rascal

Ahh, but Word Wolf, since when does a lack of accuracy, honesty, compassion and good character matter when you have GOD on your side?

Where?

Yeah, but no doubt Mr. Hamm, that to the twi way of thinking, Dad loves HIM best....the planet should be relinquished to him on those grounds alone.

I voted christian, but am leading towards *I just don`t know* Is that agnostic? Funny, I never managed to walk on water either song.... I had an uncle though, that almost succeded once when fleaing from a bear! Don`t think it was sit that we heard that was coming outta his mouth as he flew by while being persued ;-)

I don`t think he gives a damn cw. To acknowledge sexually assaulted children by twi leaders, would sully his sanitized little world. Allan, come on....do you really think that God led you to a place where they threatened to throw you out of a window if you talked to some one? These people that threatened you do no deserve your praise or their actions laid at God`s feet.

Gosh gc, you have a knack for being able to cut through all of the confusion straight to the heart of a matter.... Your comment about God being WITH us while in twi, but not necessarily OF twi is sounding off bells and whistlles for me right now.... This fits in with what the rest of you have been saying..... This would make it possible to praise God and still curse twi.

It``s pretty obvious that you don`t want any meaningfull dialog, you just want to jump sombody`s a$$, anybody, whether they merit or not..... Pal you have no class, you have nothing to offer anyone, and I am done with your silliness.

There ya go Allan shooting your mouth off without having a clue.....it wasn`t Hamm who said that......it was the new poster who`s term was being discussed as appropriate or not.

Oh DEAR, somebody`d better run tell pawtucket that the place is being over run by pagans athiests, new agers and spiritualists.... Gosh with only Allan nobly standing in the gap to stem the flow of darkness....... What a guy......

Agreed Bramble, the most serious offenders of pushing their beliefs, is usually the ones upset that folks are no longer are kept cowed by twi dogma.

You can disagree with a post without attacking the poster Allan, Try to address the idea and why it is not valid in your opinion. Some of us learn by sorting through our experiences and get valuable imput from other thoughtfull posts....I have changed my preconcieved opinions inumerable times since beginning to read these forums.....

Oh, and those who said *No*? They were escorted immediatly off grounds....everyone told they were posessed and warned not to speak to them and their families in their home states were warned that they were posessed and not to believe anything they said. Yeah I know women that this personally happened to.

Well certainly shows what kind of man you are Allan, and it isn`t pretty. The reason folks didn`t say that was because we were told that God required this of us. Backed up with twisted scripture and support of the top ministry leaders...... To not comply meant leaving the protection of God and the household .... some of us were promised that death would occur ..... Therein lies the heinous crime.... we did what was required, as repugnant as we personally found it to be.....because the men who had earned our trust as teachers of the scriptures themselves said that God required it.

Think about looking someone right in the eye Allan....someone who`s child was sexually abused by a leader....or someone who was despicably used by vpw or the children who`s childhoods were ripped away with cruel treatment...they are all right here Allen. Think about all of the pain that this man and his organization was directly responsible for......and then imagine how calloused it is when you say...yeah but I thank GOD for twi ......it`s like a kick in the gut....it`s like God was a part of the destruction of peoples lives.

Heres a thought Allan, instead of spending your effort attacking posters... how about considering the questions that are being asked...... Maybe if you have an answere I could attempt to understand your opinion on why God would lead you to be blessed in twi and lead others to get their bu tts kicked? I saw great evil manfiested towards people who were only seeking to know God... How can God be responsible for that? Isn`t that what you say when you praise him for twi? I know that is why I have my doubts about God`s involvement in the whole deal.

Yeah, the things I am talking about HAPPENED in the 70s 80s 90s on into 2000... the negative repercussions continue to affect us to this day. This makes the events being discussed still relevant.

It all goes back to my question of ...No matter HOW much I enjoyed my involvement in twi... should I be praising and thanking God as the one responsible ..... when involvement with the exact same people was so detrimental to someone else? It just seems wrong to lay the responsibility on God.

I understand that the subject matter of this thread offends you Allan....it really ought to. Some really ugly things happened to myself and friends of mine while involved.... I cannot reconcile what happened with a loving God who leads us and guides .... You believe that God led you there and you recieved great blessings....great...how can you explain why those who were destroyed were there? If God led you then does that means he ALSO led those others who were treated so badly?? I can see him now....*Come here kiddo, come learn about me..your gonna get you foot kicked, your heart broken, your lives wasted....but these other folks are gonna have a good time....so it really is ok*.... Did God only lead some of us to be blessed ???? Were those who were mistreated not supposed to come? Seems like a mighty poor recomendation for christianity..... The other option as I see it.... is that POSSIBLY .... none of us were led.. could we have been lured and decieved, If so, that doesn`t sound like something a loving God would be responible for...

Gentleman, thankyou for your assistance. It becomes very frustrating to have my posts misconstrued and motives called into question....to the point of becoming completely distracted..e Your help in keeping this thread on topic and support of attempts to express myself ..are aprecited Thankyou all for our contributions and bearing with my efforts to understand what happned and why in twi, I think it all relates directly to how I feel about God, christianity, my responsibility, and what I want to teach eventually teach my children.......

Gosh Oak, will ya look at my karma! Must be a sign from God ;-) Thanks Buddy... Smurff, not a problem at all, sometimes folks irritated over another issue entirely will let it bleed over into a completely unrelated thread...I`m sorry your thread just got caught in the cross fire is all :-) Gentleman, thankyou very much, it really was starting to feel like I was being dog piled... I apreciate the life line thrown........ Wolf thanks for taking the time and effort to sort through the mess and post for clarification... it was getting out of my league. I knew what it was I intended to say, but it was getting mighty tough to explain it.

I don`t back down Allan, *duck and weave* are techniques for someone who is not honest in what they post. I am finished defending myself to you as well on this thread....in order to avoid further derail, if you want to continue, take it over to the praises/curses thread.

Allan, I posted what I really meant, most of the rest of the folks were able to understand the point being made without havingto have it spelled out.... I do not have to cater to your current understanding Allan. I will continue to write what I deem important, whether I have your approval or not.

Dove, you are making a big stink over something that has not happened...you are simply mistaken in your impression of me. Please desist.

You have taken a rhetorical question out of context from a different thread, and misrepresented what it said in order to make your point. Bad form, and not honest Allan.

Thanks James, Act2 pointed that out to me and I acknowledged ina later post. I am sorry about your difficulties and your divorce.