GeorgeStGeorge

I've gotten bolder now, so I thought I'd start a thread. What's the dumbest thing you ever actually heard LCM say? I've got many possibilities to choose from, but I think my personal pick would be when, at the ROA teaching from Exodus, he said that if the midwives were lying about the male Hebrew births, then it was because God told them to! The Big Tent actually went silent for a couple of seconds! Shortly after the "teaching," another member of my Twig expressed his awe at the new "revelation." I simply mentioned that in the Bible it says that it is impossible for God to lie. Okay then, how about some others? (And no fair popping in VPW quotes. Save that for another thread!) George "I don't need no stinkin' pseudonym" St. George

I just woke up, so forgive me if I go back a few posts. I married late in life (41), so I shall have no children of my own; but it has nothing to do with TWI. I just enjoyed being single. My wife has four children, however, and they all live in the Houston area, so we spend a lot of time together. And my first grandchild turns 1 in about a week! George

,Refiner, Actually, according to TWI, the tithe is sufficient for God to supply all one's physical needs. Abundant sharing and plurality giving are indicative of greater spiritual depth, and the rewards are in that category. I'm confused by your statement that ex cult victims "have no generations to continue their bloodline on." I'm not sure how you're connecting financial giving with posterity. George

I've mentioned this in other threads, but I might elaborate some, here. When I took PFAL years ago, I thought that the keys to understanding the Bible were great. They made sense to me, a scientist. I was also told that questions were fine, because if my TC couldn't answer them, he would ask the BC, etc., until someone knew the answer. That person would send the answer down the line so that everyone would know. Open belligerence wasn't respected, but thoughtful questions were answered as best as people could. (I even wrote to VPW once, comparing "Uncle Harry Day" to Roman Catholic feasts. He sent me a very peaceful response. Although the gist of the response was "Uncle Harry Day is OK," I don't think it's a coincidence that the day was re-named the very next year. Unfortunately, as the years rolled on, questions were not considered a desire to learn but a rebellion agains authority. Since I don't accept BS easily, I was branded a troublemaker and was reproved on a number of occasions. Of course, since I wasn't homosexual, had no debt, and gave above the tithe, there wasn't much they could oust me on. Finally, I and my new fiancee (we had been engaged about a month) were dragged into a kangaroo court, where I was chastened for pridefully leading songs in Twig that almost nobody new, and for refusing to believe LCM's statement that the only reason for a space program is military dominance. A quick call to the LC confirmed my excommunication. My fiancee was given the choice of leaving me or TWI; she wisely chose the latter. We've been married for over six years and fellowship with other ex-wayfers in the Houston area. :)--> Of course, I was stunned when it happened, and I really didn't say much in my defense (not that it would have mattered much, I suppose). I did have a major "esprit d'escalier" a couple of days later, though. Part of the "gallery" at my tribunal was my TC, who worked for NASA. I'm sure she wasn't working on military secrets, so her involvement seemed a bit hypocritical. (Frankly, though, I find Psalm 19:1 a perfectly good reason for a space program.) Also a "Corps Grad" who had praised me for leading lesser-known songs a couple of weeks prior just sat there watching me be berated. I don't really blame him or my ex-TC, though. They were all scared to death of being booted themselves. The group I presently fellowship with has no problems with questions. We just crack open the Bible, pull out our Greek texts and concordances, and go to work. Biblical RESEARCH -- what a concept! :D-->

Refiner, One belief held by The Way, only briefly touched upon by Garth, is that a major key to the abundant life is tithing and then some. God's blessings to Israel were dependent on the tithe, and since Christians have been given so much more by God than Israel was, surely Christians can give more. In Wayspeak, giving above the tithe is called "abundant sharing"; and giving everything beyond your need is called "plurality giving." Incidentally, I still give my present ministry more than 10% of my income, not because some psycho screams at me but becuase I do feel blessed by all God has given me. George (not Aar) P.S.: There really are a lot of posts for a new thread here. It's going to be a long weekend!

Hope, I'm not one to use a lot of chat room abbreviations, but FOFLMAO! Your description of each event in the series, punctuated by the APPROPRIATE response, was hysterical! Maybe you and OldiesMan need to start a new thread: Bodily functions at The Way... :D--> :D--> :D-->

When I would occasionally post on WayDale, I used the pseudonymn lantrn because Green lantrn was always my favorite comic book hero. I had my '67 Chevelle painted green with his insignia on the hood. Unfortunately, Texas only allows six letters or numbers on a license plate, so I went for LANTRN. (The beauty of that, for comic-book afficionados, is that it can be pronounced "lantern" or "lantrin," as the 1940's Green Lantern was called by his sidekick.) But I digress. I now simply use my own name. (Yes, that really IS my name!) I picked what to me looks like a spaceman avatar, because it was the most comic-book-y. If I figure out how to use the Green Lantern insignia (and hopefully avoid copyright issues), I'll probably change to that. George St. George

Wonder1, I don't feel any more hurt from my experience with TWI (except for maybe the inability to find old friends). I don't use this site for healing, either. I just find it interesting to see the spectrum of views expressed by the Cafe visitors. I'm sure you'll find that there are many who don't "bash" TWI at every opportunity, and you'll find that there are many who do. (Sometimes, when they post on the same thread, it's like watching people from different parts of the world who are unable to understand each other's viewpoint. "How can you say that?" "Oh, yeah? How can you say THAT?" ad nauseam.) Stick around, if you like, but don't expaect the "bashing" to go away any time soon.

As I've come to read many of the posts by believers who were personally hurt by VPW, I'm more than a little saddened. I never thought he was perfect, of course; but I knew him as the man whose class taught me to love the Word. His teachings weren't always accurate, but they were passionate and challenged me to think outside my Roman Catholic box. I'm not like a few of the Cafe dwellers who refuse to acknowledge the wrongs he did, but I also choose to remember that MY life is better for his ministry. In the last day, all the "stubble and hay" in our lives will be burnt away, and we'll have the "gold and silver" of our lives for eternity. (1 Cor. 3:12-15) I can wait until then to find out how much of each there was.

OldiesMan, As Hope points out, there is a godly purpose for "marking and avoiding." And there were many, as you point out, who were openly defying the leadership of TWI, yet expected to keep their ministerial posts. LCM was wrong to demand an oath of fealty, but he was the President of the organization. If I spent all my time publicly defaming the leaders of the company I work for, I shouldn't be surprised if I were asked to leave it. Unfortunately, many of us WANTED to stay in but were forced to leave for reasons which weren't biblical or even reasonable. I suppose I should post "my story" elsewhere, but because I wasn't a homosexual and had no debt (and I tithed AND abundantly shared), they had to find some reason to get rid of me, because I kept asking too many questions. In my final "drumhead" meeting, I was chastised by the branch coordinator for 1.) leading songs that not everybody knew; 2.) refusing to sell my house (which I owned free and clear) and move into a Way Home; and 3.) questioning LCM's statement that the only reason for a space program is military dominance! (Ironically, my twig coordinator at the time worked for NASA! Actually, a perfectly good reason for a space program is Psalm 19:1!) Anyway, I was expelled. My fiancee was given the "option" of leaving me or TWI. Praise God, she chose the latter -- we've been married over six years now, and fellowshipping with other believers in the Houston area. So, OM, was my being M&A'ed a bad thing? YES. It hurt horribly, and it never should have happened. Am I living a fulfilling life outside of TWI, YES.

Started attending twig in 1978. (I was in grad school.) Was tossed out in 1997, about a month after getting engaged. My fiancee was given the choice of leaving TWI or leaving me. She chose the former. We've been married six years. Oh, and I really enjoyed MOST of the 19 years I was in.

Back in the day, I was a good friend of Donna Shea (15th Corps). She was from Vermont (in fact was Miss Vermontabout 20 years ago); but the last time I was in touch with her (about seven years ago), she was in Missouri. When I was "marked and avoided," I lost touch with her. She was a real sweetheart. Does anybody out there know where she is? There are too many Donna Sheas in the phone book; and, of course, her name might not be Shea anymore.

Have you tried one of the Internet "phone books"? I use www.switchboard.com. There are a couple of Raymond Dittmans in Illinois. You could try them both. (I expect that they are father and son.) Anyway, if you do get in touch with him, say Hello for me. He took over my twig at the University of Illinois during his apprentice year.