Eyesopen

Having a backbone does not translate into being mean, or rude. It means knowing what you believe, and firmly but kindly not wavering from that point.

Excellent synopsis! And a good viewpoint for anyone to take.

Happy Birthday Acts 2! Have a great day!!!

Great Thread.

Welcome! Nice to see you again.

Some of the things that have caused us great and excruciating pains have often enlightened us to the point that when we are able to find our ways through them; Often, in the end of it all great lessons remain.

I liken the component parts of building a healthy backbone to the putting together of the puzzle parts of ourselves that we we gift to one another here!

Absolutely true statement. This why I don't forget my past like so many have said to do in threads on this site. To entirely forget could cause me to forget the lesson that resulted from the incident. For instance I have mostly forgotten the actual pain that a broken back give a person, but I have not forgotten that the pain was debilitating or what caused the broken back in the first place. Hence the lesson was not forgotten because I remember enough of my past. This is how I try to assimilate all of my "painful" experiences.

Certainly many folks here help each other to heal. And because of this the pieces of the puzzle continue to come together.

...doesn't even seem to involve twi.

Yes, you did.

...doesn't even seem to involve twi.

Where did I ever say that the incidents involved TWI?

If you are referring to my post here I hope you can explain it to me...wondering???

Not refering to this thread let alone your post.

Some synonyms for “backbone” according to the thesaurus in Word: moral fiber, strength of character, stamina, fortitude, courage, guts, grit, determination, resilience, and self-discipline.

I thought these were nifty. Thinking about twi, we never would have gotten through it in one piece without some or all of the above. It takes all that just to deal with the spiritual abuse day after day. It also takes all of it to put oneself back together again afterward. Then the day arrives when the confusion is kinda cleared up, and it's possible to stand up and speak up without tons of doubts. Rediscovering one's backbone...

And maybe in the process we discover we were worthwhile all along.

Great post ASpot! You are absolutely correct! I stand corrected. It did take tons of backbone to stay "committed" in the ministry, at least for me it did and obviously many others as well. So "rediscovering" is a better word in this instance. Yes many had to rediscover their backbone and some still have yet to do so.

Ex10- After rereading your post, ASpot is correct, it does take a lot of personal sense of self to be able to love so unconditionally I think that my original assessment of love being a different aspect was incorrect. It takes great love to stand in the gap for people and it takes great love just to hold them when they hurt. My apologies.

Reading some of these threads I have seen several who still use the ministry to prop themselves up. Those that cannot stand on an independant opinion. Those that need their opinion to be prewritten in some class or out of the mouth of some false mog. People who are afraid to say, "Oops, I made a mistake." (FOS ) Does anyone else see this? Or is it just me seeing things again...flashbacks...? :unsure:

It's ok to communicate an incident without mentioning names. Sorry you don't get that. Actually, your exact point isn't all that clear to me since i am unaware of the facts of the situation. It'd be foolish for me to automatically agree or disagree with your point about these events you speak, without some knowledge of the specific facts.

Who is "us"?

Here, do you assume that all twi participants were / are spineless?

That is your choice and no I do not. There are lots of "examples" posted here that give you "facts" if you want them. I will not break a confidence for you or anyone else. Sorry if that does not compute.

I do not expect anyone to agree or disagree with me on anything that I say. I do not even expect a response. I thought that I would share with the board exactly what I shared with someone else privately. That's all. Respond or don't. If it touches you somehow then ok...if it doesn't ok.

And if my point is not clear to you then I'm ok with that, you should be too.

Ok, I confess to being a bit confused by this thread. I understand the concept of standing up for one's self. Get that.

But, aren't there times in life, where we extend a hand of kindness and compassion, mercy and grace, where ourselves don't matter so much, because someone is in dire need of ........for lack of a better word.......help?

I'm not talking about being codependent, or an enabler, I just talking about the ole milk of human kindness idea.

Yeah, Jesus took a stand, but he never expected people to come up to his standards, he met them where they were.

Maybe we are talking about different subjects.

No it is the same subject just a different aspect of it. I was not at all refering to us being heartless only spineless. But sometimes giving help does include standing up for them as ASpot had mentioned. We could talk about the heart thing and human kindness if you like. But that was not the focus of this particular thought of mine.

Growing a backbone! I know how that feels!

I'm fairly feisty by nature - but I somehow learned to supress that and be whatever was expected of me. I was a chameleon in many ways.... No -- I didn't blend into the woodwork, but I did learn how to give what was expected.

I feel like this goes hand in hand with not being a victim. I learned who I am and what I really want in life. I figured out that from here on out - no one is to blame but ME.

I think of it the same way I think about a painting. I don't let something leave my easel until I know its the best I can do at that moment in time, because it's MY NAME that gets signed to the bottom. In my life -- not only is it my life, but GOD'S NAME also is written on it - at least would like to be a masterpiece he'd be proud to sign. If I blame someone else then I hand over the controls.

I refuse to be a victim.

I refust to be spineless.

I totally get what you are saying here Dooj. The analogy of the painting is very vivid for me. But I must admit I find it very hard to imagine you as a Chameleon of any kind.

I would also like to be a masterpiece that He would be proud to sign.

i'm not saying i've arrived but the journey is not so painful anymore

my neck still hurts

The journey never seems to end but with each step you take forward the pain lessons and strength and confidence grow. I don't think we "arrive" until the Gathering.

Huh? Can anyone tell me what we are really talking about here?

Oh, Eyes , Last December 15th I broke my backbone Ice Climbing and it's still healing up. Can I still count myself as having one?

I broke my back on my interim year out WOW. It healed and my backbone is stronger both litterally and figuratively. So ya you still got one!

Great thread, Eyes. Thanks to all for your input and insight.

Suda

You are welcome! And thank you for the compliment, it is much appreciated.

That is your choice ... just wanted to try to understand your point better.

Yes Oldiesman it is my choice to keep a confidence given to me. My point is fairly clear. I am sorry that you don't get it.

Self is OK. It is Ok to say I like this, or I don’t. It is OK to say I want to do this, or I don’t. It is OK to have an opinion. It is OK to have an independent thought. It is OK to look at something and say, “That isn’t right for me.” How many years did it take me to get to that point? More than I would have expected.

Twi was slavery to the eyes of others. That is an understatement. There are so many things involved in recovery, but acquiring a backbone and the self confidence to speak up is a big one. A real big one…huge. And a lot of steps just to get there.

Thanks Eyes for a great thread, and keep digging in that couch!!

Oh how right you are! "Self is Ok" I should put it in my tag line!

I'm gonna bounce up and down on it to see what jumps out...change that is!

Precisely Eyes.... The wierd thing is....I am at peace when I have to make a stand now...you bring to mind the times that I had to stand up to my spouse in a dramatic situation, and even though I was right, that lives were at stake....I was terrified of going against him because of being a woman that lacked virtue....of losing God`s protection...of death for my lack of meekness.

Everybody always knew better than me, even if I did per chance manage to stick by my guns, I was miserable, guilt ridden and consumed with fear.

Wow...I`d forgotten...thanks.

You're welcome...I think? Just kidding! It is always good to remember where you came from, because it makes the shining example that your life is now all the brighter!

"That bunch over there is wrong to say and do a,b,and c, and EVERYONE LOOK AT ME because I know they should say and do x,y,and z"; the better way is to just hold forth x,y,and z.

What you or I have to say isn't true because someone else is wrong.

Deciderator,

Welcome to the Spot. I am sorry that our little meeting place isn't to you liking. There are many who would agree with you concerning the above quotation. I would also agree with you but it does not apply to GS. There are of course some posters here that would in fact match this scenerio. But by and large this is not the case.

You should understand that people do not normally come here to "teach or expound" the word. That is not the purpose of GS. Says so on the front page. It also clearly states that this is not a religious site. So to come in here expecting to teach the word is not realistic.

Many were hurt by TWI and/or the people in it or running it. They come here to heal so that they can teach the word if they still have the desire to do so. If they have to tell their stories to do so then they will tell them and I for one will listen.

Ham-You are absolutely correct. While in TWI we were often told to deal with something and often, at least for me I didnt agree that something was wrong. Many times "leadership" saw things that didn't exist and would overlook blatent problems. But to be a good little Corps person you did as you were told and went over to someones house to "set them straight".

Today without their influence we can pick our battles and we can act upon our own conscience.

Skyrider-Exactly! To heal we must all grow up....again.

Oldiesman-I dont see any reason to tell those stories as so many people here in GS can give an example of learning that they have grown a real backbone since living in the real world. Rascal does just that in her post.

Rascal-You make a great point about "confidence". The first few times that we use our new found backbone, we look around and see if anyone is going to reprove us or worse slap us down. But that probably isn't going to happen and if someone does disagree then so be it we are no longer expected to agree with something that we dont agree with just to stay in the program. We are free to grow up, we are free to express ourselves and we are free to heal.

I am so happy for you!

Could be... I remember my dad talking about some horse linament that he made with sumac - he also used it as a dye. (But he was born in 1915 - and loved his home remedies.)

Sumac is nasty! Ich! I got a bunch of those nasty little bushes/trees growing in my yard. I just hate the smell of them. But I can see how they might be used as a linament.

I've been thinking, strange as is may seem this does happen upon occassion. :blink: So what I've been thinking about was our recovery as believers from the screwed up stuff that we assimilated in TWI. Recenty several "events" have taken place that I have been privy to and in each event the person involved had stood up to a person that they would never have thought of asserting themselves to even a week prior. They had suddenly realized that yes indeed they do have a backbone or had grown one quite recently.

For those of you who have grown a backbone...good on you. It apparently is spreading and I honestly hope that it becomes an epidemic among the ex-twits. So often when we were "in" we had simulated backbones. Backbones that depended upon the organization to remain rigid. Once that organization either abandoned us or spurned us we suddenly became jelly fish. Because we believed the bill of goods that they sold us. "We were nothing without them."

But now we are learning that we are "somebody" without TWI. We have a purpose and we can be happy and productive. Heck we can even be spiritual if we want to. But most of all we are "somebody" so we have the right to stand up for ourselves and we have the right to be heard and our opinion does count.

In the ministry many of us did things that hurt people in the name of the ministry and its false god vp. Often we were hateful and unfeeling or uncaring of others feelings. But now that we are not subject to TWI's false doctrines we can and should employ great compassion for our fellow humans. Remember that Christ is our example. He was strong and told people exactly what he thought. And what he thought was what God would be thinking. JC always did things with compassion and sometimes that means that you don't bend, it means that you stand your ground and take the heat so somebody else doesn't have to. If you are going to take the front then take the front. Jesus Christ stood in front of us before we were even born and took our transgessions to the Cross with him. He had a real backbone. And we are to imitate him.

Just thought that I would share the .02 cents that I found while digging in my couch with you.

WOW assignments weren't by "revelation" either. From talking to people who did them, it was based on, who had a car, etc. Absolutely nothing spiritual about them at all.

So Eyes, did that last assignment make or break you :)

Neither...joke was on them. I did well there. It was my WOW sister that was f&&99ed up. But they turned it around and kicked me off the field and out of the Corps....But they didn't tell me why until a few months later...after I had been running the Area of Northern Nevada for months at their request...Go figure. They couldn't break me so they kicked me out. They didn't want me to succede there. Hehehehe joke was on them!

Hey lady! Have a wonderful birthday!

God cuts out the male part at Christ's birth.

Then he cuts out the female part when we leave the flesh behind.

It is almost as if the original sin was sexuality in itself.

Gabriel (soul) and Michael (body)

And Christ is the holy spirit. Christ became the spirit when he was baptized.

This is why Christ had legions of angels on the cross.. Michael was there to fight for the lord's bones and Gabriel was there in his life force, the dove symbolized Gabriel taking the soul of Jesus and transferring it to the spirit. the baptism. Melchizidek would have been part of an angelic cult. Fire and water flesh and blood. Michael and Gabriel. Lucifer in his fallen state as the God of this world and the unholy spirit of law.

The fall of lucifer was the mutation that cause the rift between male and female.

It is like Y is an organism that came to live in the female species and it's presence rendered the female species dependent upon Y for reproduction.

Did the original mutation lead to the original sin?

Could you please explain where your thought process came from concerning this?

Funny how they told us that they were getting revvie from God about placements. What a crock! With me they all believed the cr@p that people say about Reno. Its a wild and crazy town doncha know....BS...its a hick town. Now Vegas...that's a different ball of wax. But Reno was and is still just a hick town, full of rednecks. We hold shows in the Reno Livestock Event Center. Yup it has a dirt floor and smells of hay and cow poop. Anyway they sent me to a tiny backwoods joint on my first WOW year and I loved it, then in res they transfered me from Emporia to Gunnison (oh please torture me some more!) But my interim year they sent me to a state that I had gotten into a very traumatic accident in when I was a child. They new about the accident because I had told someone (can't remember who now) and they had told the great and powerful Rev. Lardbutt. But God had told them to send me there! Oh Horse pucky!

So there was this thread that rosie started with:

and then there was the expected responses....

and then there was rosie explanation (that you can find if you want to), and that explanation sounded to me like rosie may have thought that we're all over here ministering to each other, you know... trying to deal with our possessors.... and that rosie was actually speaking to the borg members that had wandered in here or something.

Which made me want to take odds on whether or not they really do think that we're all possessed.

And I figure I'd take odds at 10 to 1 right now that if asked.... a member of the borg would say that if you go to the GSC, and actually consider what's being said here that you'd be "opening yourself up... BIG TIME!" Anyone want to take further odds that it's essentially word for word?

Are you joking? Is that really Rosie?

Happy Birthday Tops. Have a beautiful day!

I didn't care about the suspense one way or another. It was the life I had chosen...to allow them to dictate when and where I was to go. My first WOW year was great, when I was relocated in res. that was great, my second WOW year was miserable. I was sent to a place that would "make or break" me. It did neither, but I wanted to kill my WOW sister...does that count?