Eagle

Exie: Condemned because you were Corps. I believe that. I really, really believe that, too. There was no way to win. Most likely the Corps grads were the worst abused. And you held another job. I kind of went ballistic a little on a guy after I left my second year in the Corpse. Didn't really get violent. But after reading yours and many others, in particular many of the women here, I am amazed so many of you were able to hold your tempers and not come out swinging. Reading events here makes mine seem minor in comparison. I believe each person that had crap like that thrown at them in this thread deserves a Cool Waters Ex-TWI Purple Heart.

What I remember are the constant squealing on each other, turned in for an infraction that was not an infraction. Constant correction on just exactly how you said something. The constant scowl. The hateful phrase, "If you don't like it, you can leave!" Offenses taken at the drop of a pin. Condemned for not having enough money. Condemned for being sick one weekend. Just plain condemned. Condemned you were not Corpse. I remember. I remember a lot of it. To be fair, the first thirteen or so Corps seemed okay to me. After that, all Hell broke loose.

Has anyone seen Steve and Julie Spielberg? Steven Spielberg was in the Way AV department for years before apparently getting work outside TWI. I am not sure if they are still in or not. Julie's maiden name was Julie Albie. Eagle

As far as Bush is concerned, I voted for him because I didn't want Kerry in the White House. Aside from that, I never want to see another Bush as long as I live. For a Christian president he sure lets a lot of Christian civil rights get attacked with never a word. Hardly a Ronald Reagan. But I am still basically Republican with a little bit of Democrat in me. I think that means I am possessed by Ross Perot.

We had a Toledo fellowship going on when we discovered he was in Toledo. We spoke of whether or not we would allow him into fellowship. I know we were supposed to forgive, but...sometimes you have to use common sense. He was and most likely is a lech. He would try to control, yell, scream, go after the women in fellowship. We all unanimously voted no, he could not come to our fellowship. He never asked. We just prepared an answer in case he did. I suppose a few would disagree. Others would hopefully see our situation. He was banned. Which was rather ironic. We actually voted to mark and avoid the guy.

Quote from Rafael: If anyone has exposed fallacies involved in the "infallable" PFAL, it has been Raf at Living Epistles Society. God help this guy. I've been kinder to VPW myself, but not all that kind.

I nominate PJ Roberge as president, Paw as vice-president, Karl Kahler as secretary-treasurer, Raf in charge of the research dept, dmiller in charge of the Corps. Ron Lopez in charge of Way Productions, exie in charge of the trunk since she can communicate fast and furious, Doug McMullan in charge of grounds, and the rest of Grease Spot taking over all other activities. I wonder what would happen then.

Eagle is just the bird I admire the most. The earliest large bird from my memory. It also was a sign off on my handle in Vietnam.

That is so cool.

In my last year, I was the poorest I had ever been, making just over $5000 for the entire year. I gave of my gross earnings, 10 to 15%, many times 15%. When I was in literal rags of clothing, I was sneered at by leadership even when I tried to make the used old clothing look good. My car was a junker and I was not allowed to drive it on grounds. The reason I made so little money was the demand on my time as apprentice Corps...for which TWI paid me nothing. If I didn't do these things, I was lower than a snake. When I made the decision to revolt, stop giving them anything, including time and money, that was when my life took off. Yup, like exie, I was told exactly the same. In no uncertain terms we were to give 10% of our gross, later changed to 15%.

If people who left or were marked and avoided by TWI are now welcomed back, then I suppose Doug McMullan and others can now come on grounds and visit the cemetary and the firegrounds as well. Also, JP Wierwille should be able to walk freely on the grounds along with other Wierwilles. The best thing TWI can do is donate the old Wierwille home with the Fountain of Living Waters to the Wierwille's and let Mrs. Wierwille live out her last days in peace there with a home nursing Alzheimers staff present. The Wierwilles can then visit her there. This is a little of a start. Other than that, I can't take it seriously. Besides, I don't agree with most of their doctrine anymore so I can't find a reason to want to go back there anyway other than to look up old friends.

Exie, That sounds like a really nice church. Bless your wonderful heart for your prayers, too. We still continue prayer for both of them. We probably always will. To be honest, we literally became afraid to ask others to pray for them now, afraid of what they think of them and what they would think of us ever since being ignored for prayer requests. I guess we have to get over it and gain the courage you have to just go to the church and ask. God Bless your heart so much. Eagle

Fellow Greasespotters, Your words really lifted me so much. I have to share them with my wife. It seems all here would have prayed for our kids if we asked. My wife was so hurt she thought she was considered worthless for even asking for the prayer. It is true her two (and now mine) adult children strayed from the path, both in trouble with the law, not taking anything seriously, one almost in prison were it not for us (and we believe especially God) intervening. During our prayer one of our sons was involved in a fatal auto accident. My step-son, the metally challenged one, being passive as he is, was sitting in the front seat of the car before leaving when his "best" friend told him he wanted the front and for him to get in the back. My step-sons two friends sat in the front drinking while he fell asleep. He awakened in the hospital and found out that the one that took his place in the front seat was killed instantly, and the other was the driver who had his legs crushed and is not expected to live more than a few years more. The funny thing is, our mentally challenged one is the one now asking us about God, though he fumbles through life a lot. But he is alive now and has no permanant injuries from that accident. He used to like to hang around with punks but now stays away from them. His life has improved tremendously. The other has normal intelligence and had recently called about church. That is surprising because he was considered the biggest punk in his county. He had a record of several assaults and so many awful mistakes. He missed prison by a hair. Today he does none of the things he did just a year and a half ago. I think the clergyman thought that the guys deserved what was coming to them and deserved no prayer. That is my thinking on that. Debbie and I had no where else to go but God. Both had refused our advise for more than five years. Suddenly now, though, they both listen. All I know is what we have seen in their lives since beginning prayer. We just thought it might be helpful to have an ordained person helping us in prayer. Greasespotters prayed for me once and I have to say I was delivered. At least I like to think so. It was that colon cancer scare. I had the bleeding and the polyp and the family history of cancer. The biopsy report came back negative. I like to believe a lot of people here helped me in prayer, regardless of whether they "liked" me or not. Well, God bless everybody! Eagle

I hope no one believes here that if God accepts a homosexual into Heaven or Paradise that that person is still a homosexual when he or she is there. According to what I have read, we are given new bodies, so if the cause of homosexuality is physical, then God will change that with this new body. If the cause is spiritual, then this person is removed from spiritual influences causing it. If the cause is mental or due to a free-lancing or free-spirited attitude that put them in bondage, then we are told we are to receive "full knowledge" with this new body and this should take care of that. I am pretty sure God won't be cow-towing to the opinions of men or women. He is going to do what He set out to do.

Jonny! It's BRAVO to you for your non-comprimising stand on God's Word. You have done well. Linda, vickles, I'm not sure but someone in this thread said to Jonny "Who are you to judge?" Hell, I'll judge then. I won't even use the Bible. I'll use freakin' cosmic common sense. Homosexuality is on the upside down portion of the universe. I'll voice my opinion, state it loud and clear, have often said it right back to gays and lesbians who decided, after I was minding my own business in college, to just say it as straight as they said it "queer", to use their very own term. If they don't speak about it to me, I don't bring it up. If they bring it up in public or to me directly, they will hear from me if it is within earshot. I will vote and I have to judge to vote. I will judge and keep judging. I will speak and speak loud, hard and clear. I don't need the Bible for that. This is America. Go ahead. Pass a "hate crime" law that says I can't disagree with this. I'll laugh at it and speak anyway. What are they going to do...send the thought and anti-free speech police?

My wife has a couple of adult kids, one mentally challenged and both ran into trouble with the law. We have finally succeeded in getting them both straightened out, and the mentally challenged son is now protected in a specialized and supervised environment in the county he resides after much expense and effort by us. My wife, during those troubling times, had trouble getting an-Ex-TWI ordained clergyman to pray for her children. We never asked for money or any support whatsoever. She emailed the reverend about the problems asking for prayer only and he would not answer her. He came to fellowship and when it came time for prayer requests, she brought up prayer requests for her two children (my step-kids). The reverend she emailed was there and she was hoping he just never read his email in the last month or so, so she requested prayer again for the two children she had. The man got up and walked out during the prayer and came back after the prayer was over. We began to believe, although the man would not admit it, that this clergyman didn't believe our two kids were worth prayer. I have heard teachings on some of this. Anyway, my wife and I prayed day and night for the two of them and now both are fine and upholding their own, though one is disabled but almost self-sufficient with the help of a case-worker. The bad times passed and the two definitely changed their attitudes and have improved their lives. We have prayed ernestly and continuously that both would be led to the Lord and just recently the older one called and asked us about a church he wanted to go to and the younger one also called and asked about the Bible as well. They haven't gotten far on Christ yet, but it seems to be a start. I need input into the idea that some people are considered 'worthless' to pray for. That is how we took this rejection for prayer for our kids by this clergyman. Any ideas on this?

Hi Steve! I don't mind the race issue in diversity. But as far back as 1998 many corporations in Ohio are puching to include 'gay' tolerance and force employees to take it or it is their job. This has not happened to me yet because my company obviously knows the trouble it would cause here but it is true. They are in fact pushing sexuality into diversity. I am shocked the foster parent program makes one sign statements about not speaking against homosexuality. This means the foster parents have no right to train the children they are helping to raise in a moral or religious environment, therefore, the state has taken one of at least four courses of action, foster parents are discrimated against based on religion, which is a crime, or, the program, all government run, is stating that a religion that says homosexuality is okay, or those that traditionally do not believe in God or give a damn about gay or straight may foster the children, or, while you can not teach against homosexuality, you are allowed to teach in favor of it. This foster care program is so ripe for a constitutional lawsuit and possible monetary or punitive damages. Perhaps even cancellation. Good luck. Only a matter of time. I would just take the foster kid and teach him the Bible anyway. You can sign the document under protest, and state that. What are they going to do about it? Take the children because I actually took them to church or taught them some biblical morality?

If I worked for a corporation where I was forced to take a diversity class, meaning they decided to equate homosexuality with race, then I consider this indoctrination, an intrusion into my religious perspective, and request the company I be excluded from such a class. If they said I had to take it or it was my job, and I am forced to take, and mind you, accept (that is the idea of the class) this gender-bending sexuality scenario, then it is an area where the issue of sexuality, and therefore sex, is being forced on me against my will by threatening my job. I would then sue the corporation and cite sexual harassment as one of the charges. I know some attorneys who feel the same, and they are biting for some money. Trouble here is, almost no one sues. I do not believe corporations should be in the business of teaching morals or "counter" morality. Fortunately, I work for a company that promotes REAL tolerance and respects the rights of people to believe what they believe. If something is overtly offensive, it is shut down. But things such as Christmas, Hannakah, Ramadan and even Kwanssa are allowed to be discussed and employees may post what they will in their own office space. I believe my corporation leaves sexuality to families and churches. Diversity at our place means diversity of ideas. Race, gender, and sexuality have nothing to do with it and are a waste of time. If an employee doesn't like Christmas or Easter posters in the company, the employee that doesn't like them does not rule and they do not tear down everyone else's individual posters or company posters. That employee is advised to tolerate the opinions of their fellow employees on their religion which is expressed only by their posters and the employee has to respect the right of the employer to celebrate Christmas or whatever holiday. We have some gays working there and everyone understands we have to work together with them. No one brings up their sexuality. We let it alone so much as those that are gays don't try to bring it up as an issue in the workplace. As far as lesbians vs gay men, I did not notice or have any idea that one group was accepted more than the other in some areas. Never thought on it or had it come to mind. The company has made over $400 million in profits in five years.

LCM lives in Lucas County where I live. I believe the house bought by TWI is his residence, legally. If he is listing New Knoxville as his residence, his divorce might end up being no good if filed there if something came up. That is if LCM filed for it. If Donna filed for it, it is in Auglaize County. Or should be. Isn't that the county where TWI is? Ohio law would stipulate one of these two counties, unless they went to a state which allowed legal divorces from anywhere. Nevada is one and Las Vegas, just as you can get a quickie wedding, can get a quickie divorce and keep it secret. A divorce is a good idea if they don't want each other anymore. LCM can just move on with his life then. Let's just hope he doesn't mess around the second time around. I hate divorce. But I know it is necessary sometimes. I feel bad for the Martindale kids in all this.

JM: ExCathedra may be 48 but looks 25. Okay. If you end up taking the "WAP" Class or the PFAL class, there is a webpage that will link you to articles to systematically debunk anything taught in these classes. It is: TWI Articles Also: This link: Ex-Way World Also, another good site is: Messiah 7 Good Luck and God Bless, JM. Eagle

I'm not sure how people here at GS will feel about what I say here, but if LCM had ever attacked my wife after she died like that, I'd be seeking him out in the woods near his chalet and I would show no mercy. I don't think I could hold my temper. Thank God it wasn't my wife. But it makes me furious to think about Suzie being attacked like that after something horrible happens to her. She needed love and compassion after her death, and especially her family needed it. I was already 'marked and avoided' after threatening a Corpse guy harassing me on the phone in 1993. (I just said I would come to his house and call him out to the street if he called me again). Nothing really violent. It never came to that. But threatening and speaking evil of my family, my wife, the closest to me, REALLY gets me angry. Well, God Bless Suzie and may God forgive LCM.

Lorna: Just on curiosity, I'll pass on your sign on and see what he says. If he says nothing, no harm done. If he goes for it, you two marry and you live in the Hamptons.

Raf! You shrunk! You really do look like a red X. That's what I get from trying to decaffeinate myself and drink beer instead. I'm on my seventh cup of Heineken.

I didn't think this thread would be so hilarious!!!!!!! Oh, your welcome, Exie. You deserve it. Go tell your husband that GS has declared you an official hot babe. Hey Cool Waters! You have any art for the hot babe awards of GS? We have a lot of hot babe awards to give out!

What do I look like? Well, did you ever see the skinny guy with glasses on News Radio that was always screwing up? Well, I'm not that hot.