George Aar

BTW, my son speaks Mandarin Chinese, and seeing as how "Northern Mandarin" is simply a regional dialect, I'm sure he'd be quite capable of understanding the majority of your "tongue".

Galen, You could post a recording of you speaking in your tongue. Then we could go about trying to find somebody who recogizes it as an actual language. Yeah, I know, I know, it's not "decent and in order", huh? You'll pardon me if I don't get real excited about relayed events that happened "one time" and everybody there "just knew". I've heard one too many of those type of testimonies over the years. God delights in being inscrutable I guess...

"no person could decipher the accuracy of tongues." Well, there you have it. The final word on the subject. "I believe it, therefore it must be true." No study, no evidence, no corroboration, thank you very much, just believe dammit. You'd think maybe a trained linguist who spent several years studying the practice might be worth a glance, but no, he can be dismissed with the wave of a hand. No need to even look at his study. After all we "KNOW", don't we?

Indeed, but, you know, it would work either way, Dems. or Reps. Gawd knows I've grown weary of both of 'em.

Oooo, here's a better link where you can get a copy of Samarin's book for only $7.95! http://theologytoday.ptsem.edu/oct1973/v30-3-bookreview8.htm Here's a snippet of the review: "It is interesting that Samarin, who examines glossolalia and "charismatic" religion from the outside as a social scientist, is also able to evaluate these movements from the inside because of a lifelong association with the Christian tradition. Quite unashamedly, he categorically relegates glossolalia to the ranks of a "pseudo-language" long used by millions of traditional Pentecostals and currently by hundreds of thousands of "neo-Pentecostals," but he does not believe that Pentecostals are "devian" in any way. This is indicative of a new approach being taken to the study of glossolalia. In chapter four, for example, Samarin describes with the pedantry of a true linguist the "form," 'meaning," and "varieties" of tongue-speech. The chapter is complete with tables and graphs and phonetic symbols, a far cry from the privately printed tracts of yesteryear which related glossolalia to a 'holy ghost language.'"

There's also a great "teaching" by Dr. William J. Samarin. Here's an excerpt from his book "TONGUES OF MEN AND ANGELS": "It is extremely doubtful that the alleged cases of xenoglossia (miraculous speech in real languages) are real. Anytime one attempts to verify them, he finds that the stories have been greatly distorted or that the 'witness' turns out to be incompetent or unreliable from a linguistic point of view" (Tongues of Men and Angels, MacMillan, 1972, pp.112-115). Here's where you can get your copy: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...=glance&s=books

I kinda thought so. Now if the baseball gods would only see fit to look kindly on the Cubbies. (I've long since given up on the Mariners, new stadium or not, they'll always be an also-ran, I fear). Congrats, now get too close to the party animals in town, kay?

Mstar, I know you were hoping for it to go to seven, but 4 straight isn't too bad is it? I mean, it's tolerable anyway, huh?

"Do you really think God designed the bible to be a puzzle to be solved, or a plain and simple record" Indeed. That was life in WayWorld, though. God's Word masquerading as a Rubic's Cube. No solution? NO SALVATION FOR YOU! Gawd, we were so gullible...

Right on the cutting edge of things, as usual, I finally saw this last night on PPV. It wasn't quite the caliber of "Oh, Brother" but it was very enjoyable. One thing you can always count on in a Coen Bros. flick is to have several scenes where the camera angle and set dressing is sooooo well done that it almost stops the show. I particularly liked the football scene (through the helmet view) and the scenes of dropping (whatever) into the barges as they passed under the bridge. This wasn't their best work, but it's still worth a look. I'd give it ***

Abigail, Just don't hi-jack any airliners or pack your car with explosives and we're cool...

Indeed Abigail, But your children SEE you and HEAR you and INTERACT with you. A HUGE difference. With this bit of advice it simply gives the Almighty an "out". Anything that goes wrong - our fault. Anything that goes right - well of course that's due to the resources already given to us of God. Yet all we have to go on is the a-priori conclusion that there is indeed someone "out there" cheering us on. That's what drives me nuts about religion. There's no concrete evidence of ANYTHING, but we're still supposed to go on acting as if there is. God is ALMIGHTY and ALL POWERFUL, but don't expect anything from him. It boggles the mind to see how little people have to go on, yet continue to staunchly defend and believe in their own personal diety. James Carville would blush at the amount of unabashed spin used to shore up our belief systems. Cheezus, could we just get honest, once?

Sorry, feeling a little cranky...

In other words, God is going to sit on his hands, regardless of what's going on. The onus is upon us to do whatever needs to be done, God's done everything He's ever going to do already. Gosh, isn't He wonderful? Religion is still bull$hit...

Ever since "Waydale" I've had a dream. Not a big dream, just a little one. My dream is that O.M. and his ilk would one day realize that some of the thousands of ex-Wayfers have maybe a smattering of logic on their side, and that maybe WayWorld wasn't any bastion of truth EVER. Then, with their new-found outlook on life they could finally move out of their mother's basement and go out into the harsh light of day and take on the world as it really is. Ah, probably not...

P-mosh, That's disgusting. Care to tell us just which "Extended Stay (America?)" you were at? That's certainly one I'd like to avoid for perpetuity. I remember checking into a "Six" motel in Rapid City, S.D. and trying to take a shower, but the hot water never came on. I called the manager, and he informed me that, yes, the water heater was broken - and had been for several days (and this was in March, still a little nippy out). "What the hell, did you think nobody would NOTICE? (You bonehead!)" It's always such a joy to find people who are so adept at their jobs.

Pat's not the only one who's well-versed in legal matters. I've seen every episode of "MATLOCK".

How about the ones that we really used, all the time? "God BLESS! You're the BEST!" (O.K. you can turn it off any time Sparky) "I LOVE you!" (You just met me a$$hole, how the hell could you LOVE anyone in that amount of time?) "Time to take a check-up from the neck-up!" (#$%& you) "People don't care what you know till they know that you care." (Oh yeah?) There's PLENTY more, but I'll let somebody else have theirs...

The only "healings" I'm aware of that the Vickster performed were those he claimed himself. Yeah, there was the supposed Jain priest with the limp arm in Jubulpore (conveniently located halfway around the world, so as to make co-roberation extra simple). But there was also his first "healing of reconciliation" (or whatever obtuse terminology he used) where a little boy at the county fair had his finger cut off. Wierwille prayed for the boy and - Voila! - his finger is miraculously restored, uh, after the surgeons spent hours stitching it back on (oh, did I leave out that part?). Then there was the infamous case of the foul-mouthed auto mechanic who always listened to Wierwille on the radio. He had a serious heart condition and again, VeePee prayed and the mechanic recovered! Oh, yeah, the doctors had been trying several new regimens on him, but you know what REALLY worked, now, don't you?

Now that you mention it, I had a goat for awhile. I brought it home for the kids (MY kids) to play with. It was a very good-natured critter. Not overly bright, but good natured all the same. She had a great propensity to eat just about everything. Cardboard boxes, tarps, garden hoses, blackberries, lumber, and it every now and then made her sick. Didn't seem to stop her though. Anyway, I don't understand the analogy much either, now that I've had one around. I felt awful when she died. R.I.P. Gigi (my wife thought of the name - short for "girl goat")...

Sky, Maybe I should clarify a bit. I stopped believing in mystical guidance from unseen sources, and lo and behold, I suddenly realized that all those "revelations" I got while a practicing Christian had a much more mundane and "senses world" explanation. Same with the "miraculous" healings, warm and fuzzy feelings of being "in fellowship" and being part of "the family of God". The feelings went away and so did any evidence of a magical holy thunderer with His hand on the controls of life. OTOH, when I quit believing in gravity, I was rudely awakened to the fact that it did, indeed, still function quite well...

To paraphrase an old witicism, The truth is that which, when you quit believing in it, doesn't go away...

"If YOU can go to the word and prove a teaching then accept it." Gosh, how simple! Now all we need is a way to interpret the Bible. There must be a class somewhere that teaches us the keys to the Bible's interpretation, doncha think?

"Another thing, the moderator does not think Adam and Eve were literal." Wow, and you find that idea controversial? I've long since given up on any concept of a "God-breathed Word", but if I was still interested in Bible stuff, I'm sure a less-literal interpretation would be the ONLY way I could pursue a study. What's so hard to accept about a lot of the stories of the O.T. being simply parabels that illustrate a "spiritual" point? Sure easier to accept than the idea of Noah's ark, what with kangaroos having to do the backstoke across the Pacific to get home, et al. The "inerrant Bible" tenet is surely the most absurd of all of TWIs B.S., IMHO...

"That's dangerous thinking... Ya know?" Indeed, as is all pseudo-science, IMHO. People throw away their medication in demonstration of their "believing", deny their children proper treatment for fear of their getting "possessed", persecute those that don't fit their model of "spiritual" wholeness, and the list goes on. The long and the short of it is, those who are willing to give credence to the bizarre and flakey without any evidence scare hell outta me...