chockfull

First time I've heard such drama around a blog. To put it in perspective, someone's writing an editorial on an article that 10 people are going to read. No offense, Workman - that's just the nature of the blogosphere.

skyrider, you crack me up! The last 10 yrs have been the "Decade of BFF's", the "Decade of Control", and the "Decade of Pre-Fail". It's pre-fail because they don't have enough talent left to completely fail with any kind of noticeable impact. But hey, if you're a single lady that how you say "swings that way", it's been a decade of opportunity.

Interestingly enough, Bullinger's works had some of the same viewpoint, although he as a scholar also did a fair amount of timeline work. Remember the "Why 4 Gospels" article? And the perspective focus on king, servant, man, son? Of course those works were "borrowed" I guess it's just a human thing to pick the gospels over and try to fit them into a timeline. From one perspective, where doing so seems clear due to exact date/time references in the gospels, I suppose it adds a little depth of perspective. There are some fundamental "ifs" to answer though, and some of it boils down to your questioning of basic premises. Such as "can you depend completely on an author's recollection of events that happend decades earlier to be 100% precise concerning date/times?" The "every word in the Word is perfect" premise. I do recall a fair amount of VPW's attempts to draw people away from mainstream Christianity being related to these harmony of the gospel issues. His teachings / writings on "The Day JC Died", "4 Crucified", "Simon of Cyrene", "Peter's Denials" all seemed to have the underlying message of "if you can't trust mainstream Christianity about the details of JC's life, how can you trust them about your salvation?" There were some cool points about delving into the details though. Like Joseph of Arimatheia, and the difference in Greek terms of the burial clothing. But there were so many other things that seemed like such a squeezing of concepts.

I think we're already way past that. Let's call it a draw. My t-shirt link had it to 5000 as well. Lest I find myself using Cray time. Some of the greatest damage from his "research" was that leaders following him learned this as well. The scriptures say whatever they want them to say - loyalty is paramount, their whims = revelation. Control through being an autocrat.

Oh great. We're whipping them out and measuring them. So here's to 2000 places. 3.14159265358979323846264338327950288419716939937510 58209749445923078164062862089986280348253421170679 82148086513282306647093844609550582231725359408128 48111745028410270193852110555964462294895493038196 44288109756659334461284756482337867831652712019091 45648566923460348610454326648213393607260249141273 72458700660631558817488152092096282925409171536436 78925903600113305305488204665213841469519415116094 33057270365759591953092186117381932611793105118548 07446237996274956735188575272489122793818301194912 98336733624406566430860213949463952247371907021798 60943702770539217176293176752384674818467669405132 00056812714526356082778577134275778960917363717872 14684409012249534301465495853710507922796892589235 42019956112129021960864034418159813629774771309960 51870721134999999837297804995105973173281609631859 50244594553469083026425223082533446850352619311881 71010003137838752886587533208381420617177669147303 59825349042875546873115956286388235378759375195778 18577805321712268066130019278766111959092164201989 38095257201065485863278865936153381827968230301952 03530185296899577362259941389124972177528347913151 55748572424541506959508295331168617278558890750983 81754637464939319255060400927701671139009848824012 85836160356370766010471018194295559619894676783744 94482553797747268471040475346462080466842590694912 93313677028989152104752162056966024058038150193511 25338243003558764024749647326391419927260426992279 67823547816360093417216412199245863150302861829745 55706749838505494588586926995690927210797509302955 32116534498720275596023648066549911988183479775356 63698074265425278625518184175746728909777727938000 81647060016145249192173217214772350141441973568548 16136115735255213347574184946843852332390739414333 45477624168625189835694855620992192221842725502542 56887671790494601653466804988627232791786085784383 82796797668145410095388378636095068006422512520511 73929848960841284886269456042419652850222106611863 06744278622039194945047123713786960956364371917287 46776465757396241389086583264599581339047802759010 And before you even start, here's a link to my favorite t-shirt: http://www.zazzle.com/pi_5000_digits_number_art_clothing_tshirt-235173868015956584

They need to read I Cor 12 and understand when it talks about that which seems weak being more necessary. The intent of that is to prevent the arrogant egotistical attitude of pride prevalent when people judge others and compare themselves and conclude others to be inferior to themselves. The arrogant elitism of TWI extends identically to the offshoots.

One of the biggest current "selling points" of the Way International now is the "package" that VPW put together. Basically along the lines of the logic that his expertise and guidance from God led him to amalgamating the greatest teaching of the Bible known since the first century. One of the main problems I have with this is the ethics premise behind it. The "end justifies the means" approach. IMO you can't unethically plagiarize from current peers, vaguely refer to their work, blend everything together, and come up with an ethical final result. The same brain, habits, background, morals that a man uses to research scriptures are the same he uses to live his life. The same stealing of people, research, using of people, acting like a little Napolean is present throughout the "package" that was communicated. That's why leaders after VPW have been unable to change that. It's part of who they are and what they learned. While I can be thankful that the Way led me towards reading the Bible more, applying it more, and looking into languages deeper for building my understanding, outside of that, the "package" is a house of cards. It's illusion.

To come off as less complex and intellectual, you might want to quote PI out to a little less precision than 50. Just sayin'

I don't know, brainfixed. To me, any time you find genuine friendship, love, it's a gift. Quite the opposite of the fake friendship and love we found in cults.

Exactly. Scenario - idiot leader in counseling session: Leader: Where was the hole in your believing that allowed the adversary into your life? Waybot: [Looking at floor] I don't know, I can't figure it out. Leader: Would you like some help? Waybot: Sure! Leader: [Opens up the floodgates for a major spew] Spewwwwww!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Waybot: [Condemned and silent] Rational Outside Observer: [The adversary came into your life through the front door - was named "Leader"]

So to phrase this in other terms that the idiot bc can put together, "punishment is the standard". To go along wtih "leadership controlling follwers lives is the standard". They may not like the PR that this represents, yet the truth is undeniable

And we here at GS are dedicated to feeding TWI their words through that very straw. good show!

Dear John, In the spirit of your letter, we here at GS wish to share our sentiments with you via a Valentine's Day media presentation:

Now normally I don't do off-the-cuff-smart-@zz, but I have heard a variation of this BS so many times that I actually have a canned response prepared. But before I say it, let's examine this interaction. Now, nowhere but in Way-stupidity-brain-land are you ever going to find a statement like this where someone can go from zero to j@ck@zz in 0.5 seconds. This is classic "way brain" going on here. The poor girl probably thought to herself "I'm looking for an opportunity to minister to someone". However, reality is much different. She is calling with the pretense of wishing you a happy birthday, but the real habit is to troll for some response to reprove. This is also classic "Job's miserable comforters" tactics. What is really amazing is that they show up when you're not miserable and try to make you so. It's a "Job's-make-you-miserable-comforter". When I hear a question like this, my radar goes "reeeh reeeh reeeh braying donkey alert" and I go into :B) mode. I usually respond, "Why no, actually I am feeling fan-f-ing-tastic, thank you for asking. But the fact that you brought up being sad mistakenly indicates that your mind must be focused on sadness. Perhaps you are projecting. Is there anything you need to share with me so I can help you out?" Usually that obtains the desired result - them exiting all huffy. To say they actually learn anything from that type of exchange is a stretch. They wouldn't learn if you engraved it on a 2x4 and whacked them between the eyes with it so they had to look at it in the mirror every day. But I have noticed the end result is that after a few verbal exchanges of this nature, they stop pulling that BS on you and move on to try it out on some other person. Now maybe I'm a touch overreactive here, and maybe I'm on a soap-box, but to me it's taking back my life in all the little things that I'm after. And is it wrong that I do a little dance after?

God Lives Under The Bed I envy Kevin. My brother, Kevin, thinks God lives under his bed. At least that's what I heard him say one night. He was praying out loud in his dark bedroom, and I stopped to listen, 'Are you there, God?' he said. 'Where are you? Oh, I see. Under the bed...' I giggled softly and tiptoed off to my own room. Kevin's unique perspectives are often a source of amusement. But that night something else lingered long after the humor. I realized for the first time the very different world Kevin lives in. He was born 30 years ago, mentally disabled as a result of difficulties during labor. Apart from his size (he's 6-foot-2), there are few ways in which he is an adult. He reasons and communicates with the capabilities of a 7-year-old, and he always will. He will probably always believe that God lives under his bed, that Santa Claus is the one who fills the space under our tree every Christmas and that airplanes stay up in the sky because angels carry them. I remember wondering if Kevin realizes he is different. Is he ever dissatisfied with his monotonous life? Up before dawn each day, off to work at a workshop for the disabled, home to walk our cocker spaniel, return to eat his favorite macaroni-and-cheese for dinner, and later to bed. The only variation in the entire scheme is laundry, when he hovers excitedly over the washing machine like a mother with her newborn child. He does not seem dissatisfied. He lopes out to the bus every morning at 7:05, eager for a day of simple work. He wrings his hands excitedly while the water boils on the stove before dinner, and he stays up late twice a week to gather our dirty laundry for his next day's laundry chores. And Saturdays - oh, the bliss of Saturdays! That's the day my Dad takes Kevin to the airport to have a soft drink, watch the planes land, and speculate loudly on the destination of each passenger inside. 'That one's goin' to Chi-car-go! ' Kevin shouts as he claps his hands. His anticipation is so great he can hardly sleep on Friday nights. And so goes his world of daily rituals and weekend field trips. He doesn't know what it means to be discontent. His life is simple. He will never know the entanglements of wealth of power, and he does not care what brand of clothing he wears or what kind of food he eats. His needs have always been met, and he never worries that one day they may not be. His hands are diligent. Kevin is never so happy as when he is working. When he unloads the dishwasher or vacuums the carpet, his heart is completely in it. He does not shrink from a job when it is begun, and he does not leave a job until it is finished. But when his tasks are done, Kevin knows how to relax. He is not obsessed with his work or the work of others. His heart is pure. He still believes everyone tells the truth, promises must be kept, and when you are wrong, you apologize instead of argue. Free from pride and unconcerned with appearances, Kevin is not afraid to cry when he is hurt, angry or sorry. He is always transparent, always sincere. And he trusts God. Not confined by intellectual reasoning, when he comes to Christ, he comes as a child. Kevin seems to know God - to really be friends with Him in a way that is difficult for an 'educated' person to grasp.. God seems like his closest companion. In my moments of doubt and frustrations with my Christianity, I envy the security Kevin has in his simple faith. It is then that I am most willing to admit that he has some divine knowledge that rises above my mortal questions. It is then I realize that perhaps he is not the one with the handicap. I am.. My obligations, my fear, my pride, my circumstances - they all become disabilities when I do not trust them to God's care. Who knows if Kevin comprehends things I can never learn? After all, he has spent his whole life in that kind of innocence, praying after dark and soaking up the goodness and love of God. And one day, when the mysteries of heaven are opened, and we are all amazed at how close God really is to our hearts, I'll realize that God heard the simple prayers of a boy who believed that God lived under his bed. Kevin won't be surprised at all!

I agree this is quite a sketchy approach. I marvel how it swayed me in the past. On one hand they are saying "the one great work of the Spirit is to direct the heart", and on the other "mathematical exactness and scientific precision". Looking back, it seems they crafted the sales claim to appeal to both the emotion and logic - classic homiletic approach. Of course it makes absolutetly no sense when you examine it closer.

I think you are correct. I remember seeing this in Mrs. VPW's biography she wrote "Born Again To Serve". That book had I think the graduation ceremony in it and a couple other artifacts which showed the title at least.

No, that was more of a master / lap dog relationship there at that time. She wore the pants in that relationship. :D

January Parker / Barnes followed that, and was also settled for an undisclosed amount. After that, Rosie and Harvey went down the laundry list of women involved with indiscretions and "counseled" them. Part of the "counseling" was to point out that these women were partly responsible as well because they must have done it for selfish reasons, or for their own advantage. This in effect staved off other potential lawsuits, as any other legal action from those still involved in TWI would be "ignoring director counsel". There are many of these still around and involved in TWI. Some of them that "had the goods" on LCM have traded that for a political favor and are protected from the wrath and character assassination of RR. Only to be surpassed by their years of accumulated stubbornness, egotism, blindness, and mistreatment of the saints.

His degree was from a correspondence school that was run out of a house in Manitou Springs, Colorado. I'm sure whatever work he did for his thesis or dissertation (which I understood his area of study/expertise was homiletics) was buried because if it were made public then it would be available to see how shoddy of a piece of work it was that passed for that level of paper. I read Don W's thesis once at Emporia. It was on how TWI bought Emporia and turned it into a Biblical college.

By and large one of the largest snooze-fest inducing teachers of all time. Not even saved by the bow ties. Almost as boring as Corps teachings the last 5 years..... This....is....a.....can...... This....is....how...to.......read....a.....can....label..... Isn't....that....a......blessing......????? We were either really stupid or had to pretend to be or one led to the other. I had to practice my Forrest Gump face.

Nerds? I jest, I jest. And yes, that is mr. pot meet mrs. kettle.

Wow, Shellon. You and Jeff "are a gig"? I guess I don't get out much. That's awesome for you guys.

Great post, Old Skool. You're exposing a lot by bringing to light those details. For a group who calls themselves a "Biblical research, teaching, and fellowship" ministry, you've exposed that there is really virtually no "Biblical research" going on, and that which does happen is tightly controlled and micromanaged from the top. Of further note that I'm aware of is that their practices in research are once the topic is assigned, researched, and taught such as the work by Rico on debt, then they will not consider any further research presented by anyone on the topic. I'm aware of a number of individuals presenting additional research on the debt topic who were dealt with in similar manners to John Schoenheit. They were told "we are no longer researching that topic". Then they were blackballed and ostracized, stripped of responsibility and status. So their "research" is not reviewed by others for accuracy in a forum they can speak freely. It is not revisited after time for relevance and accuracy. And research that leads to different conclusions is hidden and retribution visited upon those researching. I've heard more times than I can recall that research is "Re-Search", or searching out again that which has already been searched. That is the Way's definition of research. In VPW's day it was plagiarism. Now it is dogma. Jesus Christ himself would call them "whited sepulchres". They whitewash and ensrhine that which was stolen in the first place. And for quite some time now they have operated in the fashion VPW himself used to criticize the Roman Catholic church for, with priorities of 1) What the Pope declares ex-cathedra 2) Traditions of the Church and 3) Scripture. The Way does that exclusively now.

They are transparent on a mental level