for David's sins, starting with David's loss of his first son by Bathsheba and ultimately ending with captivity of the people, though that came a long time later. Perhaps, the bigger lesson in all of this, as could even be seen by many of the O.T. scriptures, is that we shouldn't follow after man, but after God. Many, many people in the Old Testament paid with their lives for following after man.

One interesting theory for the different names for God, is that the passages were written by different authors. This theory refers to the author who calls God Jehovah or more properly JWJH as "J" - and it is believed "J" was a woman. The author who refers to God as Elohim was a man, now referred to as "E". Yes, one can. Judaism wasn't always so hard-core monotheistic. In fact, you may recall that Rachel stole her father's idol. That is just one of many many instances within the Bible where Jews worshipped other Gods. You may still be seeing the OT and gospels through a TWI shaded lens - or at least a fundamentalist one. Not intended as a "way brain" slam - just posing something for you to consider. Even today, there are groups of Judaism that aren't strictly monotheistic. Also, a Jewish son could have a gentile father, so yes, a gentile name could be given. Equally likely, if a family is trying to assimilate, a gentile name would be given. When my mother's family immigrated to the U.S., several of my great grandmother's sister's names were changed. Likewise, my father's parents changed their last names upon arriving in the U.S. Why is it so hard to imagine that similar things could have taken place during biblical times?

Greasy, you want to teach Jewish history to me? Really? Yes, there were Jews who hated them. Yes there were those who thought it politically more expedient to assimilate, some of whom also may have hated them. There were also many many shades in between. You can read a story in the Bible - or a story from some other source. You will get A story - the story of whomever the characters are. They may be Jewish, but that doesn't mean they represent all or even a majority of the Jews. They may be Irish, but that doesn't mean they represent all or even a majority of the Irish. The dead sea scrolls are believed to have been written by the Essenes - they are one subgroup of many subgroups of Jews. Yes, they would have hated the Romans. Yes, they would have hated all who assimilated. They were very much an anti-assimilation group. There were similar groups in Eastern Europe too. Likewise there were groups who thought assimilation was the answer in Eastern Europe. Yes, the rebellion did eventually take place. But again, that does not mean there weren't plenty of people who were willing to assimilate. BTW, the only reason the rebellion finally occured was because the Jews were no longer allowed to practice their religion freely. Prior to that, a large number of Jews were content to leave things be. And finally, yes, pronunciation of names does become transliterated. Some names get changed altogether.

From my studies thus far, it is pretty much a Christian only doctrine. Even the Jewish people do not teach the "fallen man" theology.

Some Jews hated them. Others were content to assimilate.

uh No. But, perhaps that is because the bible didn't exist when the scriptures were written. The OT existed prior to Jesus' life and death, in scroll form, but it wasn't a household item. Things were mostly passed down orally back then. Some of the males who were willing and able could study scrolls, but they were hardly a majority. Even today, there are numerous scriptures from Biblical times that never made it into the Bible.

Hey Bumpy, Not sure I can even begin to guess at what your point was with the video, or how it was supposed to be used as the basis for an intelligent discussion. However, as one of the Ashkenazi "Jews in Amerika", I'm willing to give it a shot. I suspect, however, this is not the forum for it. If you would like to start a thread in politics or take it to private message, I'm game.

If the defendant is dead there may no longer be a criminal case. but there most certainly can be a civil case against the estate.

Damn Johniam, I don't know what women did a number on your heart and mind, but you should no more blame all women for the hurt you sustained than a woman should blame all men for hers. Personally, I have no need to have authority over a man/or men's money. I am perfectly capable of earning, managing, and yes sometimes even mismanaging my own money. So, you can keep yours, I don't need it.

The Cinderalla Complex. I think that is the name for that desire to be rescued, when it is taken to the extreme and acted upon over and over again anyway. We learned it from Disney movies and romance novels. Unfortunately, it has been my experience that those who want to rescue a woman usually turn out to be scum. They rescue you and then when you are on your feet and no longer need rescuing, they have to beat you up so they can rescue you all over again.

Here in Michigan, Hillsdale I think, an 18 year old was elected Mayor! I am a board member of the school my kids attend. I think it would be very interesting to have a student on the board. Good or bad would depend on the student. My concern is that idealism would overrule common sense and/or practicality.

What Judaism teaches and what I believe is that it was never God's design for women to be subservient or submissive to man, rather the two were to be partners, equals. Sarah spoke up to Abraham and God told Abraham to listen to his wife. Rebecca also was spiritually sharper than Jacob, when it came to which of the two children (Esau and Jacob) should inherit the promise. There are many, many examples biblically, where it was the women who was correct. The idea of a female president doesn't scare me at all. I won't vote for Hillary because I don't trust her, but I would vote for a women if I believed she represented my views.

I hope your day is a delightful one!!

Thank you, everyone. I finally did it. I'm not over the hill, but I have reached the top. The view is pretty nice from up here. :lol: My sister gave me lilacs - my favorite flower. Sushi gave me an iPod Shuffle, the toy I have been dreaming of for months now. I no longer have to listen to the kids gripe about my music, and I no longer have to listen to theirs. :B)

Go getter Escape Artist high time roller love bug

Preface, I read the story but did not watch the video. My impression is that this is a dog with health problems (I didn't see the dogs estimated age anywhere, but there were references to a boney growth and a tumor). A sick dog or a dog that is in pain usually won't eat very well, thus leading to malnutrition. It is entirely possible that the animal control angency investigated the owners and found they were not abusive, and thus requested this woman to give the dog back. It is entirely possible the only "wrong doing" on the part of the owners was to be emotionally attached and unable to reach the decisions that it was time to put the dog down. I can understand that, it was a tough decision for us when we had to do it too. If someone had come to our home and seen Scrappy, he would have looked malnourished and sick. He was. He was also well cared for and much loved for his entire 16 plus years of life. There is simply not enough information to form an opinion. The media has a tendency to be onesided these days. Such stories sell, and thus make money.

and les us not forget Mrogan Le Fay aka Morganna. I love the stories of both Roy.

sauteed artichoke hearts 2 cans artichoke hearts (can use the ones in the seasoned water or plain) 1 medium onion diced a mess of garlic cloves chopped, smashed, or however you prefer them splash of olive oil saute and enjoy :)

lol He'll eat sauteed artichoke hearts, but when I buy the whole artichoke he says its just too much work! :) I on the other hand, have a much more sophisticated palate, and will eat both spinach and eggplant.

I am trying to reduce my grocery bill, and still eat somewhat healthy well-balanced meals. So I'm looking for ideas. Tonight I made stuffed cabbage (a LOT of it!!!) The ingredients probably cost about $15 and it will feed our family of four 4 - 5 meals. Two large heads of cabbage 3 lbs ground beef 1 1/2 cups rice 2 eggs two onions pulverized in the bullet a mess of garlic cloves pulverized in the bullet a couple handfuls of fresh parsely pulverized in the bullet fennel seeds rosemary red pepper dill week salt to taste One large can tomato sauce two smaller cans diced tomatos Basically, I par boil the cabbage and pull the layers of leafs off as they soften, placing them in a colander to cool mix the ground beef, uncooked rice, eggs, onion, garlic, parsely, and seasoning together then roll in the softened cabbage leaves pour tomatoe sauce, one can diced tomatoes and 3 cups of water in the bottom of a VERY LARGE roasting pan (one that comes with a lid is best). roll a small handful of the meat mixture into an oblong shape and then roll cabbage leaf around it and place in pan seam side down. Layer these next to each other and on top of each other until you couldn't possibly fit another one into the pan. Poor the other can of diced tomatos on top with about 1/2 cup water. bake on 300 for about 1 - 1/2 hours with the lid on. Back another 1/2 with the lid off. Its a bit of work - but well worth it, and it can freeze the leftovers so you don't have to make it that often. ________________________________________________________________________________ ________ Still cooking - - mushroom beef barely soup - without the mushrooms cause Sushi won't eat them Cost is roughly $12 and I expect to get 2 - 3 meals for our family of 4 (more if the kids don't like it :) ) 1 roast - am guessing around 3 lbs (Ox tails are really good for this soup also, but they cost a lot more) 1 package manechevitz (sp) pea and barely dried soup mix (throw away the seasoning package - their seasoning is gross) 1 1/2 - 2 cups barley (depending on whether you want it thick or thin) two turnips diced two parsnips diced a package or two of diced fresh mushrooms if your family will actually eat them two onions well diced a mess of chopped garlic cloves 3 - 4 beef bullion cubes 7 cups water throw it all in the slow cooker til its done.

1) When I die, I want to die like my grandfather--who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car." --Author Unknown 2) Advice for the day: If you have a lot of tension and you get a headache, do what it says on the aspirin bottle: "Take two " and "Keep away from children." --Author Unknown 3) "Oh, you hate your job? Why didn't you say so? There's a support group for that. It's called EVERYBODY, and they meet at the bar." --Drew Carey 4) "The problem with the designated driver program, it's not a desirable job, but if you ever get sucked into doing it, have fun with it. At the end of the night, drop them off at the wrong house." --Jeff Foxworthy 5) "If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there is a man on base." --Dave Barry 6) "Relationships are hard. It's like a full time job, and we should treat it like one. If your boyfriend or girlfriend wants to leave you, they should give you two weeks' notice. There should be severance pay, the day before they leave you, they should have to find you a temp." --Bob Ettinger 7) "My Mom said she learned how to swim when her parents took her out in the lake and threw her off the boat. I said, 'Mom, they weren't trying to teach you how to swim.'" --Paula Poundstone 8) "A study in the Washington Post says that women have better verbal skills than men. I just want to say to the authors of that study: "Duh." --Conan O'Brien 9) "Why does Sea World have a seafood restaurant?? I'm halfway through my fish burger and I realize, Oh my God.... I could be eating a slow learner." --Lynda Montgomery 10) "I think I know how Chicago got started. Bunch of people in New York said, 'Gee, I'm enjoying the crime and the poverty, but it just isn't cold enough. Let's go west.'" --Richard Jeni 11) "If life were fair, Elvis would be alive and all the impersonators would be dead." --Johnny Carson 12) "Sometimes I think war is God's way of teaching us geography." --Paul Rodriguez 13) "My parents didn't want to move to Florida , but they turned sixty and that's the law." --Jerry Seinfeld 14) "Remember in elementary school, you were told that in case of fire you have to line up quietly in a single file line from smallest to tallest. What is the logic in that? What, do tall people burn slower?" --Warren Hutcherson 15) "Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same." --Oscar Wilde 16) "Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." --Mark Twain 17) "Our bombs are smarter than the average high school student! At least they can find Afghanistan ." --A. Whitney Brown 18) "You can say any foolish thing to a dog, and the dog will give you a look that says, 'My God, you're right! I never would've thought of that!'" --Dave Barry 19) Do you know why they call it "PMS"? Because "Mad Cow Disease" was taken. --Unknown, presumed deceased (perhaps for good reason!) 20) "Everybody's got to believe in something. I believe I'll have another beer."

ROFLMAOPMP - oh, so true, so true! :P

Thanks Purple Cow!!!! I haven't had time to try it yet, but I am hoping to in the very near future.

O brother. Mark has nowhere defended any sort of "doctrine" regarding sex with children. It does appear very much to me that he has put forth some effort to try to understand what went wrong and why it went wrong. Mark, I'm sorry I ever came back to this topic. Perhaps another day.

Thanks for responding. I'm still not convinced it is a homosexual problem - there could be many factors with respect to age, starting with accessibility. Parents tend to be more watchful of younger children. Around the age of 10, they tend to give them more freedom and less supervision. 10 year olds usually don't have the body parts of say, a 13 or 14 year old either. But I don't necessarily think the problem is simply about chastity either - because the problem exists in religions that don't require chastity. Another reason I find the stats so interesting, I guess.