satori001

Originally posted by Second James: I get what you're saying Satori, as my initial post does reflect alot of my past TWI mindset..I DO BELIEVE that God designed people in certain ways for our benefit..I don't believe that woman was designed for woman..nor man for man. Otherwise we'd see encouraging words in God's word about that being desired by God..instead we see words like "abomination" etc. Well, "design." Interesting word. Your friend wasn't designed to be an abomination, but there she goes, abominating like a house afire. So it must be free will, over-riding that God-given autopilot that makes us heterosexual. So yeh...guilty as charged I suppose...hers has been a miserable life (according to her words)..lack of any kind of long term relationships and much more... I don't doubt she's miserable, or she wouldn't say so. And maybe gender confusion, if that's what it is, contributes to her unhappiness. I question whether a few bible verses qualifies you to make that diagnosis, or to attempt a "cure." I live in the good ole US of A & can believe what I want to believe. I believe the lesbianism is detremental to her..she speaks of the time when she "fell" for the bait & tried it out & then continued in it. Your have the right to believe in pink elephants, 2J. Is that a license to counsel? Does it make you an expert on gender identity, sexual assignments, addictions, possibly abuse? You're over your head. If there's a TWI mindset, that's it in a nutshell - hubris. A little knowledge and big "believing" will cure anybody and anything. Life had a way of disabusing our needier "babes in the Word" of their illusions, but never us. We just blamed them (or the devil) and moved on. We never thought of the harm we might have done. God always "covered," whatever the hell that meant. It felt good to tell ourselves so, that's what mattered. I am not to judge..but dammit, its what I think & there's a time when my eternal judge will straighten me out, if I'm wrong..in the mean time here's this gal FINALLY seeking something other than what she was caught up in. I'm sorry folks..I just see it with my way blinders on I guess, or Bible Blinders on...sorry Rascal...sorry Satori Is it possible this woman just needs a friend? You call her a friend. Maybe you are. Would you still be her friend, this "lesbian" woman, if you didn't think you were doing "God's work?" If she told you she "took the bait," I think she wants to please you. She wants to please you because you've been kind to her. I think your kindness has strings attached, the necessity that she conforms to your expectations, regardless of what's going on inside of her. That's the TWI mindset, and it puts you in an untenable position. After all, if she refuses to change, she's no longer just "being herself." Once you've shown the "Way," she's rejecting God. And you will sever those strings and let her fall, because you can accept sinners who are still lost, but not those who will not repent, once "found." That's the TWI mindset. My hope at this point is to see her reconsiled with her creator & her savior..sorry I started this thread & sorry I asked for advise..dumb me. I don't doubt you're sorry. You're saying, as TWI would, that God cannot accept, nor therefore love, a lesbian. You're saying she has the power to deconstruct and redesign what the Creator has made in His own image, and that she is therefore obliged to save herself by creating herself back into His image, or to remain "abominable" and lost. It's no wonder to me that Jesus, despite his great love and wisdom, responded to the Pharisees with nothing less than wrath.

Here's a website where they will test your hearing for you. It's not meant to replace a doctor's exam but it will give you a "curve" to compare your hearing at different frequencies, left and right. http://www.onlinehearing.com/html/home.html Be sure to adjust your computer audio levels before taking the test. (It's easy: double-click the little speaker at the bottom right, set Master Volume to maximum & Wave to 50%) Headphones are recommended because it tests left and right ears separately. The test lasts about 12 minutes. It's free. You'll need to register providing email address and some basic info, and they will send a password to that address. Your login is your email address.

By the way, I probably would have taken it at one time.

That's more experience than I have with Momentus, but I think the analogies fit what I've read and understood about the "traning" - about what contexts participants may impose upon it. I'm sure Momentus would not define itself that way."Surviving" an ordeal is a status symbol. "I was there," it says. What suppositions have I made about the group's leadership? My posts have only concerned the experience of Momentus trainees, some of whom were former TWI leadership.

By the way, I believe that ordeals, tryouts, bootcamp, and even hazing (within limits) may be necessary for specific reasons. Put the right person in those circumstances and the results will be appropriate. The wrong person will be subject to "abuse."

Is the Momentus organization as evangelistic as it seems, or was that the influence of CES and John in particular? The apparent zeal to "fix" the Christian world may have ridden roughshod over finer considerations such as an individual's emotional health. Momentus is/was clearly a rite of initiation, a tribal ordeal, basically a hazing, for some (or many) of its graduates. The emotional maturity of those individuals is questionable, if only because of that view. To use a sports analogy, it's a tryout to see who makes the first string and who warms the bench. Does "Athletes of the Spirit" sound familiar? Same attitude. To use a military analogy, it's boot camp, where they break you and then rebuild you. (I've never been to boot camp, but testimony abounds.) That view would be consistent with the steroidally competitive personalities among certain TWI leadership. ex10, I'm not saying this was your perspective, nor am I saying this was the sole reason for anyone's participation or endorsement. People are complex. The man who leads you to the well to quench your thirst may have also added something to the water. Every man is justified in his own eyes. Isn't that how it goes?

It's not a stretch to guess that a few among us may be in the early stages of Mrs. Wierwille's affliction. Scary, when you think about it. It's thought that certain nutrients can halt the loss (a component of curry, for example). Be tested. You might experiment with cutting out certain elements of your diet, to discover a possible allergy to the food, or drink, or an additive in it. Maybe there's a deficiency (vitamin, mineral, protein...) somewhere too. A nutritionist who counsels clients might offer some additional insight. Fatigue can also deprive the mind of focus. Current research shows insufficient sleep can be harmful. Just a few thoughts. I wish you well.

2J, your first post: From your next posts, which I find wholly inconsistent with the first: Yes, I am confused 2J. This woman has "physical ailments" and all you seem to be focused on is her sexuality. What's up with that, doc? And you go so far as to say that your first post refers to her "ailments" whatever they are, when it plainly doesn't.I do not think you are a bad person, 2J, nor are you unintelligent, however your stated best intentions seem inconsistent, if not antithetical, to agape love as I have come to understand it, and your stated objective is inconsistent from one post to the next. You don't want to heal her, you want to "fix" her. That is what I think.

I haven't read this entire thread, but what I've read reminds me of a line I heard today. It might have been a line from a novel, or it may have been said by a pharmaceutical researcher. Doesn't matter. The question is asked, "Will there eventually be a drug for everything?" The reply is, "Yes, but not for everyone." The answer means there will never be a single pill that works for everyone. Whatever the ailment, whatever the cure, some will see dramatic improvement, even miraculous results. Some will see no results. Some will have a bad reaction, and perhaps die. In a way, Momentus is such a pill.

ex10, I haven't made up my mind yet. What are your thoughts on Momentus??

Seriously 2J, has this woman asked you to fix her? I believe the question has already been posed, but you saw fit to answer me first. She may not realize your "helpfulness" extends to such big plans for her.

Yeah, well I should have guessed you'd already tried chickens. What about goats?

The digressions are worth the detour.

Let's just say I think you're meddling, not ministering, and a friendship with such an agenda is not a friendship.

JJ, what we got to understand when you see that lesbo is it's Satan looking you right in the eye. That's right. Hallelujah brother, we know the truth, don't we? And we know it was blood that cleansed us from our sins, brother, amen. So keeping that in mind, here's what you do... Get yourself seven live chickens, of the tribe of Purdue, in the cellar or attic of your house. And after sunset you fast over them for several hours, contemplating nature, Adam and Eve, and the right way to "do it," and how they showed us by their wonderful example in the garden, up until Eve wrapped her fingers around that big serpent and took a bite of the apple and the ensuing ruckus got them kicked out of Eden. Wait up late until Satan thinks it's safe to come around, like around midnight, with the lights turned down, and you call him out. "Heeeeere, Satan." "Heeeeeeere, Satan." And when he shows up, quick you take a small chainsaw (gas is better, cause it's loud and really gives the birds a big sendoff) and you just send those chickens to the Lord, amen! All that blood is sure to scare the bejesus out of old Satan, because he won't really know whose it is, it being dark and all, and he'll be in the next town before you can say, "There's wonderful power in the blood!" Then, when you're still all covered in the blood and feathers of righteousness, oh hallelujah! you go to that "fine person's" house and tell her you have helped her deliverance along, and ask if she is startin' to feel frisky. If not, simply repeat the exercise. If she is... wink, wink. Delivered! I know, I know, a little too spiritual for some people.

People are nuts.

Go Mississippi! Let's see... red state or blue state, which will the press give more attention?

Not a bad first effort.

Looks like the eternal Fountain of Leaving Wayfers will be temporarily open for the payment of respects. I notice the "bio" left out the part where the "Ministry" had black-listed Mrs. Wierwille's family during her declining years, depriving her of their company, and later, sent her packing, leaving the ailing Mrs. and her surviving children to their own devices, while Mrs. Rivenbark and her toadies lived (and continue to live) fat and happy on the property Dorothea's husband had given to the Ministry. Who can blame them for the omission? I'd be profoundly ashamed too. Oh wait. They don't experience shame. Well, any sociopath knows a bad PR move when she sees it. Right Rosalie?

Who is watching Todd?

Quoth the sheep.

Bon voyage, little buddy.

To me it was just a crafty story well told. It was like the exercise where you become aware that you are aware. Then you become aware that you are aware that you are aware... In a sense, the movie pulls you right through time, so you gain the sense, the "experience," of being in two places at once. Does it mean anything? No. It may have moral implications. If John becomes a time-replicated plurality of people, is his wife guilty of polygamy? Important stuff like that. I also think it's "deep," if not too meaningful, and full of ambiguity, if not moral uncertainty either. Right? Thanks for your thoughts! If you see it again, or reconsider your opinions, c'mon back.

Michael Brecker is 56 and an internationally renowned jazz musician. As a result of his harmonic innovations, Michael is among the most studied contemporary instrumentalists in music schools throughout the world today. Michael has recorded and performed with a virtual Who’s Who of hundreds of Jazz and pop giants including McCoy Tyner, Herbie Hancock, James Taylor, Chick Corea, Chet Baker, George Benson, Quincy Jones, John Lennon, Charles Mingus, Joni Mitchell, Aerosmith, Paul Simon, Wynton Marsalis, Frank Sinatra, James Brown, Bruce Springsteen, Steely Dan, Pat Metheny, Billy Joel and Elton John. As a leader and co-leader of The Brecker Brothers (with Randy Brecker) and Directions in Music (with Herbie Hancock and Roy Hargrove), Michael has received 11 Grammy Awards-more than any saxophonist. For further information, go to http://www.michaelbrecker.com LETTER FROM SUSAN BRECKER: PLEASE SEND THIS TO AS MANY PEOPLE YOU KNOW Dear Family and Friends, My husband, Michael Brecker, has been diagnosed with MDS (myelodysplastic syndrome) and it's critical that he has a bone marrow or blood stem cell transplant (which has nothing to do with embryonic stem cells). The initial search for a donor, including Michael’s siblings and children, has not resulted in a suitable match. We now hope to have as many people tested as possible that share a similar genetic background as my husband. There are some important points to understand concerning this process: 1. The screening involves only a blood test. It can be done very easily at a donor center of the National Marrow Donor Program [NMDP]. The blood test identifies your HLA tissue type. The cost for the test is generally $40 to $95 depending on the donor center and the lab that completes the test. After this initial testing all medical expenses are paid for by the patient or the patient’s insurance. Go to http://www.marrow.org or call 1-800-MARROW-2 to find the donor center nearest you. In NYC, you can make an appointment with Frazier at the NY Blood Bank [212-570-3441 / 310 East 67th Street]. The test is $40. If it’s difficult to make it to a blood center, private kits are available from Tepnel Life Codes [800-915-3695]. Order the “HLA [A][DR]” kit for $140. You will need to have a small vial of blood drawn. Indicate to Tepnel that your test is for “Michael Brecker” and they will know to whom to forward your results. 2. As a volunteer donor, you are never legally obligated to donate. A late decision not to donate, however, can be life-threatening to a patient and among the most disheartening news a family can ever receive. Consider your decision to be a donor carefully. Thanks. 3. Should you be selected as a potential donor for Michael or any other patient, please understand that there have been tremendous advances in "bone marrow transplants" and the term itself can be misleading. At major cancer centers, blood stem cells can, in nearly all instances, be harvested directly from your blood. A donor is simply connected to a machine that separates the needed cells before the donor’s blood reenters his/her system. On occasion such cells may have to be harvested directly from your bone marrow. All the necessary precautions are taken to ensure the donor’s well-being and safety. In the event you’re asked to donate blood stem cells, a volunteer will first receive a thorough physical examination—at no cost to him or herself. 4. A match for Michael would be most likely come from those of Eastern European Jewish descent. If you or anyone you know are in this category please make a special effort to immediately get tested. Please also note that testing is free for minority groups at NMDP blood centers. Ultimately, you would be doing something not just for Michael, but for so many more whom are in a similar situation as my husband. 5. You are now part of our internet-based drive for donor testing. If everyone who receives this email can motivate a bunch of their friends to get tested, and those friends then forward the email to get their friends to get tested, we will have rapidly expanded the pool of potential donors. I urge all of you to get tested AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. Finally, any local National Marrow Donor Program donor center can assist in organizing a drive for Michael, although it would be desirable if you can get a large group, e.g. a synagogue, to sponsor it. The “Gift of Life,” an organization whose mission is to increase the representation of the Jewish people in the bone marrow donor pool will test you for free when part of a donor drive organized through “Gift of Life.” For further information call 561.988.0100 http://www.giftoflife.org. There exist other organizations that have a similar mission for African Americans, Asians, Hispanics, etc. Whatever your roots, please get tested to assist others! Should you have any questions about any of this, do not hesitate to get in touch with Michael's management office at 212.302.9200 or PLEASE REFER TO THE FAQ BELOW THIS LETTER info@michaelbrecker.com Thank you so much for your love and support. We are so grateful. Susan ox FAQs ABOUT STEM CELL TRANSPLANTS Susan Brecker’s heartfelt plea elicited an outpouring of support for Michael—and an outpouring of questions. As there is outdated and conflicting information on the web concerning the stem cell transplant process that can assist Michael and so many others, we assembled a list of frequently asked questions—a hybrid of material found throughout the web in addition to new information. Before contacting Michael’s management office with your questions, please review the following. Thank you for your support. Q01: What is a bone marrow or blood stem cell transplant? A: It’s a potentially life-saving treatment for patients with MDS, leukemia, lymphoma, and other blood diseases. The transplanted healthy stem cells from a donor replace a patient's unhealthy blood cells that have been destroyed by chemotherapy. Q02: Are these the same stem cells about which there exists so much controversy? A: No. Those are embryonic stem cells---which are completely undifferentiated. Donors would be providing blood stem cells where the extent of differentiation is only the specific type of blood cell that will form. Q03: Does my blood type matter? A: Not at all. The testing is for genotype (tissue type) and not blood type. Q04: Who can be tested? A: Donors must be between the ages of 18 and 60, in good general health and be free of chronic diseases. For example, volunteers with serious asthma, Hepatitis B or C or most forms of cancer (regardless of whether in remission) cannot be accepted. Q05: What is the procedure? A: Testing only takes a couple of minutes and, at worse, is as painless as giving blood. Blood is drawn for testing and a consent form is filled out. In some instances, a buccal swab (a sterile Q-tip which is rubbed along the wall of your inner cheek to collect cells) is used. Q06: Does a person's race or ethnicity affect matching? A: Because tissue type is inherited, patients are most likely to match someone of their same race and ethnicity. There is a special need to recruit more donors who are, for example, African Americans, Native Americans, European Jews, Armenians, Hawaiians, Pacific Islanders, Asians, Hispanics and Latinos. The reason why there are greater number or donors needed for these groups is as a result of either purges of the population (genocide, etc.) and/or relatively few people in the group in the international registry. A match for Michael would be most likely come from those of Eastern European Jewish descent. Q07: Where do I go to get tested? A: Contact the NY Blood Bank [212-570-3441 / 310 East 67th Street] and make an appointment for HLA typing. Due to an overwhelming number of volunteers, walk-ins will not be accepted. If you’re not in NY, go to http://www.marrow.org or call 1-800- MARROW-2 to find the donor center nearest you. Marrow.org will assist donors who wish to join the national registry. We hope that you will join the national registry, however, if you do not wish to join the registry [see Q13] or it’s difficult to make it to a blood center, private kits are available from Tepnel Life Codes [800-915-3695]. Order the “HLA [A][DR]” kit for $140. You will need to have a small vial of blood drawn. Indicate to Tepnel that your test is for “Michael Brecker” and they will know to whom to forward your results. Q08: How much is the testing and who pays for it? A: The test generally cost $40 to $95 depending on the donor center and the laboratory that completes the test. Testing at the New York Blood Center is just $40. However, if you’re African American, Hispanic, Native American or Asian testing is free at any donor center that’s part of the National Marrow Donor Program network [800-MARROW-2]. More than 100 centers throughout the country—including the New York Blood Center are part of the network. Following the initial testing, all medical expenses are paid for by the patient or the patient’s insurance. Q09: What is the test for? A: The test is to determine whether a tissue-type match exists between the donor and the patient. More specifically, potential donors [and the patient] are given an HLA or Human Leukocyte Antigen test. Antigens are found on the surface of infection-fighting white blood cells (leukocytes). A match between specific donor and recipient antigens is critical to having a successful transplant (i.e., where the two immune systems will not go to war with one another). Should you see your HLA results, the numbers indicated are the identifying gene-pair markers (alleles) that are responsible for your “A” antigen, for example, to be different than someone else’s “A” antigen. In the fortuitous event you’re deemed a good match after three specific antigens are compared, you will be asked for a second blood test. Q10: What are the chances of my being selected? A: As you might imagine, given the number of genes that need to match, the overall chances are quite low...but the more people tested, the more likely there will be a perfect match awaiting everyone. Q11: Has Michael’s family been tested? A: Yes, both his siblings and children---none match. There is also a rumor afloat [04AUG] that a match has been found for Michael.... regrettably, this is inaccurate. Q12: How are patients actually matched with donors? A: The results of blood samples from donors or umbilical cord blood units [see Q17] are added to different registries. The registries are then searched for a donor whose tissue type matches that of their patient. Q13: Can I be tested to be a donor only for Michael? A: Yes, but on behalf of Michael, we hope that you would not embrace this alternative. Explains Michael, “I hope to encourage as many people as possible to get tested not just to assist me, but to help thousands of others who are either facing or who will be facing the same challenge with which I’m now confronted.” Should you nonetheless wish to make a donation only for Michael, private kits are available from Tepnel Life Codes [see Q07]. Q14: If I’m not eligible or prefer not to be a donor, is there anything else I can do to help? A; [1] Please encourage everyone you know to be a donor irrespective of whether they may be a possible match for Michael. There are many people in the same situation as Michael that are in need of a donor. [2] You can organize a local donor drive in your community. For more information on doing so, please contact Michael’s management at 212.302.9200 or info@michaelbrecker.com. [3] Send a tax-deductible donation to The Marrow Foundation [payable to: The Marrow Foundation; memo line: Time Is of the Essence Fund]. All monies will be exclusively used for the testing of potential donors---not those who just wish to assist Michael, but donors willing to join the international registry. The Marrow Foundation Time is of the Essence Fund 400 Seventh Street, NW, Suite 206 Washington, DC 20004 Q15: Is there a difference between a bone marrow transplant and blood stem cell transplant? A: Yes…and no. As a result of new technologies, the term “bone marrow transplant” is in part a misnomer. In earlier years marrow had be extracted from a donor’s marrow. Today at leading cancer centers like Memorial Sloan Kettering, the collecting process rarely occurs this way. A donor is simply connected to a machine through an IV that separates and harvests the blood stem cells from the donor’s blood before the blood returns to the donor through a second IV. Instead of being tethered to a machine for a few hours, some folks still prefer direct marrow collection---where medical technology has also improved. Following anesthesia, marrow—-which continually replenishes every 4-6 weeks---is withdrawn using fine hollow needles in the hip. A sore bottom may result for a few days. In short, whatever the brief discomfort of whichever method that’s used—it’s nothing compared to the virtue and humanity of potentially saving a life. Q16: Can I take my name off the donor registry at any time? A: Yes, being on the registry just means that you may be asked to be a donor. It is strongly preferred, however, that you remove your name from the registry if you feel you may be disinclined to be a donor. Nothing may be as heartbreaking as someone having to learn that there exists a perfect match to save the life of a loved one…and the donor changed their mind about being a donor. Being a donor is not deleterious to your health. While we hope that you become a donor, please do not add your name to any donor registry if you’re not prepared to step-up when the opportunity presents itself. Q17: If I am a match, who pays for the necessary procedures?A: If you are a match, the patient's insurance pays for the entire procedure---there is no cost to you. This includes the cost of the physical you will receive to ensure that you’re in good health. Q18: I’ve heard about “cord donations” and stem cells from umbilical cords—what’s that? If you or anyone you know is having a child, inform the obstetrician that you would like the umbilical cord to be delivered to a cord blood bank where it is tested and where the blood stem cells are frozen for future use in the event of a match. The collection does not pose any health risk to the mother or baby and does not affect the birth process in any way. The cord would otherwise simply be disposed of. For further information on donating umbilical cord donations: http://www.nationalcordbloodprogram.org For ordering a private HLA kit: http://www.bonemarrowtest.com/getting_test...ering/index.asp For further information on whether you qualify as a donor: http://www.marrow.org/HELP/marrow_eligibil...guidelines.html For learning where to get tested at a National Marrow Donor Program blood center: http://www.marrow.org/cgi-bin/NETWORK/map.pl?ctr_typ=DC If you’re Asian American you may wish to visit: http://www.aadp.org or http://www.asianmarrow.org If you’re African American: http://www.aachac.org/healthfactsheets/bone_marrow.html If you’re Jewish: http://www.giftoflife.org If you’re Latino or Hispanic: http://www.icla.org -- I'm not recommending or endorsing this appeal in any way. Since I've listened to Michael Brecker's music for a long time (and most of you have too, possibly without knowing it), I am considering what it says.

Congratulations and best wishes to you both. Do not read this message until your wedding day.