rascal

Eventually he will simply HAVE to notice the lack of horns and tail....the suspicious lack of green spew accompanied with the head rotation and scarey voices that one generally associates with a twi cop out Seriously, I think that he will be in for a delightfull suprise! good luck in your new job ex!

I just don`t see God calling you to hear his truth and others to be destroyed by the same truth... A more likely scenario would be that a counterfit slapped a lable of *truth* upon itself ... this explains why people would be decieved into trusting pfal as spiritually healthy... and yet it being the foundation layed for future viscious abuse and betrayal. That simply is not how God operates.... The *truth* of twi was a lie ...counterfit... and to base ones life on this is to never know the genuine :(

Hi Vicky! My name is Cathy and I must be an addict too because I have been participating in the exway community for nearly as long. We read transchat in horror and disbelief.... I was there the first week or so of waydale.... My spouse gave me *permission* to read but strongly cautioned that I mustn`t allow what I read to make me *negative* about the ministry....I was so solemn and earnest in my promise.... I was so afraid to post....I called my husband for permission the first time I cried after I did because I was so afraid that I would bring him shame..... You folks have been priceless in providing the support and encouragement that I needed to not only *find* me...but to help me find value in th person that was stuffed down so far deep indside...that I didn`t even remembe who she was :) You people gave me a voice for the first time in my life. You people found value in my thoughts....You people have helped me recognise value in myself....Thanks for the hug and right back atcha cw...and please allow me to add mine to yours in embracing the rest of the ex way folks who have been there during our journey ..... p.s. Please cw, I have some paper towels and disinfectant ....and will gladly help you clean up where someone felt compelled to rudely defecate all over your nice post

Ck, Ricky and even Dove, I am curious....do you hold the same opinion of Jim Jones and David Koresche? Did they not also teach the *the word* to the best of their abilities as well? All three men taught the bible passionately...all three men found ways scripturally to excuse their *sin* to their followers... All three men took what was not theirs in God`s name......all three left a swath of destruction and destroyed lives, in God`s name. Are they considered *good men* in your opinions as well? Can you tell me why you might consider wierwille any better then them? Can you explain wht wierwilles sins are any less heinous or excusable?

Dearest (((ex))) ANYBODY who could believe what happened to you and our other dear sisters, was simply the results of a *man of God who sinned in the flesh*..... are completely blinded to the genuine things of God. We know that God doesn`t call people to a genuine ministry or to a Godly teacher to have this happen to them.....It was the lure and seduction of practitioners of incredible evil.....and yet folks have the unmitigated gaul to blame it on a simple slip of an otherwise Godly man....in complete contradiction of what the scriptures declare to be genuine spirituality <_< The knowledge that they pride themselves in....is what enables them to abide comfortably in darkness...and that is sad

Agreed sprawled....there was SO much corruption dating so far back in twi`s history...how can one have any confidence in who was given the nod of aproval by twi leaders. I knew a couple of very good leaders too... It seemed to me though, that they were that way in SPITE of twi....not because of anything learned in twi.

Benefit? I don`t think so....There are a few people in control of the money and property that we all contributed to believing that it was always to be *ours* as vpw promised. Now 99 % of the people who were promised that it was *our* ministry and *our* grounds...are denied access to the fruits of our years of labor....and the wierwille kids and grandkids their ancestral home. It is rediculous to believe that God or anybody else in the world is in any way benefited from the garbage that is passed of as scriptural teaching coming out of that snake pit. Hundreds of millions of dollars in money, property, assets.....and a few fat cats sitting pretty enjoying the inheritance and denying the true beneficiaries access ....nice

Well we see how Godly THAT inspiration turned out to be now didn`t we? Wierwille family zippo..... long time way ministry supporters zippo....... GOD zippo...... Shoot, the only people benefitting at all from alla that family property and money extorted from trusting souls is the bottom feeder attornies and the creepo leaders of twi. Yeah I`ll give wierwille credit... credit for being dead WRONG

Love it!! :D

Woohoo AMEN sprawled! The best way that I have ever heard it described. Excellent point George. They got us to discount our experiences, ignore our feelings and mistrust our emotions...the only thing left to base our decisions and beliefs on was what twi wanted us to think....and THAT was always what was best for twi :(

I dunno Free Lady...how does the explicit condemnation of false prophets and wolves in sheeps clothing figure into that scenario? I didn`t see anybody praising them in the scriptures :(

I always felt weird about session 12 as well...I knew that it was coming, the wow that witnessed to me felped me do it a few days before thank goodness....but I hated it....excellor sessions in the intermediate that was always run immediatly after in those days.... I detected it, always felt phoney with those stupid *games* to improve fluincey...I never felt like it was genuine. I tried to believe that it was real and that we were something special...and that God was blessing us with awsome communication....but deep inside...it always struck me as contrived and phoney...same old stale message every day year in and year out.. ....I the lord your Gawd do indeed incourage...blah de blah.......thppppt I feel dishonest ...like I am making this up stuff and speaking it on God`s behalf <_<

Wow Penguine, very good point. I think that for what EVER reason, TWI trained us into ignoring our God given uniquely individual experiences/ insights/emotions/ in short that still small voice that worked within each of us with statements like you mentioned.

Ricky, in answere to your questions, yes I have taken pfal numerous times and others here have taken wap. My question to YOU is....have you ever lived near/had personal contact with the leaders of twi? There is a huge difference in what you are taught in those classes and what is praticed by those who are currently in charge as well as those who were in the past. You are talking with people here who have personally witnessed the evil practiced and justification used for doing so...by the top leaders in twi. Please, familiarize yourself with that which you defend...at the very least tuck these nuggets away so that when things don`t add up in the future...you can make an educated decision for yourself.

Brilliant Thomas Heller!!! LMAO

Ricky it sounds like you are the one *writing off the word* by entirely dismissing galatians in support of your personal perceptions. The fruit listed as being *of the flesh* are simply that ...an indication of what a person is inside....Galation further clarifies that they will have no *inheritance in the kingdom of God.

Welcome mkeon, J....sounds like you have a pretty good handle on things. The only thing that I would take issue with in your post is that simply because you personally find something to be futile, it doesn`t necessarily mean that there isn`t significant benefit for another. Sometimes it is important for some of us to evalute what we believe in light of where we learned it as to it`s validity. Some times when one has been deeply hurt by a self proclaimed representative of God through the mishandling and misapplying of scriptures...it becomes necessary to dissect our belief systems in order to not feel very angry and betrayed by God. Sometimes when we continue to asssume that something is *truth* without question....it can still have adverse consequences in our lives. Anyway, some reasons why a topic of this type would be found of interest to people.

Scarey :( There seems to be much more to it than the reitation of Romans and sit ing...

I understand why any pfal adherant would need to believe that was so dove....but the bible just doesn`t support that position. *Truth* is suspect if the one declaring it to be so...is of low moral character. Every scripture given us as sign posts to indicate the spiritual healthiness or lack there of says that wierwille/pfal fail the test miserably. The *fruit* is of the flesh...the teacher lacked *charity* as well as morals.... For many, the exposure and application of these *truths* brought great suffering. ALL significant indications that this wasn`t spiritually healthy.

I don`t think that wierwille with ALL of his various sources that he studied ever honestly understood being a Christian. I think that with his vast knowledge that he THOUGHT that he did....Thomas is right..... I only have to look at his lack of love and his willingness to utterly destroy any who displeased him.....to realise that what vpw practiced and taught isn`t *truth* in the context of Christianity. PFAL, gives people the illusion of *truth* ....the appearance of being spiritual....but is proven lacking in THE most fundimentally important aspect in all Christianity .... Charity. Without that....it was all simply noise

Thankyou Thomas and CW, it makes much more to me sense now :)

Sorry for the derail, but does anybody mind if I ask ....just what IS a horseleach?

Your post Belle, reminded me of a time when vp went BALLISTIC because HA had played penny poker while he was visiting his family on holiday...... He was nuts....yelled and stomped talking about how it was gambling and Howard was really screwin up...that he was in all kinds of trouble for not listening....THIS from the man who was drugging and raping young women He had some nerve being so venemous over penny poker ...considering what HE was guilty of personally.

Hmm I guess I don`t mind telling the rat poop story.....shiver...but I was thinking too of the specimen story (my personal favorite :) )

I`d like to point out as an aside...and SINCE we have been demoted to the doctrinal basement....How once again..... I am always suprised when more venom is generated and focused on the folks who TALK about what wierwille and his leaders did, than anger that is EVER directed at the people who actually betrayed the believers and actually committed these crimes