rascal

Dana, I do not know you, and hope that I can post my thoughts without offending or appearing to attack you personally. As I have not taken momentus, I base my opinions on the writings of folks who have..... Guess what I have seen in the folks who have taken momentus ane enthusiastically endorse it is that their proclamations of being *all better now* .... it would seem based on the idea that every thing that they ever have done to other folks is no longer their responsibility... Everybody ELSE needs simply needs to just suck it up and quit being victims and accept the blame for what these folks did to them on their own shoulders..... IMO, a nice way to get yourself and your conscience off the hook for your actions. ALSO a nice way to absolve yourself of guilt and the necessity of your Godly responsibilty to those whom you have sinned against. No doubt it`d be a very attractive alternative to one who had been a participant in the evil of twi. It almost sounds like twi all over again...you need to quit blaming US for what WE did to you....It is all your fault and YOU just need to quit being a whiney victim. Maybe I am wrong...but this is the impression I have recieved of the posters who have taken this course. Back on way dale there was a long thread about how damaging many folks had found it to be. It sure sets the sirens and alarm bells off for me.... Nothing personal Dana, as it is obvious that you liked it....however we were ALL once very enthusiastic supporters of a group that turned out to be very harmfull... I am sorry if I am a bit sceptical.

Agreed smurff, we were so engrossed in studying the minutea that I think we entirely missed the big picture. *ever seeking but never coming unto a knowledge of the truth*....describes us pretty well I think. *Worshipping God and moving the word* SOUND real nice....but it certainly wasn`t *Love God and Love your neighbor*....that Jesus declared our primary responsibility....I didn`t see a whole lot of genuine love period....so I guess I would have to place what we did in the *tinkling symbol* catagory. Has kind of a nice *ring* to it... but really of no benefit. As a matter of fact, in hind site, I think all of that studying and maniacal witnissing that we did was more of a distraction from our most important duty to God....

Well YEAH...and drank like a fish ... and didn`t exercise.... None of that shouldda mattered though ...cause he had peace in the heart.....maybe HE was the one who didn`t understand *going with God* I`d love to know how long the folks who`s early demise was promised because of their worries and fears lasted.... Probably in truth....just another set of characters made up to illustrate and support his ideology.

Gotta wonder how long these guys lasted...(I`d LOVE to hear that they were alive and well) when ol vp only lasted what...ten years after making this statement? Alla that peace and going with God didn`t really ensure HIM a free pass from an early death did it? Seems to be there might be some flaw in his logic...

Agreed Oak, it was a handy dandy dodge taken whenever the more outragious doctrine started raising questions in our mind....or some of the glaring errors in doctrine and practice began to cause doubts. Dilva, much of the *good* that was found in twi, in truth can be traced back to the street preachers you mentioned. Good people who`s gifts, work, and flocks were co opted by vp....making himself and his ministry appear to have virtue and integrety that wasn`t his....

That record matches the information given to me by a poster in chat who`s mother went to school with vp. There was a valid REASON why his ministry was never popular in the nk area .....and it WASN`T , as they told us in twi....that because a *prophet is not without honor save his own home*.... Great way to get us to disregard the locals first hand knowledge of the true nature of vp though.

You know....their version of Mrs. W`s life doesn`t match with what was shared in twi about their earlier lives...Do they think nobody remembers this stuff?

She was in an untenable situation, a lady who had a tough road to walk, no doubt .....through most of the difficulties.....she exhibited class and dignity in every way.

Glad that respect was shown at the service. To have confronted anyone, no matter how deserving would have been apropriate.

Yeah, her gentle demeanor, her general sense of decency lent an impression of moral character, integrety and and spiritual healthiness to twi. In hindsight, I don`t know if that was necessarily a good thing :-( Maybe without decent good hearted folks (there were many, many of us) to hide behind, vp wouldn`t have been able to pull it off.

It was 100 when I took it....an I had to sell the damn thing as a wow the next year at 200. It was a lot of money, I was always a little uncomfortable explaining the logic behind it...

Dunno bout your facts Lorna...as far as gay rumors..... I find it interesting that Rosie DID allow two gay women to live together in her basement for quite some time... Many people who knew Donna in her early years said that she had *opportunities* in this area... So what?...I just think it is funnier n he11 that THESE two of all of the tens of thousands of talented people who were involved with twi....ended up holding the power when all of the dust settled... ROFLMAO....as little respect as vp had for women...if he had EVER had an inkling that they whom he had so disdaned would end up entirely in control of his ministry....and as homophobic as twi was..... I think it is poetic justice.

Penguine, I look for love plain and simple. We have a wonderfull methodist minister who`s love transcends the doctrinal barrier. I have seen churches here that have it, and those who don`t ....denomination doesn`t seem to factor in whether or not they love God and love one another. I have also seen churches that were great for a while....but change and attempt to go down a dark path. My opinion would be based on how the minister conducted themselves....when they answere your questions...do they honestly care about you....or are they on a recruiting mission? Be prepared to sample a variety ... it is almost like chosing a new favorite restaurant...you go and if you enjoy ...continue... I have found that docrtinal issues matter a whole lot less than how they honor the two great commandments... I have also found that though they be doctrinaly on a different page than I was...DIDN`T necessarily mean that they didn1t have something to teach me :-)

ROFLMAO Raf!

Thanks alot Guys, this has given me a direction to go in.

Yeah, I saw where the forcast computers had many different scenarios....4 showed it heading out to sea and harmless...aprox 4 showed it swinging back around and clobbering Fla.....and 4 showed it going over fla and hitting the same area that katrina just devistated.... Whew

Thanks Ev, I had dismissed it as such untill you said that their was some reason not being reported....thanks for putting the rumor to rest.

Now THERE is the attitude and walk in love of a Christian that I can respect! Out in 88, THIS is an example of the way a genuine spiritually mature Christian behaves..... Such a stark contrast from the counterfit attitude of arrogant bullying we aquired while in twi. All of the scriptures and doctrine in the world can`t *fix* what is broken by adherance to twi dogma....

Then again, maybe God has healed many of us and led us away from the misconceptions aquired during association with twi. How about we compare the fruit of just about any church against the fruit of twi ....there aren`t many that can match the putrid fruit produced in twi. I think that the false standards and notions aquired in twi...ie we are so great and churches are so dumb.....is a simple diversion to keep people from doing as galations suggested...thus exposing twi for what it really was.

Yeah, we were taught at our first limb meeting as wows in Ark, that it was blind obediance that enabled peter to walk on the water. He obeyed without thought, , he did exactly what Jesus said, when told, and because did not allow himself to look at the *circumstances* surrounding him... a miracle happened... he got to walk on water. We were told that if we obeyed *our* leadership`s commands, that we TOO would be blessed by God and possibly be a part of a miracle. We were ALSO told that even if leadership was wrong...that God would certainly cover and bless us for our meek obediance...either way...you win if you obeyed. If we by chance looked at any *negatives* or *5 senses* knowledge...(in short ANYTHING that would interfere with implicit obediance) that it would be akin to when Peter started looking at *5 senses stuff* or *negatives* ie ... the wind and waves and began to sink.... This is how they taught us to ignore our better judgement, deny our personal preference, and ignore our fears.....this was a big tool in keeping us involved even after being mistreated .....this is how they were able to coerce us into performing the unthinkable. This was one of the bullets chambered in the gun pointed at my head.

I find it noteworthey that the most contentious, unkind, and fiercly judgemental people ....without fail, are the oh so rightious who cling the most tenaciously to way dogma ...... aka the *truth*

I suppose that even WITH all of the errors of KristenDUMB they haven`t been able to achieve the viscious destruction we endured from those who supposedly knew the *truth*. Sadly, it would appear that all of the truth, scriptural knowledge and continual studying on the planet will not necessarily prevent one from indulging in great evil.... I think the most important commandments...or laws *truth* if you will, as listed by Jesus Christ himself .... is *love God* and *love your neighbor*... Who is demonstrating this?

They DID throw people out for mere spiritual *suspicion* I know a family with 7 children that was thrown out because the mother was *suspected* of being *homo*....I also know a mother of twins throw out for the same suspiscion ..... geeeeze. Both have family members still in who won`t associate with them because of this.

I don`t know wolf, I never made it past my app. year (3 times lol) then became corpes spouse. All I know is that once I applied, life became pretty tough...all of a sudden ... they OWNED my friggin a$$. I was subject to everyone`s orders, room inspections by my lc became acceptable, all of my activities were dictated, who/what I was allowed to participte in, where/who I lived with.... was expected to take/participate in any class or event. I was required to go to extra leadership *training* at the limb....what great secrets and training did I enjoy?????? Why we were dropped off in pairs aroung the city for a little door to door witnessing! Being app corpes meant that you were open to face meltings on a whim....because of out greater committment ... we were expected to be mature enough to handle it and understand the *love* in which it was given. I can only speculate that it was more of the same upon entering residence. As far as I could tell....that *greater* committment of being corpes simply meant that one was expected to be willing to put up with/ ignore/endure the outragious demands and behavior of the leaders in charge...