Dot Matrix

Okay Dove, You do sound as though you held dear to "It is written" but you seem to be kind of judging those that were in the corps long after 1974. Perhaps in your portion (time frame) of the corps, leadership still rubbed elbows with you and were kind. They may have listened to you. I was also around in the early days and worked moving the word before corps ever got there. It was a wonderful life! I regularly saw people like V!nce F etc and worked on limb staff. I was over some corps being on staff (in my appointed area) so I was involved on a daily basis. But nothing like those great early days EVER happened once I went in rez. Nothing. Things had soured. There was an almost cast system in place. And although I knew R@lph he would not even say hello in the hallway. Later he told me that he was told if he spoke to any of us either WE would be tossed out or he would -- I forget which. AT HQS. although VF and I had laughs on the field -- you would have thought I was walking posion ivy when I approached him. So Dove, although your history is in the early roots and impressive, the corps you speak of -- and the corps I was in years later were completely different. And then those that came after me were even in a worse state from all the communications I have read. So, back in the day I was also HEARD. I taught and shared the stage with an impressive line up. But by the time I got into the corps it bore no resemblance to the wonderland of working together I had previously experienced. IT is unfortunate that we know what we have lived and we can learn from others about what they lived, but never REALLY live their lives. You were around and in glory in the glory years. I know those years. They were not a reflection of the years to come. So, albeit TRUTH what you are saying and your truth of what you have lived, it may not be many of the other posters truth. For instance, my truth is that VPW walked around with a woody looking for young girls to plug. But there are people here who did not experience that. Does that invalidate my truth? No. OR there are posters here who wanted to sleep with Craig or service VPW -- for whatever reason they saw it as a privilege. I cannot take away or remake their memories and convince them that VP and Craig were charlatans. So, from your perspective it seems (as was my perspective in the early years) that all leaders were accessible. And that most would HEAR you. But things changed. Woman were once ordained. That changed. Once I was able to walk up to anyone and speak, that changed as well. And if you were not there at that time – it is hard to believe how difficult and crazy it became. I think in some of your posts they may come across hard on people. And so the natural response is “you were not there.” And you have shown us you were VERY involved. You walked the walk. You were heard and listen to “great men” at that time. But that is not the experience of some of the other people. Surely being as bold and reasonable as I can see from your record, you can understand that can’t you? I know the time period of which you speak. I also know the time period from which some others are sharing. And there is a period of which I have no knowledge. Those that came in under Craig and never knew VPW. Or never took PFAL but Craig’s class. I think the perspectives here are from different TWI experiences in different eras (or even areas). Cathy and you are both right from your different vantage points. It is just those vantage points are now heated and seem as though “it was this way” “no, it was this way” rather than a discussion of “How was it for you?” The years and changes in leadership made people’s experiences very different at times. One person has a family member known to be passed around with pleasure so that posters’ perspective is always that the sexual attention was a desired feature in most TWI women. He has not been able to get passed his era and his perspective. ‘Cause that is his truth. Can you guys see what I am saying? Depending on the year and situation -- you are both correct. Neither is lying or distorting facts. IT is not a toe to toe battle where one is lying and one is not. You are both correct.

The way I am reading HCW's post is not that he condones abuse. There are crazy people everywhere. There are crazy abusive Lutherans or Catholics. So, because a person with abusive tendencies became a leader and dragged his personal "abuse problems" along with him -- we should be able to pick through the PERSON who went crazy and the organization. This is a fair and good point. HE is saying he worked there and did not see a policy. BUT yes, they had many unwritten policies -- like friggin adultery or servicing a MOG being okay. So I get Minicorps as well. And because they drilled us with obeying leadership and following their examples -- an abusive crazy foot would be mimicked and followed as "living policy" because all the "other" teachings supported following the leader -- be he a maniac or not

So, yeah White dove your point is made. They fed us crap. But we opened our mouths and swallowed. And nobody on this earth could ever make me hit someone with a 2X4

Whitedove: I am reading your posts. I have always found you to be a loving man with an abundance of courage. Here is the thing IMO. Yes, we were told to always check the scriptures. But did you ever buck the very leaders telling you to always check the scriptures? Now, maybe you did as I said I have always found you to be loving and courageous. But not all were like you. And the corps took the courage out of many of us as we were drained of our guts on a regular basis. I think YOU may be a different sort of a guy. Perhaps you have the backbone I wish I continued to have as I was being filleted. When I read your posts, I wish you were there, in the corps at Rome City. Perhaps you would have been exactly what they needed. A prophet type to stand up and really declare "IT is written" As punked out and cowardly as this will sound on my behalf --- I wanted to be that person. I wanted to challange. Each time I did, and I did, I was called "on the carpet". I was punished. I was told to shut up, I was ridiculed to silence. Not something I am proud of. I wish I would have stood up and declared it is written. I did to VP about the adultery/sex crimes stuff. I went to M Fort to speak with him about things that were not right. I went to John L$$N, I went to many of them. Thing is they were not willing to receive it. So, that is when I should have seen although it was preached by many, it was observed by few -- and I should have left. I stayed too long many of us did. But I waited for someone like you speak of, someone to stand up and tell Craig (or whomever) ENOUGH IS ENOUGH -- It is written... I tried and failed to be that person. Perhaps if you had been there you would have made a difference. I am sure you did on the field. Or maybe we would have been friends and talked about how we tried to change things but couldn't. Yeah, we are each responsible before God on how far we allowed things to go. Knowing something was not right but continuing down the path... And they are resposible for taking us down a path they knew to be wrong. Many judged Mrs VP for staying with VP and for giving up seeing her kids etc. But many people gave their kids over to bullsh 1t. She is just one of many. I spoke the scriptures when P@t POW**L was twisting "abundant sharing" He screamed me down at a corps meeting making me a joke. I didn't care. I was embarressed but wht I said was truth. That was the LAST corps meeting or WAY meeting I ever attended. I knew they were the joke and they were wrong. I also knew I could not change them. So, I changed me. Somewhere these "leaders" stopped preaching God's word and began to teach crap. I stopped eating crap. God's love tasted different then crap and I missed it. Now to hear from those kids is horrible. I am sorry I did not walk on stage and say what I felt in my heart.

Oldies Cool story

Happy Birthday!!!!!!!

kids of the corps I am sorry for what happened to you. Rome City was the worst campus I went to, IMO. It was cold, mean and like being in the military. I am very sorry

I used to love her music up until she named her kid GOD. Then, I liked her music but became a closet fan

I was there in 1982 maybe early 83. I saw the spoons. I also saw the spoon use on the field with the 4th corps. What I saw on the field did not seem abusive at all, a tap on the leg or whatever, rather than a spanking

WG Rifles at 2? Loaded?

Happy Birthday!

Hey, ya know when Vince's Dad died it was an attack on a Man of God. When you leave the Way and someone dies it is because you left the protection. Mmmmm People die. And TWI taps into that fear to demand loyality. What a heartless group of idiots. Sorry mini-corps, you guys had it rough

Bow's daughter is really a pretty child. The dark hair and light eyes give her that Courtney Cox look. Ron G's son looked a lot like her, they could have been cousins. He was a nice kid -- who knows maybe someday they will grow up and date! Rascal has 7, no I am not kidding. They are all very cute and well behaved as well. I have never seen so many kids in one place and there was not one fight. Bow's dog Scamps and Sara were playing oin the couch at Rascals and it was sweet. Bow, Sara spent two weeks at work with me in a box lid and a very soft blanket she curled up in and sleot! The satin comforter sounds like such a step up! She must feel like a princess. White Dove - I am glad Lucca has you and Sara has Bow and little Bow.

Back to the first post Oh for God's sake. People get called names all the time. IT is my understanding that you can call anyone anything unless it falls under slander. For instance I can call someone a stupid idiot. BUT if I say he is a theif -- then that can go to court under federal law as it is damaging. People are called "fat" there is a song out called whit and nerdy to which I AM OFFENDED. I am offended by clubs which do not let me in because I am white. There is a BLACK atty's group which meets and they are given "Food" for their meetings by state funds. Now, we have many black atty's and judges so it is not necessary. I do not think calling people names is nice, but unless it is damaging to one's reputation -- stay out of the courts. Blacks call each other that word in interviews, in conversation and in song. I am insulted by hearing it and it is unfair to have a double standard where "whitey" gets penalized legally for it. IT IS NOT RIGHT. IT IS HURTFUL. But people call each other names all the time, but worthy of a lawsuit? Has anyone heard Mencia? His live acts are unbleieveable and he uses the N word. To take it to court? What is next? We better pray it gets thrown out. BTW did you know giving xomeone the finger in Georgia is illegal? I was always doing it when cut off while driving. My atty friend told me I could go to jail as it is an obscene gesture

I am glad everyone is home. Bow told me Sara acts as if she has always been there or something, which let's me know she is comfortable. Nice to meet everyone. .

Or you could name him Beau (Bow) cause the white on his chest(wan't there white?) can be like a tie a BOW tie. After BOW here at the spot.... I duuno but Butt ugly kind of hurts my feelings for him. By the way, did you know at Foster and Smith you can buy the stuff in heartworm meds and do it yourself cheaper? Trying to save you money -- as you have so many

Yes Rascal, Sara is one of the sweet souls. When I pulled into work on that DARK morning and saw this little slip of a dog shivering on the steps well... I broke inside that someone could leave her. She is a tender soul and I loved her bunches but the husband would not let me have a 7th dog. Thanks for the food; I appreciate your warmth and kindness. My friend is a wonderful person, her son is in med school after graduating from Princeton, her other son graduated from Notre Dame and is an Attorney. And her daughter is studying abroad in Australia. Jan is very down to earth and accomplished at the same time. She is a caring, detailed attorney who used to be a college professor. When I first met her family I was shocked to see how they had all made something of themselves, for a minute -- as an x-cult member I felt very small and stupid. But she never let me go that route. I am glad she got to meet you all. She was in a bad mood and said she had lost faith in people. Then, remarked how nice all of you were. She said BOW was a sharp lady and very very genuinely nice. She said Ron had a great heart and she said what made your home sweet was the heart you gave it. When she went to the little waterfall in your yard she said she felt a peace. She said she believed it was from you putting your heart into that area. Jan thought the area itself "felt" blessed. The dog name I said for the Brindle was Patches. I have a brindle named Patches.

I just got home and I am exhausted. How wonderful it was to meet Bow, Ron and Mr and Mrs. Rascal! Then, the well behaved kids! Sara the dog will have a good life with Bow's daughter as her Mom. She has a lot of love to give. Well, I need to get some sleep

Hey! I will be at the hotel at 4:00 pm today If you can adjust your schedule it would be helpful. That way I can get to my next destination earlier as they are complaining. (Unless I just blow them off -- step mom is an ogar) Thank you I am PMimg you my work number, we are busy today, but please try to confirm THANK YOU

I just posted and it vanished Okay, it is back

Ya know Sprawled- Many of those idiots were the loosers in school and business. They found TWI and fell into the Bully roles very easily. So, I will join you -- Jeff - you were an @zzhole - You are full of sh1t, and a pathrtic looser. To think you push the buttons of severe depression, loneliness, or suicide in the people for whom you were "responsible", is sickening. Haha we are still here and better than ever. Go to hell(o) - it should be a short trip for you. And yes Sprawled an ordained 4th corps told me that. It was better to sacrifice one -- etc. She was actually speaking of one of the girls on the site I am posting for you to see And a GREAT early corps confirmed it was a believed code among the secret society, when he told me what happened to me was calculated as was what happened to this girl as well. See what they were hiding? Can't argue with people trying to hide these horrible secrets. They make you feel ashamed, dirty, crazy small and worthless... This site has been brought up but here this will show you some of how they thought: http://www.uia.net/~messiah7/ltr_marsha.htm http://www.uia.net/~messiah7/cultsthe.htm

:)

Here is one where I needed a sign. I waitresses while in the corps. And I really liked it. Anyway, I had this guy come in and as I looked past my pad of paper, on which I wrote the orders, I saw his guitar strap around his neck and running down the front of him. So, I say, half looking at it, "nice guitar strap. Do you play?" He kind of chokes. I take a closer look and see he has prosthesis for an arm. Looked plastic and the strap ran down to hold it in a bent position (like a sling would) Boy, did I need a sign. I am asking him if he is a guitar player and he has a plastic arm. I felt terrible Sudo Surely you meet the crazies in your field. Who was your weirdest?

Abigail So she was saying toasted? George - dunno I am not going to try it and find out.

Yeah, to me too.