penworks

Happy Birthday! Even though I don't know you, I wish you lots of happiness today and everyday. Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius power and magic in it. ~Goethe

I meant to thank you for this info. I sent a PM but so far I haven't heard from him.

Thanks everyone for your input on this. Wish me luck. penworks

I'd like to get a copy of the ROA '72 video. If anyone has one and wants to part with it or make a copy of it to send me, let me know. I'm willing to negotiate a price.

If Pam Tompary Craley (divorced but now has another married name) is around GSC or if anyone knows how I can contact her, I'd love to get in touch with her. Thanks, penworks

A very interesting and insightful thread going here. I have more comments, but they would be off Copenhagen's topic, so I'll say goodbye on this one. You've all caused me to pause and think, which to me is a sign of a good discussion, so I thank you and I thank Pawtucket for this and all forum opportunities. Be well one and all. Ciao from my desk, penworks

Ah, yes, I understand what you mean now. I see from so many posts here that after the big exodus of the late 1980s that the system encouraged being meaner and meaner in a lot of ways... penworks

Ditto to what Belle and Rascal have shared! It's a brave adventure you are on, Copenhagen, but remember some of us have gone before you and done it already, so it can be undertaken - just one baby step at a time...

Rascal, I understand a lot of what you mean about the bullies remaining after so much dust settled, but I have to say that I was around EARLY on in the 1970s, in the Second Corps, and experienced a good deal of personal bullying from the founder of TWI. I have to be fair and say he started that bully ball rolling. It didn't just appear in the 80s. What we see today is an inevitable outgrowth of the seeds planted in the 1940s. When I examine my experience (which I've been doing the past 20 years) I see that groups like this can only be what they are. Huh? I mean, that to expect them to be able to maintain kindness in the face of challenging questions, for instance, is close to impossible. Questions are threatening to them. This sort of fundamentalist system is afraid by its very nature of any non-compliance. Fear is the lasso used to rope people into their corral and tie 'em down. Anyhow, I second the motion for Copenhagen to branch out and try to meet new friends. To keep the old may not be possible. But the world is full of good people who can show up in our lives when we least expect them, so let the universe provide for you, Copenhagen. The key word is "let"!

Rascal expressed many thoughts and feelings that I share, too, and in such a lovely way! I would add that you might consider writing down the pros and cons of staying with TWI and weigh them carefully. See what it all adds up to or comes down to. I remember around the time I began thinking of leaving, I looked around the WOW auditorium (this was in about 1985) and thought "Who in here really cares about MY wellbeing? If my wellbeing means I need to leave this group, who in here would support me in that decision?" Well, I found out real fast the answers to those questions when I did leave. But, today I often think of - even feel like - Job who after losing soooo much, gained everything back sevenfold later in life because he stuck to his truth. I'm reminded of this quote: To thine own self be true, and it must follow as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." Good night and good luck!

Enjoy your day, Socks. I actually probably know you from long ago at HQ.

What a wonderful exploration here in this thread. I particularly like " This is the unnamable ONEness and NON-seperate God as described in all ancient wisdom. The God who is equally outside and inside, the one AND the many...." Has anyone read Buddhism Without Beliefs - A Contemporary Guide to Awakening, by Stephen Batchelor?

Dear Ophelia, please know my heart goes out to you, too. Although I'm a new poster (but an old greaser at heart) I send you hugs, which are most inadequate but are intended to comfort you. Peace to you.

Just wanted to add that I've found books by Karen Armstrong to have wonderful insights on all these issues, in particular, "The Battle for God - The History of Fundamentalism", and her memoir, "The Spiral Staircase (My Climb out of Darkness)". She was in a convent for 7 years and left to become a world-renown religious history writer. She helped me appreciate compassion being the hallmark of spirituality, not knowledge of the Bible or any other sacred text. To quote Armstrong, "...fundamentalist movements distort the [religious] tradition they are trying to defend by emphasizing the belligerent elements in their tradition and overlooking the insistent and crucial demand for compassion." (The Spiral Staircase, pg. 295). I wish you well, newlife. Look for compassion in any group you encounter. Shake off that fear like an old coat and enjoy your life!

I find writing to be very helpful in sorting things out. Sometime in the future, I may take you up on your offer, Eagle!

Does anyone know how to reach David Anderson?

Details about the end of Peter's relationship with the ministry can be found on pg. 104 and 105 of Karl's book. The account is too long and involved to quote here, but essentially Peter was accused of operating outside the Way Tree structure, there were many written communications with Howard (who was made International Coordinator without Peter being told), Howard was nasty, Peter was very reasonable but in the end I think the core issue was HQ was not getting $ from Australia, etc. I very recently bought my copy of Karl's book so I know he's still offering it.

FYI - In Karl Kahler's book, The Cult That Snapped, A Journey Into The Way International, on page 56 (the first of many references concerning Rev. Wade) there is an account of his getting involved in 1965 and a record of Karl's phone interview with him.

I invite any 2nd corps member or anyone who knows how I can reach any 2nd corps, to contact me at cooees-91643@mypacks.net. Thanks.