Galen

rascal: "Galen...maybe it was because I was *corpes spouse* that things were different" I do apologize if in any way I was a part of what turned out to be so horrible for you and others in TWI. We saw great love and kindness among beleivers and within fellowships in TWI, though never if that twig had Corpse in it. And as such we avoided corpse most of the time. "...I am simply relating the personal experiences and instructions of 15 years of twi in different states under different leaders...." I am sure, I never meant to imply that these things did not happen, I am sure they did, again I am sorry. "There are ex twi women who put out a magazine in my state....every article was about...how to find your spiritual equal so that submitting isn`t a problem...how to please your man....what to do if your man is spiritually *inferior* and you still must submit....it`s box thinking at its worse...without a man to submit to...they were lost..." Various times, Bonnie would call around and gather support from ladys in the area and she would put together women's days for doing word-studys, etc. I recall once I think it was in Virginia that she did this and later after she had been doing this one-day per month thing for a few months, the Limb called and wanted to know what it was about and who she was to be leading it. I think it was Tom and Barbra Lally who were the LCs. Bonnie just did what seemed to be needed. "I have found that we have a whole set of responsibilities as wives...and having the guts to stand up and confront your spouse when they are being bu tt heads...or in defense of yourself and your children is at times necessary...it is also necessary to take a stand and be adamant when they are making a mistake that will adversely affect your entire family....none of those are allowed under the *submit to spouse always* rule." True. "Twi teaching in no way prepared me to be the wife that my husband needed...." Perhaps more time should have been spent studying the Bible, rather than not.

Bob: "The strongs definition I found was a military term, to be under rank to another." "Personally, I don't care if the military definition is right and that is what Ephesians is saying. Paul's attitutde toward women (and marriage) was deplorable and I don't care for it." I have had an issue with a part of this tpoic for many years. I have heard it taught and repeated many times in many arenas, an idea of what 'military-order' is all about. This is done largely by civilians and their vague idea of what it is like to be in the military. I was a highly trained system expert, on any given boat that I served onboard, the systems that I worked on, nobody else know to the degree that I knew. If anyone had a question about the capability of that system or equipment, they were sent to me. Be it the Captain, or anyone else; "What is the current limitations of this equipment?", "How does that effect the functioning of this boat?". Whether it be the Captian or anyone else, I would be given the respect and dignity of being responsible for my systems. When I served as "Ship's Intelligence Officer", I was expected to KNOW great details of missions and force strengths and nation's capabilities. They would come to me asking for a breifing or with a detailed question. Because in the military we do respect each other. Yes there is an aspect (which civilians seem to focus on exclusively) wherein "I said jump, and you need to jump". How ever in my limited military career (20+years) there was almost always the respect due me. "We need this anchor raised immediately, raise it" "Sir, the anchor windlass is broken and not capable to lifting it right now, we need to either cut the anchor lose, or rig wenches to haul the anchor up with manually". The over-whelming majority of orders given within the military are in the form of: "Men, we need to accomplish X---X in the next two hours." "sir, I will get the truck, and Smith can get more guys to help us load it, and we will get it all there within two hours". "Very well, carry on". I have ordered servicemembers into hazardous situations. I have always done it with respect and given them the option of suggesting a better way of doing things, in case my viewpoint was limited and they knew of a better method. Non-professional officers and NCOs leading a bunch of draftees or part-timers might well ignore advice and do things to the exclusion of better ideas. Sorry but there are stupid people out there. Doing such will only come back to bite them later. Those grunts know their leaders are idiots, thus the phrase of "fragging the Lt" (dropping a grenade into the floor of the officer's jeep as it drives by), to help clean the gene pool. If I need to accomplish something, and I focus on my ideas of how to do it, and completely ignore the advice and wisdom of experts; I am stupid. This applies whether I am leading men in Kosovo, or whether I am purchasing land for a new home for my family (which I am doing). I do see wonderful principles for eladership within the military, but they are not the same ideas that most civilians have. And I am the 'leader' of my household, and I apply the same ideals in the family life as I did in the military. Okay, fine, I said it. I am ready, flame away. P.S. be gentle.

Smurfette- “. . . since I am used to the verbal abuse, guilt, slave mentality and submitting that twi teaches.” The only abuse that I saw was from corpse-leadership. Not everyone went along with it. I certainly don’t mean to imply that it did not happen, it certainly did happen. Though I don’t recall ever feeling that there was any ‘slave mentality’ going on. Zshot- “I thought marriage is supposed to be a partnership between 2 people who respect and love each other. A marriage should never be a dictatorship.” Dictatorships are wrong. Is that really what you say being taught? Rascal- “I am still married to my twi spouse...it is a tough road...both of us have many years of pre conditioning, not to mention just down right wrong teachings concerning our partnership.” I am glad it is still working for you guys. I am also still married to my wonderful loving Bonnie, 23 years now. “I know so many ex way women who continue with distorted views of their role and function in a marriage...even years after leaving....it is very sad.” I am still the head of my household, I even have my wife’s permission to say so. ”We think it`s pretty funny now....my husband occasionally bemoans his lost *God hood* status enjoyed while we were involved...” He really saw / understood the doctrines as being that he had a ‘god-hood’ status over you? Wow. “. . . someone who will treat you with dignity and respect....rather than the 2nd class citizen status that most men in twi were taught to employ.” I entirely agree that dignity and respect are needed, but aren’t we “equals in the sight of g-d”? (Forgive me for quoting TWI here.) Oldy- “I had much admiration and respect for all women, both married and single. Lots of single women were my coordinators, and very respected.” I have always admired and respected the ladys. I think more so, as I grew in TWI. While I was never in a fellowship that was lead by a female, I did hear of them, and it was my understanding that they were common in many areas, just not area military bases so much, as we had huge populations of men and very few females. “As I recall, married women were expected to submit to their husbands. Is that biblical? Yes, it is. So I understand the connection if one's a bible believing christian who wants to do what the book says. And that was supposed to be what twi was all about, the word, the word, and nothing but the word. right?” That was my understanding, though apparently from what we have both read here on Greasespot and on the previous greasespot there were many who seemed to have taken it too far. rascal- “. . . You were not at the womens *advances* where we were taught how to properly *serve* the men.” My Bonnie did coordinate a number of branch woman’s days and advances. I can’t imagine that the topics we list were among those she focused on. “You were not at the counceling sessions where the women were told that *sex* was required when where and how the spouse wanted...even if you were furious with them...spiritually you were required to submit.” Neither was I. Again not to say it did not happen, rather I would imagine that it did happen. I just can’t imagine ever taking any issue of my household to a corpse-leader for ‘counseling’. “Maybe you were not witness to some leaderscreaming at his wife to submit...I was.” Again I would have imagined that such public conduct would have immediately dis-tracted from the reputation and respect of that ‘leader’. “You were not forced to *obey* like some recalcitrant child because the *man* was in charge...nor passed over for leadership positions because as long as *men* were available...” I did see females passed-over for twig leadership, though again in areas where there was one female per ten men. On occasion when I went to sea, my wife (Bonnie) did take over running the fellowship in my absence. (not to say that I occasionally went to sea, but rather that she did not always take over the fellowship). “The ONLY position a woman in twi was qualified for was *horizontal* “ I would strongly dis-0agree with this statement, though obviously I did not see or hear what you say and heard. If you were told this, then I apologize. “Our sole responsibility was to serve the *man* be they spouse or otherwise so that they could *best teach the word*...PERIOD” I would have thought that we all had and still have many responsibilities, primarily being to our Lord and Master Christ Jesus. And to those in our households. ”Our thoughts...intuitions and areas of expertise were ignored...” That would have been an error. Anyone of spiritual birth and maturity who is receiving ‘insight’ or who simply has experience in an issue should be respected and their counsel sought after. I certainly have always sought Bonnie’s wisdom and insight on any issue that I face. I did while we were active in TWI, and I still do today. “Not in all marriages...no...many men had more integrety than to behave in the manner that twi recommended....many men rose above what they were taught...” Then again many of us, knocked heads with corpse-leadership every time we sat in their presence.

The first time, I heard the math showing that demons are out-numbered, was at the advanced class. I remember showing many people at work after that the verses. Not meaning to contradict you, but I do recall clearly that it was taught.

WaywardWayfer: "What do you believe about angels? We were taught that they were only around long enough for a person to get saved and then we were on our own. . . . Psa 91:11 It seems to contradict that teaching." I think that you are possibly missing it, a little. As I understood and taught it, G-d does know who is going to be saved and some of the angels may be charged with guarding you as such. During previous administrations, when they were not born of spirit, they often really needed help. Now with grace and the possibility of being born of spirit, we may or may not strive to be storng in the spirit and be able to defend ourselves. Even a born-again beleiver may still help in his defense, it was not that angels can not help you once you are born again, as they still could. But rather the encouragement for us to study the Bible, pray, walk with Christ, have a personal relationship with Jesus, and to be strong as 'Sons of G-d'; if we are to one day rise up and be greater than the angels, then we dont further 'need' them to guard and protect over us. Obviously their will always be some among us who will always need others to shield them (until of course the coming of Christ to gatrher us in).

dmiller: "And I am here to SALUTE such a dedicated patriot! :D-->" It is often a tough job, but sone has to do it. Without the meds and diet (though currently the docs say that diet has no effect on my levels), my cholesterol was 400+ (their machine was not capable of reading an exact number only that it was above 400.). With meds they maintain me currently at 200-220. My grandparents ate a breakfast of: 6 fried eggs cooked in fresh drippings, Butter milk biscuits, a glass of tangy fresh buttermilk, with butter and homemade breakfast jam (they made 2 different kinds of jams one regular one for frineds and one extra sweet for breakfast), apple-pie with lard crust / or canned peaches or pears in heavy syrup, coffee. lunch was: hot soup (served hot, because if it cooled it became a soild from the lard that was added in give flavour), beef (a roast, or casserole, or steaks), mashed potatoes with lots of heavy gravy, a vegetable covered with butter or melted cheese, buttermilk biscuits with jam (this was the less-sweet jam), fruit in heavy syrup. Dinner (during 'good' years) was usually chicken (if fried then left-overs are good the next day to take out into the fields for lunch), mashed potatoes, vegetables. On 'bad' years dinner would shift to stews with thicker layers of lard, or fish. One grand father was a diabetic so he died early, maybe 85. The other 3 each died in their 90's. One grandmother continued milking cows and running a dairy until she turned 90. They were all very active, got up before sun-rise and worked. When they stopped working, we could pretty much graph their decline. I am fairly sure that they all had high cholesterol, and they all consumed eggs, pork, beef, cream, cheese, butter and lard, every day and in large amounts. None of them died from anything diagnosable. They each stopped working, refued to eat, and slowly degraded into frailty, until their hearts stopped in their sleep. Man walking on the moon, and the computer age had far more to do with their demise than cholesterol did. Born in the first decade of the century; farmed with horse-drawn plows; taught and raised children in one-room school-houses; lost their homes in the dust-bowl and lived in model-Ts, their children were migrant field-hands when they got married off, climbing took a long time. I remember as a child, during Apollo, they each refused to beleive. When I was on my first sub, they had no basis from which to understand where I lived and worked. I think that 'future-shock' is a far more deadly condition than cholesterol.

As a kid I always heard about peach pits doing that. But then again cherrys, peaches, apricots, and almonds are all very close to each other.

Great Oak Pizza, yes. My wife currently works on Groton Subase at the Commissary. We live in Norwich just up Rt12.

Oldy- “Have you had a colonoscopy? It is recommended for all folks over 50, and doesn't hurt for anyone to get one in their 40's if they wish.” No. May I ask who WANTS to have a colonoscopy? They used to say that they recommend one at five-year intervals starting at age 40. When I turned 40, I saw this on a wall of the doctor’s office. I asked if he was going to schedule me for one of ‘those’, he said that recent thought had changed and they were shifting the recommendation back to 50. I think that when I turn 50, they will likely shift it again, back to 55. I have had many esphogy***** (the thing where you swallow a garden hose with a video camera on the end of it) in the military most OB/GYNs have one so they can look into deep dark places. I have one annually to monitor my ulcer. Did you say that you WANTED to poked where? Ckeer- “Also a note on "Grinders". In Connecticut and Massachusetts where I used to live, a Sub was a cold sandwich like a rost beef or ham and cheese sub. A grinder was the same sandwich but they would bake it in a pizza oven for about 5 minutes.” Excuse me. “There are only two things on the ocean; Subs and targets” So says my T-shirt. Here I thought a sub was a cool place to live and work. Dry environment (unless you work with reactors) steady temperatures (70degrees +/- 2) the freshest water (we make it ourselves you can get water any fresher) clean air (we make this too) a chance to get away from our wives and free ourselves from their pheromones.

LearnedTooLate: "You might want to get your doctor to check your liver enzymes and compare them with what they were before you started Lipitor. . . ." Each time I go in to see a doctor, I hit the lab first about 2 weeks early, for a "liver function test". It is the only thing the docs want to see when evaluating Cholesterol meds. At least in my experience.

Watered Garden: "Nice to hear from you. How was Maine?" Very nice, I had gone up last summer and entered escrow to purchase some land but had problems with passing the requirements for a septic system, had to back out of the purchase. Though that trip was very nice. This time, everything went well, I looked at I think over 40 propertys, found one I like. Actually two lots (a 44 acre and a 104 acre) We want one and the in-laws want the other. "I have a script for Pravachol, am trying south Beach Diet instead. I probably wouldn't worry about any of this, except I am diabetic and thus more prone to heart attacks anyway." Bonnie and I read a lot about the atkins/south-beach, it did get us to thinking, though trying to limit our carbs is hard. With our herd, we live on pasta and bread. The whole trip to Maine I found grinders in a Grocery Deli for $2.50 that I liked, but again the bread. "Did they ever say anything about staying out of the sun? I was told to stay out of the sun and not drink grapefruit juice or eat grapefruit. Or drink alcohol." I was told that there could be reactions to the sun, and the grapefruit thing. Each time, I see a doctor they ALWAYS review my drinking habits. One glass of wine at dinner, never more; Bonnie one the other sometimes will have 2-3. Then later I do rum, usually 2 bottles every 2 weeks. Since starting Zocor and Lopid, I have gone through 6 doctors, they have all insisted that they need to monitor my drinking, though at this level of drinking it is NOT an issue with the meds. Apparantly among sailors heavier drinking is common and only when you get into far heavier drinking does interaction with the meds become an issue. So yes grapefruit and alcohol seem to have the possibility of interactions, however that is only for heavy social drinkers.

In 1997 it was noticed that my cholesterol levels went up (when I turned 38). I spent a year meeting with a nutritionist each month and adjusting my diet, they monitored my cholesterol and saw that dietary changes had almost no effect. In 1998 they started me on meds, one month at a time, increasing the dosages each month. It took another year to finally get the dosages 'worked-out'. I have been on: Lopid (gemfibrozil) and Zocor (Simvastatin), ever since. Now they just check my levels and write a new script once a year. So far I have not noticed any side-effects. I guess that I am lucky. I hope your ill-effects dont worsen.

I have attended a service at a 'UU' church. I found it interesting to flip through their hymnal, as well. songs to a christain god, songs to Gaia, songs to Har Krishna, songs to Allah, songs to mother nature. If you made an attempt to combine ALL religous beleifs and blend them together, into a single service. Historically the Unitarians were a neat group, simply the beleif that there is a single deity. Whether we call that deity: Yawweh, or Allah, or Elohim. It came from a century earlier when deists were common. (Ignoring Thomas Paine who wrote a lot and carried things in an entirely different direction) Mostly Christains, some Jews; beleiving that organized churchs were bad and controlled mens lives. They wrote a lot about their beliefs in a single Biblical Deity, and included some very devout people (though because they did not attend the 'legal' churches of the day, deists were often not recorded as being devout). .

To our experience it seems fairly common among churches to teach tithing. We do it, though we use a separate bank account for our tithe and give to different things. We buy Bibles from publishers and stock libraries. Or help pay for medical treatments, etc.

By the way, I checks my facts, I used bad numbers, Ooops. I apologize. There seem to be only 136,000 un-wanted children currently free for adoption in America.

Shellon: "Oldies said ....after screwing up" "Huh? Since when is a child a screw up?" As a foster parent, my I add, that from my own direct experience there exist many many 'adults' out there who have children, who view those children as 'screw-up's. They hate their children. Everytime they can not do something, or go somewhere; they see their child as the factor that keeps them from being 'happy'. There are a LOT of un-wanted children in our nation. By the count of websites that list adoptible children, there are over 150,000 children currently in America, free for adoption; because their parents have abandoned them, or their parents are career felons, or their parents have failed many attempts at sobriety, or their parents molest them. There is over 100,000 that are not so luck as to be in that statistic yet. These are the ones that are still 'not-free-for-adoption'. Maybe their child-molesting-father still has parental-rights and visitation. Or their coke addicted mother convinced a judge to allow her to continue hooking for another 6 months while she trys to get straight. I have had foster children in my home, who were living with both of these above situations. They were told that they are screw-ups, that they are hated, un-wanted. And yet few people are willing to adopt here in America. My own brother would rather pay $65,000 to purchase a little girl overseas, so he does not have to think about the injustices of our society. There are children who are told daily that they are 'screw-ups'. We have thousands of un-wanted children born every year. To my way of thinking, you can't tell someone not to abort, unless you have already adopted a handful of those un-wanted children.

We enoyed most of VPW's classes and we liked the univercity of Life classes. We stayed in hoping to attend more of the U of L courses, but then they retracted every course beyond Thess. I remember a number of times, while I was in port, Bonnie and I would talk about it. We liked having the fellowship, we liked doing PFAL classes. But we hated going to the annual Limb-meeting/corps-recruitment-meetings. In each state, In each Area we loved working with beleivers. But whenever we had to go to Limb and deal with Corps, it was always a bummer. Very negative and demanding.

I really did not think of this, until tonight. While talking with my children in the car tonight, I was listing all my syblings for them (I figure it is good for my children to hear storys about my syblings and to be familiar with their names). My foster-daughter said that I had a lot of syblings. So here goes. From my mother (a previous marriage): Sister Judy (*); Brother Jerry (**); Brother David (*); and I. From my mother's current husband (a previous marriage): Brother Kenneth (single); Sister Lori (***); From my father (another previous marriage): Brother Carl (****). From my father's current wife: two brothers (****) From the foster-family that I lived with as a teenager: Brother Kenny; (&) Brother Steven; (&) Brother Martin. (***) (&) has no further children. (*) has children (nieces/nephews of mine) of whom I have met. (**) has children (nieces/nephews of mine) whom I have met, but those children now have children of whom I have not met. (***) has children (neices/nephews of mine) of whom I have NOT met. (****) I have never met this sybling. Does that make 12 of us?

One of my Grandfather's had 11 syblings, his wife 5. My other Grandfather I dont recall, but that grandmother had 13 syblings. It is kind of cute the naming thing. I once dated a girl who was a triplet. She was 'Darlene' her sisters were "Arlene" and "Marlene".

While I fully agree that the media is entirely out of control and TV is full of stuff that is over-whelmingly bad for us; That is also the 'Islamic' argument (and largely why they dont like us, thus our current war), it is the argument of religous fundys of many religions (consider the Mennonites, Amish, etc). On the other hand, wow what prudes we are. .

We have a lot of squirrels in our backyard. The vets we use are US Army vets (because they are on the base), they are good at treating our animals generally, but they dont know much about 'local' issues. Actually they won't even with me about my bees, or their mites. Know any good local vets?

This month we did the flea+tick drops on Ginger (our german Shepherd) on the 5th of May. Today I had to drive into Northern New York to get some honeybees and on my return the children were shouting that Ginger had a tick on her. Sure enough in the fur around her throat I found 2 tick, big fat ones (thankfully not the deer ticks). Today is just the 22nd. Perhaps re-treating once a month is not enough? In the past I have sprayed my property lines (mostly bushes) and on the foundation of the building with insecticide, a few times over the course of the summer. I have not sprayed this year. Last year I was fairly concerned about spraying such, as I do have 2 bee hives and I did not want to hurt my bees. Any ideas? Lately we have been brushing the dog about daily, as she is shedding a lot. So I am confident that these today were her first ticks of the season.

This certainly is a good topic of concern. I flea treated our dog the first of this month, and will continue to do so the first of every month, till fall comes. Last summer we tried going two months (even though the packages say that they are good for three months), but 6 weeks later we would start finding fleas. So the 'three-month flea + tick drops' used monthly seem to work. We have friends who own beach property in East Lyme, and we usually go there twice a week through the summer (swimming, sailboating, fishing, grrl-watching). Probably the heart of Lyme carrying deer-ticks. :)-->

def59: "and Galen, et al. "1. The Father is greater than the Son and therefore they are not equal." I agree that they are not equal in strength or power. def- the Father and the son are not the same person, but they share a level of equality as part of the Godhead." Cool, and since Jesus is my brother, and I am told to think of myself as Jesus thought of himself, and Jesus and I are equal; then I am a part of the Godhead too. Wow. Joint-heirs is such a cool idea, neither heir is above or below any other heir, all having the same claim to power and authority. Exactly equal to each other.

Wow a meeting here in Connecticut. Cool! I am sorry that I missed it. Been a long time since we had chinese food. I look forward to the possibility of meeting you guys in the future. I even made the trip up to Unity, Maine last summer in the hopes of possibly meeting some folks up there.