ChasUFarley

Thanks for putting in the verse numbers. Now, I'll know how to quote you accurately, when someone says, "chapter and verse?!"

Mo - Okay.... thanks for the info - that's what I thought... and that's what I remember being taught... 20+ years ago (been a while since I've thought about those teachings). You say 'of course it's many gifts' - I still believe in one gift - many manifestations... Maybe you can think of it as a toe-may-toe / toe-mah-toe thing.... :) You say "gift" I say "manifestations" (doesn't work with the music...) Allen - I remember being taught that tongues existed as a gift if you needed to understand/speak a foreign language. Like, "poof" - all of a sudden some hick from Maine can understand Mandarine Chinese... just when he needs to... (I thought it was a cool idea, but couldn't get any of the elders to say if they ever knew of it happening...) Oops... isn't the thread about the manifestations, a'la VPW's teachings.... bad Chas!

NO WOMAN can get dressed that fast....

Good thread topic. American Spectator - good mag (yes, I am also conservative - don't shoot!) You asked: Do you give in ways not associated with religion? Yes - via school, work (as volunteer), and even just 'random acts of kindness', if you want to call them that. I belong to several charities and clubs - all are into fundraisers, scholarships, grants, etc., so that's my outlet for giving. ================================= Do you think we're living in the best possible world? I don't know if we're living in "the best" of all possible worlds, as the Word says that evil seducers wax worse and worse. I think we have much better resources, healthcare, communications, etc., than our parents or grandparents had, but with every advancement comes some small price to pay. Overall, I think we are more comfortable than we deserve to be - or than we are thankful for... but I'm sure our parents also thought they had it good. I mean, how do you know what you're lacking when you think you have everything? ================================= How does that concept jibe with biblical teachings? Simple. Mark 10:45 For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many. Luke 8:1-3 After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him, and also some women who had been cured of evil spirits and diseases: Mary (called Magdalene) from whom seven demons had come out; Joanna the wife of Cuza, the manager of Herod’s household; Susanna; and many others. These women were helping to support them out of their own means. Why have the best possibly world if you can't share it? What's the point? I mean, it's not like you can take it with you!

WOW - I was just thinking of this thread the other day.... WHERE ARE YOU JUDY???? I MISS YOU!

Ron -- I heard that Pond wants to cat sit for you the next time you have to go out of town....

Maybe I'm going to play 's advocate for a moment.... If we believed that the outpouring of holy spirit is supernatural... then, why can't we believe that a freak snowstorm - even a tiny-widdle one - was also supernatural? (Ducking... running.... grabbing a flack jacket.... and a bbq rib off Belle's plate as I streak by.... )

Mo - Not splitting hairs or anything, but isn't that the LDS belief on manifestations, as well? I mean, don't they also teach 'many gifts' - not 'one gift - many manifestations', as we were in TWI?

Outofdafog -- Excellent post. Makes me think back now about calling VPW "our Father in the Word...."

Man.... WHO opened their lunch box? :blink:

Todd - you are correct about Live and how Chris is copycatting them - he's smart, because Live hasn't been in the limelight enough lately to really be remembered, so people are now going, "Ooooh! How original!" However, since he's not a sugery pop singer (i.e. Clay) (who spends too much time in AOL chat and gets busted for stupid things) - he's the best thing going on there, IMOH...

Not to derail this or anything... not that a derailment is new to this thread... but Mike.... How is it that you have access to the AC like that? I mean, isn't it copyrighted, protected, etc. and only to be utilized by TWI? In other words, I didn't think Joe or Mike Believer owned any of it...

White Dove -- I think he said that you have to have them available - you might use several or one in a healing situation - but if you knew how they operated, how to recognize the still small voice, etc., then you would be able to complete the task. BUT (and here's my disclaimer) I took that class over 15 years ago... it ain't as fresh in the ol' brain as it was... However, it seems that people took it to mean more like: ALL (WITHOUT EXCEPTION) NINE, ALL (WITHOUT EXCEPTION) THE TIME (I think a situation requiring ALL NINE would be very rare - not the norm....) (But I'm sure someone will argue this....) Yo' Belle -- Please pass the ribs!

So, now that Mike was able to derail/distract from this thread by the third post on it, I believe that White Dove's answer about the SESSION and mine about the CLASS/LOCATION/ETC., answer his question quite well. SKYRIDER, who started this thread, said: I take to task with those who promote wierwille and his classes as "God would teach him like it hadn't been known since the first century if he would teach it to others"......or the MOGFOT crap. Wierwille taught some good things, some bad. Some things were simple, some things were contradictory. All nine all the time.................is one of those contradictory issues that vpw promoted. I think what happened with this, is that VPW taught it, like White Dove, myself, and others posted - he taught that the nine manifestations are available - you just have to know how to recognize and utilize them. I don't remember him teaching that you use them all at once. I think ZEALOUS people took this saying out of context, and warped it into something where they taught you should OPERATE all nine manifestations AT ALL TIMES - be looking always for occasions to use them, etc. Just like people misued "Reaching into Daddy's cookie jar..." to say they were trolling for revelation all the time, which isn't really what VPW taught, as I understood it. It was more God's perrogative if he gave you any revelation at all - it wasn't that he had it for you - like cookies - all the time... Again, it was people who placed what came out of VPW's mouth above what the Word said that messed things up - the man was, and by some people, still is, elevated above God and the Word.

HA! MADE YA LOOK! (Sorry... there's too many serious, and deep threads going on here, where people are taking themselves way too seriously and getting deeper all the time....) (The made me do it!)

pond -- Did you know that stress also causes flatulance? Yes. It does. So, you might want to keep that in mind when you're reposting about 1800PETMED.... again...

Rick -- Yes, I do. I started playing flute when I was 10 years old, played in band. Then I took lessons, performed solo several times, played in the school jazz band, and the symphony - first chair. I love it, but was trained in classical music. I really love rock music better, and I'm no Jethro Tull... So, my current love is bass guitar - it appeals to the WildWoman within (I usually drag out the flute around the holidays, etc. - we love playing Christmas music together - hubby usually plays his 12-string or classical guitar.) I also play piano - we have a house full of instruments, amps, and microphones. We're only missing a drum kit, so we're hoping that one of the boys takes up the drums - I think it will be the baby, because Kristopher is already a good singer/frontman! (And the baby is always whacking on something!

Thin Mints... yum!

1991 Advanced Class Rome City, IN Balcony. Third Row. Second seat from the wall, stage right. "All nine all the time" was said by VPW in the 1979 Advance Class. (And just so no one gets their knickers in a knot about the dates - the TAPE of the '79 AC was aired in '91 - get it?) The term was repeated by LCM, later on, as he was hosting the class. The context was more about having all nine manifestations available to you to operate at all times, if you needed them. The Advance Class was to better instruct you in how to do that. If you were operating all nine AT ONCE, would that be spiritual multi-tasking?

Actually... I feel like the dumb bunny because I didn't know, yet it had been posted. Just put it together really... I just didn't frequent any of the music threads before this because... well.... until I picked up bass guitar, I played the whimpiest of instruments... something just a hair above a kazoo.... Yes, I am flautist. There. Out of the closet. So, you can understand why I didn't know this before....

DISCLAIMER: This isn't an endorsement of a lifestyle, breaking the law, or anything immoral. This link is simply posted for research purposes only.

Some breeds of dogs are just more farty than others - usually bulldogs and terriers are the worst. I used to work as a vet tech assistant, and lemme tell you... some of the things you can smell but can't see are just the worse! One way to cut down the emissions is to get them on a high protein diet - Purina makes some very good ones, that aren't terribly pricey. Age, obesity, and other factors will also contribute to 'output'... just as it does with humans. Then there's always:

The Greek Orthodox Church that we go to requires us to stand when the Priest walks in the room. It's out of respect. There's no clapping or any fanfare... but they also let people sit down who need to - like the elderly, or small children, or if you physically can't stand for a long period of time. You stand thoughout most of the service. I have also attended Mass at various Roman Catholic churches (something I'd never admit to while at the Greek Church!) - you stand, sit, kneel, and practically do The Twist before that's over with... That being said... Belle's comment about how the President would have to stand for Ordained Clergy - I was looking for the "rule" on line, and came across this: http://www.bibletruths.net/Archives/BTAR151.htm

Great topic... I wasn't the model student when I took PFAL, but that might have been because it was done in two weeks, and right at the same time I was getting ready for my senior finals and graduation - high pressure time, you know. It didn't dawn on me until Session 10 or 11 that we were going to be "lead into manifestation of the gift of holy spirit...." I FREAKED! I'd never heard of speaking in tongues - not that common of a subject in Maine - and especially amongst teenagers. I was also a control freak - I remember thinking, "What if I got it wrong? What if it sounds dumb? I can't do THAT!" The WOWs were no help - they laughed me off and said, "You'll do great!" You know - a blow off... So, Session 12 came - and so did a TON of visitors - the acting Limb Coordinator (as our old one had just split) - the Branch Coordinator - and some other guys and gals I'd never seen before.... Oh - Here's another ambush for you - Ladies - How about the first time another women met you with a holy kiss? - I thought I was going to die! (I was sooooo shy and embarrassed for that!) So, the "you move your teeth, your tongue, your lips," part comes up, and I thought I was going to blow beets - I did not want to be there. The LC saddled up next to me, and started rubbing my back - he meant well - but the pressure was awful. I didn't SIT - I was so frozen in fear, shyness, etc. - I was terrified! After the session, the LC says, "You did GREAT! I heard you fine!" I wanted to say, "No, you didn't!" but I kept my mouth shut - it really wasn't until a couple of months later - just before the '89 ROA, that I finally SIT. Fast forward.... several years later.... The Way of Abundance and Power comes out.... we're told that one of the big changes is that students are put on the spot to manifest at the end. No. They have to do that BEFORE the end, and they're set up with a couple of people to help lead them into speaking in tongues.... I thought that was worse, because there's not privacy or anonymity. I heard that if you didn't manifest then, you were kicked out of class - you couldn't complete the class if you didn't SIT, in other words. How humiliating is that? Ambushed... good word for how I felt about that experience...

Someone on a recent thread said something about how when we were in TWI, we were know-it-alls, and how everything was so black and white to us. We were cocky, sure of ourselves, and no one could tell us any different. We had an answer for everything. Do you think that type of statement, above, describes how you were - or even how you still are today? (Please, answer for yourself, not others, k? :) ) After leaving TWI, did you find that things weren't as monocromatic - black and white - as you thought? Did you begin to question the basis of your theology, including your judgement of others? If so, how long did it take for you to admit that maybe your beliefs/thinking could/should/did evolve in any way? And, if so, at what point did you realize you had started to decompress or distance yourself from your TWI expereince? The purpose of this thread is to explore how we've grown - spiritually and mentally - since leaving TWI. The questions I have asked are in broad strokes because it's my goal for this thread to attract posters from all 'genres' to post here - from the ones who frequent the Denomination thread, to the ones who mess around in the General thread. I think it will be interesting to see what the responses include....