Golfie

"young and old who are seeking to increase their understanding of God's beautiful design for their functions in the household." What does twi mean by "household?" Twi household or or the couple's home? "Functions" and "household" are LCM's favorite words.

Quote: "I'm sure if Jesus bodily walked the face of the earth today, nobody in TWI would recognize him. Hell, they'd probably lead the way to crucify him." - Catcup ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TWI pharisees would say "Crucify Him! We want Barabbas!" And so would their mob-minded-faithful-TWIhousehold-followers. (Nobody in TWI would recognize the TRUE son of the Father.) If Jesus faced TWI today, this is what He would say, Those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them--do you think that they were more guilty offenders than all of you? I tell you, No; but unless you repent, change your mind for the better and heartily amend your ways, with abhorrence of your past sins, you will all likewise perish... For years I have come looking for fruit on this fig tree and I find none. Cut it down! Why should it continue also to use up the ground, to deplete the soil, intercept the sun, and take up room? (Luke 13)

"That's what really stuck out to me. The signifigance of the communion." - corrydj I am reminded of my last twi communion service before getting the boot. Only the faithful believers,who tithed and gave much more, who were out of debt or trying, could partake of the communion...ONLY IF THEY WERE WORTHY. TWI leader$h1t was so full of themselves that limb leader went to each area to perform the service. He prophesied over each family after they partook. Last mont a real pastor in a real church that i attended told us about when he was in a church in the south during the 1960s...a black man attended to desegregate it....during the communion service the ushers did not offer the bread and wine to the man....a deacon saw this misdeed and gave the black man communion...then he said to the congregation, "If this man is not included in the communion, then the entire significance the bread and wine was null and void in that congregation that day." twi failed to understand that the broken bread represents the body of Christ, which includes His church, which is ONE BODY. twi has broken up the Body of Christ for so long, excluded people, saying that you are no longer part of our body, that they LOST the mystery! twi misses out on blessings by offering communion service only once a year. Then again, they have done a poor job at it once a year. twi taught that the communion service should have the biggest collection of money...which shows their real motivation.

Danny, I still think Jesus Christ Our Passover was the best book TWI ever published. Thankfully, it does NOT include that teaching about sodomy=made sport of...I do not believe that teaching anymore. When watching The Passion Of Christ movie, my twi-brain had problems with "12 hours" (wasn't it really 48 hrs?), the t shaped wooden cross, Jesus carrying it, Judas hanged himself WITH A ROPE BEFORE the ressurrection, the comma before "today", and many more nit-picky things. (i almost forgot to mention 3 crucified verses 5.) However, my heart said this movie inspires me to make Jesus my lord, more dearly, day by day, communion service mean a LOT more to me. I am more convinced that Jesus IS THE Way...if anyone could just believe in God and go to heaven, then The Father would not have asked His Son to suffer like that. [This message was edited by Golfie on March 13, 2004 at 1:38.]

Here is my reply to dmiller's post on 3/4/04. I went to http://bible.gospelcom.net/ ( an enjoyable site to read various versions of the Bible) and looked up Ps 22 in Amplified Bible (AMP). It says what CES has in their Truth Or Tradition site. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Psalm 22 1[1] MY GOD, my God, why have You forsaken me? Why are You so far from helping me, and from the words of my groaning?(1) Footnotes "This is beyond all others 'The Psalm of the Cross.' It may have been actually repeated by our Lord when hanging on the tree; it would be too bold to say so, but even a casual reader may see that it might have been. It begins with, 'My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?' and ends [with the thought], 'It is finished.' For plaintive expressions uprising from unutterable depths of woe, we may say of this psalm, 'There is none like it'" (Charles Haddon Spurgeon, The Treasury of David). Quoted in the Gospels (Matt. 27:46; Mark 15:34; and alluded to in Matt. 27:35, 39, 43 and John 19:23-24, 28) as being fulfilled at Christ's crucifixion. 31They shall come and shall declare His righteousness to a people yet to be born--that He has done it [that it is finished]!(11) (11. John 19:30.) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Perhaps Lamsa's translation of MT 27:46 is correct "for this purpose" or "This is my destiny!" But our Lord was thinking of Ps 22 while on the tree. I always wondered why TWI never went back to chapter Ps 22 to apply "in the context" and "used before" principles. I feel now that my curiosity has been satisfied. Lent started on Ash Wednesday. Hence Mardi Gras (fat Tuesday) is the blow out party the day before. I saw The Passion of Christ movie on 2/29. It was a moving experience. God bless you.

Mike quote: Have you noticed the similarities between Jesus’ last words, Paul’s last words, Peter’s last words, and Dr’s last words? Yes to Jesus, Paul and Peter, but no to VPW. VP cannot be compared with or even named in the same sentence with Jesus, Paul, or Peter. A long time ago I got a magazine from a guy named Armstrong. He asked, "When did Jesus get born again?" His answer was, "When God raised Him from the dead." That made sense to me. Romans 1:4 says so. I do not see any reason to argue about it.

HEY MIKE, Why don't you study Jesus'teachings during the last supper when he knew that he was going to die? He gave a wealth of teachings in the gospels just befor He was taken captive to be tried and crucified. Don't you think those teachings of the lord Jesus are more important to us than some dead preacher's last words?

"Cyprian of Carthage mentions only that when the tombs burst open and the bodies were exposed, that the “bodies returning to the light were restored,” also making no mention of their entrance and appearance in Jerusalem, in On the Glory of Martyrdom, chapter 29" " The first addition was probably “and many bodies of the saints that had fallen asleep arose,” as is witnessed to by some early writers. Since this chronologically was incorrect, they added “and came out of the tombs after his resurrection…”. Forgers added these expressions to make it sound like Jesus was the first one up. " I read this passage in KJV and asked, "Why would they be raised from the dead and come out of their tombs 3 days later?" It makes no sense. JustThinking, I must have touched one of your hot buttons. 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. You posted "I'm supposed to honor my father and mother too. I wouldn't put them on the same level as God or pray to them." Why do you have a problem with honoring the Son as you honor the Father? Why can't you pray to the Son and put Him on the same level as the Father? You can. It is scriptural, contrary to TWI's wrong teaching. I pray that you will free your mind and learn to love the lord Jesus more. Read the scriptures.

Could it be what Jesus referred to in John 5:25? 18...God was his Father, making himself equal with God. 19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. 20 For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel. 21 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will. 22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. (PLEASE READ vs 23 AGAIN BECAUSE TWI MADE US AFRAID TO WORSHIP (HONOR) JESUS TOO MUCH) 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. 25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. (I THINK THAT *IF* THESE DEAD WERE RAISED, THEN THEY WERE LIKE LAZURUS, NOT ETERNAL LIFE WITH AN INCORRUPTABLE BODY, BUT DIED AGAIN LATER.) [This message was edited by Golfie on March 07, 2004 at 19:42.]

quote:i don't know, i think there's something about him feeling strongly about one little lamb ------------------------------------------------------------ Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.

It seems like certain twi people would rejoice in iniquity at times. TWI fails to practice 1Corintians 13:4-6. TWI would dwell on the adverary too much and in doing so, unwittingly glorify the devil. But is this practicing witchcraft? 1 Corintians 13 4 Love endures long and is patient and kind; love never is envious nor boils over with jealousy, is not boastful or vainglorious, does not display itself haughtily. 5 It is not conceited (arrogant and inflated with pride); it is not rude (unmannerly) and does not act unbecomingly. Love (God's love in us) does not insist on its own rights or its own way, for it is not self-seeking; it is not touchy or fretful or resentful; it takes no account of the evil done to it [it pays no attention to a suffered wrong]. 6 It does not rejoice at injustice and unrighteousness...(Amplified Bible)

"PFAL helped thousands of folks including myself...it met lots of needs." -- oldiesman I agree. But I know several extwi people who are so thanful for and in love with VPW that they still think PFAL is 99.99% truth (like i used to). For a while i thought PFAL was 80% truth. Now I think it was 20% truth and 80% baloney, VPW's private interpretation. PFAL was a starting point, not the end all, for my quest to follow the the true teachings of Jesus and get the eternal LIFE that Jesus came to provide for whosoever wants it. (to hell with TWI's more than abundant life hook, line and sinker). If PFAL was so good, why does not TWI teach any of it today? WAP class contained less than 10% of the PFAL teachings (as I recall). It is a shame that some PFAL grads still cling to every PFAL class word of VPW in spite of new light and better teaching on the subject matter.

mocha tree, old fogies...zero style, amen. Their infomercial reminds me of a movie, The Stepford Wives. I recommend anyone in twi to see it. The similarities might blow your mind. mj, Your post reminded me of the mission statement of the church I attend now. "a community of believers in the livivng Christ, dedicated to love God with all our hearts, our minds, our gifts, and to present the gospel message by the power of the Holy Spirit in ways that anyone can accept Jesus as their savior and make Him their Lord. WHERE GOD IS GLORIFIED AND PEOPLE ARE DIGNIFIED." Twi has ctricized, condemned, abased and abused a lot of people that I am personally aware of. Today's sermon was about something I NEVER heard twi teach or saw their jeaders live in 20 years: If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat Prov 25:21 and Lk 6:27-36.

mj, I will stick with this thread, since we have two others about the same topic. TWI is up to something. Since leaving twi after running a twig for 5 years with a woman who became best friends with my wife...twi turned her against us and now she is the spiritual heavy HHF coordinator. She M&Aed us for 5 years. My wife decided to send her a ChristmAS CARD this year and the HHFC sent Mrs Golfie a note! HHFC asked how each one in our family is, except me! TWI is trying to get back their exPFAL grads. I think the infomercial they made is part of that plan. mj, I am thankful that you know more than twi thinks you do. That way cannot con you anymore. You can help the world by exposing the current inner workings of twi. Secretcy is the key to The Adversary's success. Do you remember that from twi's Dealing With the Devil class?

mj412, and you were just now (2/21/04)told about this "interview" that twi spent $29,000 of your abs to make? Notice when this was first posted. ---------------------------------------------- The commercial lasted like 2 minutes. Then some guy came on called Terry Bradshaw and said "this is Terry Bradshaw's pick of the week!" I can't believe it. GRRRL POWER! posted Feb 04, 04 07:04 AM ---------------------------------------------

mj412

I read the first two pages and the last two...the postw were very interesting and thoughtful. "homosexual marriage" IS an oxymoron. Let's not change change the meaning of words. Using Peter to pay Paul....pun intended? Homosexual acts hurt society! Sodom and Gommorah were destroyed because of homosexuality. The lowest point on the face of the Earth is the Dead Sea, where Sodom and Gommorah used to be. Homosexuality could cause California to fall into the ocean. Want some ocean front property in Arizona? www.dictionary.com (even the rules in card games have OPPOSITE sex MARRIAGE) mar·riage n. The legal union of a man and woman as husband and wife. Games: The combination of the king and queen of the same suit, as in pinochle. Mar"riage, n. In b['e]zique, penuchle, and similar games at cards, the combination of a king and queen of the same suit. If of the trump suit, it is called a royal marriage. Mar"riage, n. [OE. mariage, F. mariage. See Marry, v. t.] 1. The act of marrying, or the state of being married; legal union of a man and a woman for life, as husband and wife; wedlock; matrimony. marriage n 1: state of being husband and wife; "a long and happy marriage"; "God bless this union" [syn: matrimony, union, wedlock] 2: two people who are married to each other; "his second marriage was happier than the first"; "a married couple without love" [syn: married couple, man and wife] 3: the act of marrying; the nuptial ceremony; "their marriage was conducted in the chapel" [syn: wedding, marriage ceremony] Marriage was instituted in Paradise when man and woman were in innocence (Gen. 2:18-24). Here we have its original charter, which was confirmed by our Lord Jesus, as the basis on which all regulations are to be framed (Matt. 19:4, 5). It is evident that monogamy was the original law of marriage (Matt. 19:5; 1 Cor. 6:16). This law was violated in after times, when corrupt usages began to be introduced (Gen.4:19; 6:2). Our Lord Jesus corrected many false notions then existing on the subject of marriage (Matt.22:23-30), and placed it as a divine institution on the highest grounds. The apostles state clearly and enforce the nuptial duties of husband and wife (Eph.5:22-33; Col. 3:18, 19; 1 Pet. 3:1-7). Marriage is said to be "honourable"(Heb. 13:4), and the prohibition of it is noted as one of the marks of degenerate times (1 Tim. 4:3). The marriage relation is used to represent the union between God and his people (Isa. 54:5; Jer. 3:1-14; Hos. 2:9, 20). In the New Testament the same figure is employed in representing the love of Christ to his saints (Eph. 5:25-27). The Church of the redeemed is the "Bride, the Lamb's wife" (Rev. 19:7-9).

dimller, Thanks for the link. It has the best explanation of Jesus words on the cross (My God, why hast thou forsaken me? It is finished!) that I have ever seen! http://www.truthortradition.com/modules.ph...article&sid=294 If the above link does not work cut and paste the entire line above into your address bar.

ok, i forced myself to watch it again. Rosalie blinked way too much while she told her story. Her body language indicated that she is lying. Harve plugged The Way of Abundance and Power Classes, Foundational, Intermediate, Advanced. I cannot believe they still teach that crap. When WAP first came out to replace the Power For Abundant Living Class series, The WAP class was considered a poor replacement, a failure. Search the archives at Greasespot Cafe and find threads that discuss the bizzare teachings in the WAP class. Lastly, I personally do not enjoy attending churches where guys have to wear a coat and tie to fit in. I even saw men wearing three piece suits in the video. No thanks, no church with you empty suits, even if it was the truth of Gods Word, nobody wants that kind of religion...that is the phoney appearance of "abundance".

My story is mild abuse compared to some others. Our preschool child was being harassed the the childrens fellowship coordinator, the branch coordinator and his wife (both Family Corpse grads) because our child could not recite a bible verse they tried to force memorize. They said our child was rebellious. I saw three big adults staring down, bullying a 4 year old child. I told them they were provoking and frustrating our our child unto wrath (anger) as in Eph 6:4. The Family Corpse grad said, "I do not think that is what that verse means." That incident got me the boot and my wife saw the whole thing and left with me...thank GOd! Ephesians 6:4 Fathers, do not irritate and provoke your children to anger [do not exasperate them to resentment], but rear them [tenderly] in the training and discipline and the counsel and admonition of the Lord. Amplified Bible TWI's wooden spoon policy/wrong teaching totally contradicted the verse above. I pray that children that were in twi do not forsake God or the Bible because of such abuse. [This message was edited by Golfie on February 13, 2004 at 0:58.]

"That piece of garbage video at one place stated that the home fellowships are handled by the head of household." -- CoolWaters CW, I caught that lie, also. TWI prefers to use anyone who has a nice looking house in a nice neighborhood, the home owner and fellowship leader are often different people. Rosalie looks like Dale Evans...I guess so, but Rosalie's voice is like fingernails clawing on a chalkboard....it sends chills down my spine.

I finally got the stomach to watch it. Terry Bradshaw was the best speaker...I feel sorry for him being duped into reading lies about twi. #1) TWI did not start in 1942...that is a LIE! Many other lies regarding TWI household fellowships. They are NOT patterned after the first century church!!!!! TWI is NOT about people having the "more abundant life" that Jesus talked about ! TWI is about material abundance. It is another "name it and claim it" or a "blab and grab" ministry. The TWI leaders are notorious for their love of money; and loving things and using people for their selfish gains. The twi research dept is a joke. They fired all the real educated and qualified researchers that were on staff. i gotta go... before this twi video really makes me mad.

"Well...was it not the Spirit of God (not God the father) that "brooded" over creation in Genesis 1:2? Who "broods" over eggs? The rooster?" --sirguessalot ------------------------------------------------ As a matter of fact, the male ring neck dove broods on the egg. I saw this working in the Rutgers-Newark University animal lab. And it reminded me of Gen 1:2 at the time. One Mothers' Day we had a teaching with Bible verses about God's mother-like characteristics. It blew my mind...in one verse the Father nursed His children! God created both male and female in His image. There will be neither male or female, no couples still married to each other in the new heaven and Earth. We will be like angles. So for now, the mother/father god talk is a figure of speach. I hope no equal-gender- rights kook gets their nose out of joint over the Bible figures referring the God, The Creator.

Oh, the deception was ever so subtle Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime {before the day of Pentecost} were written for our learning. (strongs #1319) (learning should be translated Doctrine, same greek work as in II Timothy 3:16 "...and is profitable for Doctrine" (strongs #1319) This is where the house of cards begins to fall. This teaching: from PFAL chapter 15, is the beginning of how we were ever so subltly lead to believe that the gospels were not written to us, so what did we do?? Pretty much ignored them. -- Lightside ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Great post...worth repeating! How many people in twi do not know that the 4 gospels were written AFTER Pentecost. I believe the gospels show us Jesus' example how to operate holy spirit, The epistles show us the mind of Christ.

Good topic...i think it is posted in the correct forum. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Or to put it simple you can sat in your car and be at a state of peace, But until you use the power of the car by turning parts on you do not enjoy its powers. You hear the power of the car radio and the power of the air or heat and so on after turning it on." ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Gag me with a spoon...if that is about the Comforter, Holy Spirit, of Christ in me. As i read this quote, i realized for the first time how much that twi automobile/battery/horn teaching analogy in PFAL/RHST really sux. Jesus was able to teach the 1st century believers how to live with holy spirit long before the automobile was invented. Jesus used better and simpler analogies to teach about holy spirit. Studying HIS teachings would be much more beneficial than studying Receiving the holy spirit Today by VPW. Truth is simple, error is complicated. TWI and extwi people would be better off to re-search the true teachings of Jesus Christ. By the Way, the 4 gospels are NOT "just for our learning". They contain many truths that twi followers have overlooked and ignored because of wrong teaching. [This message was edited by Golfie on February 12, 2004 at 9:38.]