Ron G.

(((((((((((((((excie))))))))))))))))

Trefor... I don't wish to derail this thread and I mentioned the Mandans as an aside. Do a Google on them. Lewis and Clark discovered them. Many were white and their language included many Welsh words, phrases and constructs. Do a Google...you'll find it interesting.

There was no justification for that, although some say it was our right "by conquest" which I, personally, don't exactly accept. I really think it should and could have all happened much differently. Trefor... Have you ever heard of the Mandan Indians? You might find that interesting if you check it out.

Read this. The boy obeyed his dad and stayed on the trail, avoided strangers and didn't respond because the family password wasn't used by searchers. Interesting. ---------------------------------------------- Scout's parents: 'Brennan continues to amaze us' Boy says he feels 'good' after surviving four days in mountains Wednesday, June 22, 2005; Posted: 7:56 p.m. EDT (23:56 GMT) BOUNTIFUL, Utah (CNN) -- The father of 11-year-old Cub Scout Brennan Hawkins said Wednesday his son "continues to amaze us" after surviving four days alone in the Utah wilderness. Brennan was found safe Tuesday by a searcher driving an all-terrain vehicle. He was taken to Primary Children's Medical Center in Salt Lake City, where doctors diagnosed him with sunburn, scrapes, bruises and some minor dehydration. He was released early Wednesday morning and returned to his family home in the suburb of Bountiful. His parents held two news conferences in their front yard and provided details on their four-day ordeal with a background of yellow ribbons and balloons. Brennan Hawkins made his first public appearance at the afternoon session, surrounded by family and friends. He said only that he felt "good" before sitting down at his mother's feet behind the microphones while his parents and four siblings answered reporters' questions. His parents said the boy appeared to be fine but that he didn't seem ready to talk much about his ordeal -- at which point Brennan Hawkins shook his head. "Brennan continues to amaze us," said his father, Toby Hawkins. "You know, his ability to deal with this initially, I made the comment that I thought that he was the most ill-prepared out of our five children to deal with it, and now I think he was maybe the best-prepared." Brennan's mother, Jody Hawkins, suggested her son may have been avoiding searchers by following his father's advice. "He had two thoughts going through his head all the time," she said. "Toby's always told him that 'if you get lost, stay on the trail.' So he stayed on the trail. "We've also told him don't talk to strangers. ... When an ATV or horse came by, he got off the trail. ... When they left, he got back on the trail." "His biggest fear, he told me, was someone would steal him," she said. Brennan's uncle, Bob Hawkins, said his nephew may have been afraid to contact the strangers because they weren't using the password his family had adopted. The family explained that Brennan was born prematurely and he is socially immature as a result. "He doesn't have any disabilities; he's just immature," Toby Hawkins said. 'What a remarkable finish' Brennan went missing Friday while camping at a Boy Scout camp about 80 miles east of Salt Lake City that is about 8,500 feet in elevation. Toby Hawkins was asked how he felt. "What a remarkable finish and conclusion to this whole experience," he said. "You go from incredible worry and concern. ... Then you go through the search process of not getting any clues. ... "And then in just an instant, kind of flip of the switch, you go to incredible exhilaration and gratitude and appreciation for everybody's efforts that ultimately resulted in the successful rescue of Brennan." Both parents' composure cracked as they described how they learned their son had been found alive. Jody Hawkins said she feared the worst when officials from the Summit County Sheriff's Department asked her to get in a car because they had news. "I, at that point, didn't think Brennan was still with us," she said. "I felt peace with the situation, but I didn't really think he could have survived that long in the wilderness. ... "So when I was going to get into the sheriff's car I knew they going to tell me that Brennan was no longer with me. "So I collapsed even before I got into the sheriff's truck, and when they told me that Brennan was still alive, ... my brain still cannot comprehend that." Although Brennan hasn't given many details about his ordeal, he did tell his father that when he first realized he was lost, he said a prayer. "I said to Brennan, 'Heavenly father has taken care of you,'" Toby Hawkins said. As his parents spoke at their morning news conference, Brennan lay sleeping inside. "His personality has not changed one tiny bit," said Jody Hawkins. "He was cracking jokes to us within 20 to 30 seconds when we saw him yesterday." One of the first questions Brennan asked after he was rescued, his father said, was if the Pokemon cards he had ordered on eBay had arrived. Found by ATV searcher The boy was last reported seen around 5:30 p.m. Friday by a climbing wall supervisor who said he saw Brennan removing his climbing gear. When the boy failed to show up for dinner an hour later, Scout leaders began searching. On Tuesday, volunteer searcher Forrest Nunley driving an all-terrain vehicle came across the boy around noon (3 p.m. ET) about a mile and a half south of Lily Lake -- five miles west of where he was last seen, said Summit County Sheriff David Edmunds. Nunley said he "turned a corner and there was a kid standing in the middle of the trail. He was all muddy and wet." Nunley then dialed 911 on his cell phone. "He was a little delirious. I sat him down and gave him a little food," he told CNN affiliate KSL. Volunteers had delayed searching the area where Brennan was found because they thought it unlikely that the boy crossed the nearby mountain ridge to get there. Brennan told rescuers he'd had nothing to eat or drink during his ordeal. After eating and drinking, the sheriff said, Brennan -- wearing the same blue sweatshirt, nylon shorts and climbing shoes he was reported wearing Friday -- "wanted to play a video game on one of the searchers' cell phones."

I just can't understand y'alls logic. A scalpel will provide a good, permanent cure for what ails them. They can stay in society and pay their own way instead of being locked away, getting three squares a day and cable teevee on my dime.

I seem to recall LCM saying "The Jews are no more GODS CHOSEN PEOPLE than the apache Indians", but I could have been mistaken. I won't deny the holocaust, but I have some questions. 1. Does it justify stealing Palestine from the Palestinians? (Wouldn't giving them a piece of Germany been more morally justifiable?) 2. Does it justify Isreali hegemony over the rest of the middle east? 3.Does it justify sending BILLIONS of American tax dollars, weapons and advisors to prop up a two bit terrorist dictator like Ariel Sharon? Just curious.

It's so wonderful to hear GOOD news on the teevee for a change. Chalk up one more for the Scouts!!

I can't understand why dowsing wouldn't have a logical, scientific basis. When ol' Cliff did it, ne could not only determine the presence of oil, but the approximate depth and sulphur content using little vials of assorted grades of crude he had. He could also take small metal samples and determine what as well as where things were buried such as pipes, wires and other metal objects. I don't know what was special about him, if anything. But then I don't know what's special about Michal Jordan that he can do what he does while others of similr height, weight and muscle development can't. Some folks have it and some don't. Since living here in the hills, I've learned to plant my crops, set my eggs and take care of other animals according to the phases of the moon. It's helped bring me good success, but then the tides are governed by the moon and that's an observed and documented scientific FACT. Why would the moon affect the ocean and not a potato? Why would similar metals be attracted? Why would birch or willow or peach wood be attracted to water? Why do tree roots seek underground water? They can't see, touch, taste, smell or hear it. At least not in ways we can understand or document. I used to think that science and technology were the be all end all of human knowledge and the old folk ways were at best ignorant superstition and in some cases, witchcraft. Life was a lot harsher when I first came to the hills, but I was determined. Now, as I learn some of the old time ways and practice them, I've found life a lot easier and more comfortable. Living in harmony with your surroundings is easier and much more fulfilling than constantly being at war with them and trying to subdue them. Like the old Bob Dylan song, "I was so much older then, but I'm younger than that, now" Other topic... I've built on my property and helped others building on theirs. I/we always get a piece of PVC pipe, 6" diameter about a foot and a half long, fill it with trinkets, coins, letters, our names and other assorted stuff and cap it at both ends and place it somewhere in the structure...sealed in a wall or brickwork or something, and anytime something either falls down or is torn down, we always find something. It's a very old Ozark tradition. In an old school building, the guys adding a wing, found a pint bottle of whiskey from 1910 along with some old coins, papers and some old tools. It's always interesting to me to see old calculations, measure marks and plumb bob marks left by the builders in old buildings. It kinda reminds us of the continuity from generation to generation of the building techniques and the people who used them.

I used to know a man by the name of Cliff Newland who lived in Crane, Texas. He used to dowse for Exxon, Shell and some other oil companies back in the 50's, 60's and early 70's. They paid him well. I was always very skeptical, but since I came to these hills and seen a few water wells doswed including my own, that skepticism has waned. After I've lived in these hills a few years, and seen some of the old timers doing things their old time ways, I realize there's great deal more to this heaven and earth than was in my philosophy (to paraphrase Shakespeare). The hills, the dirt, the rocks, the flora and fauna, the streams, creeks, waterfalls and wild things are always telling us something. We have but to learn to listen.

I have some friends who occasionally try to get me into their "downline" for noni juice. They never talk much about the benefits of drinking it, just the benefits of peddling it. I think I'll get a jug and try it out. I've seriously heard some good things from people that I trust who use it. I need all the help I can get.

I recomend a nice goat. Andrew had one and loved him. They are clean, affectionate, readily trainable and won't hump your leg. They'll keep the yard nicely groomed and fertilize as they go.

Long Gone... I didn't mean that as a diagnosis or anything. It was just an observation. They said half her brain was atrophied...before the dehydration. I ain't no doctor, although I did watch ER from time to time. I was merely trying to find a lesson we could all benefit from in all of this.

As I am now understanding it, Cardinal Ratzinger was actually NOT the church's first choice to replace Pope John Paul: their first pick, interestingly enough, was Cardinal Hans Grapje. Grapje was raised in a Catholic school in The Hague and, as a young man, aspired to become a priest, but was drafted into the Army during WWII and spent years co-piloting B17s until his aircraft was shot down in 1943 and he lost his left arm. Captain Grapje spent the rest of the war as a chaplain giving spiritual aid to soldiers, both allied and enemy. After the war, he became a priest, serving as a missionary in Africa, piloting his own plane (in spite of his handicap) to villages across the continent. In 1997, Father Grapje was serving in Zimbabwe when an explosion in a silver mine caused a cave-in. Archbishop Grapje went down into the mine to administer last rites to those too severely injured to move. Another mine shaft collapsed and he was buried for three days, suffering multiple injuries, including the loss of his right eye. The high silver content in the mine's air gave him purpura, a life-long condition characterized by purplish skin blotches. Although Cardinal Grapje devoted his life to the service of God as a scholar, mentor, and holy man, church leaders felt he should never ascend to the papacy: They felt that the church would never accept a one-eyed, one-armed, flying purple papal leader!

I saw it on the news. The great lesson we can all learn from this is that a dehydrated brain weighs half as much as a normal brain...at least that's what they said.

Your daughter goes out with some of her friends... Comes stumbling in at 3AM... You go out and check the family car...

PETA demands Japan respect the spirit of the Endangered Species Act and not use military force on Godzilla. TOKYO - As skyscrapers crumbled into ruble, and bullet trains hurled into Tokyo Bay, millions of Japanese have demanded that their government use all of the military might they can muster to put an end to the horrific destruction wrought by the radioactive mutant monster Godzilla. Not so fast, say PETA members. They claim that Godzilla is a one of a kind reptile, and as such should be protected. "The destruction of Tokyo is a small price to pay for biodiversity", said Ronda Rugmunch, PETA spokesperson. "It would be a tragedy of monumental proportions if this one of a kind nobel creature was allowed to die." But the problem is, the Endangered Species Act is an American law, and does not apply to nations other than the United States. "Well, like, the United Nations should, like, do something, like, or something", said Peter Puffer, who was one of a large group of protesters calling themsevles ARFs, which stands for Animal Rights Fanatics. The ARFs were protesting in front of the Japanese Embassy in Washington, D.C. Some feel the Japanese have every right to protect the lives of their citizens, as well as protecting private and public property. Death tolls are running in the tens of thousands, while property damage has topped at least a quarter billion dollars. "Leave it to the Japanese to try and put a dollar value on an endangered species", said Agnes Aire-Heade, chairperson of the Eureka chapter of Save the Whales. "We're talking about evil money grubbers who still hunt whales and eat raw squishy sea food. Of course they're not going to be concerned with endangered species." We tried to reach the Japanese Prime Minister for a comment, but the only statement he issued to the press was, "AAIIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!" followed by static. Developing.

They need tax dollars and donations to keep that baggy eyed Bolshevik, Jim Lehrer, on the air. The "news" and their idiotic kiddy indoctrination programs could never survive in the free marketplace of ideas.

Then you must agree that the NAACP, Southern Poverty Law Center, the ACLU, NPR, democrats, republicans, Mothers Against Drunk Drivers etc etc. etc etc etc are all morally wrong. By that logic, tax dollars shouldn't be used to execute people, invade faraway places, provide abortions, stop abortions, support art, support dependent children, house politicians, support politicians, purchase ammunition to shoot politicians, defend the indigent in court, go to the moon, study diseases, assist Israel in killing Palestinians, return from the moon etc. etc. etc. I'll bet even YOU discriminate against somebody somewhere.

So many names...So little time. Are you over the hill, yet? Just curious. Happy birthday.

Standing in the spotlight gazing skyward with arms outstretched and The Mormon Tabernacle Choir softly singing "Battle Hymn of the Republic in the background, Oeno passionately intones... After drying his eye, blowing his nose and catching his breath, Ron G. sobers up and retorts... What kind of liberals are you talking about? The founders were CLASSIC liberals which is a far cry from contemporary liberals. CLASSIC liberalism seeks a society with minimal government and little regulation for self governing, self regulating individuals. The most precious commodity being private property and the most sacred private property being the conscience of the individual that their self interest is predicated on each individuals right and ability to live his life well without social pressure or coersion, dependent on none but himself or a supreme being. Contemporary liberalism is maximum government coersion to force individuals into a collective state where each can only live his life in dependence on the state for sustenance and protection. In other words, feudalism. Contemorary Conservatism (Neocon) is essentially the same as contemporary liberalism, but fulfills the Hegelian dialectic by offering opposition to contemporary liberal causes. Still, it causes dependency or feudalism. Serfdom isn't compassionate. Liberty is compassionate. Let's use homosexual marriage as an example. Contemporary Liberal--Enact legislation (state coersion) forcing the state to issue licenses to homosexual couples and enact legislation forcing the recognition. Neocon--Enact legislation denying the state the right to issue marriage licenses and outlawing recognition. Classic liberalism--Questions why the state is issuing licenses in the first place and encourages the individuals to do what they will, as long as it doesn't infringe on the free choices of another. Let whoever wants to, recognize it and whoever doesn't want to, not recognize it. Classic Conservatism should do about the same thing. Classic Conservatism would be more interested in economic issues, so I'm kind of omitting it as this is more about social issues. Classic liberalism looks at the natural state of things i.e. anarchy, and recognizes that in a state of total anarchy men and women will still pair up, live monogamously and make children while homosexuls will pair up and live monogamously. In a state of total anarchy, people will continue to live according to the dictates of their conscience and will have private property. Contemporary liberals and neocons seem to want to dictate conscience and regulate or eliminate private property. People like that have no courage or they wouldn't be frightened of others rights, they have no compassion or they'd be willing to let others live their lives as they see fit and certainly no ideals except to get what they can legislate out of the pockets of others. This is why homosexuals should quit politicizing Scouts and trying to force their way with them and create their own organization (call it Boy Sprouts, if you will) and we can all be happy in the knowledge that we all have the liberty to do it as we see fit.

I really haven't been following it, but if the jury sez so, then I guess that's what we need to go with. I wonder if the fear of potential riots might have affected the outcome. I, personally, don't think that should have been a consideration as the black folks I know now and have known over the years have a very, very low tolerance for kiddy diddlers...a "boy toucher" would have no credibility at all. MJ has demonstrated the true greatness of America...the only place in the world where a poor black boy can grow up to be a rich white woman. Now that he's free, maybe he can go out and find the REAL molester.

Chef asks.. Cali has the most repressive gun laws in the USA. Remember the children who were murdered in their home by some crazy guy with a pichfork? The kids had to die cuz the parents followed Cali gun laws properly. IMHO pitbulls are good only for target practice. I had to "put down" a stray that looked to be at least part pitbull a couple of years ago that was marauding my animals and made the mistake of making himself a target while looking at my son and growling. If you have an auto or semi auto, you do have to pick up after it. 15 rounds (made damn sure it was dead) from my semi auto rifle and one pitbull carcass and I had a lot of pickin up to do.

To give the dogs prority over the kid by locking the kid in the basement...errands over the kid....then just say "it was his time to go" speaks very loudly of a Cali attitude that is terribly sickening and quite pervasive.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/06/12/fataldog....g.ap/index.html Imagine anyone stupid enough to lock her kid in the basement to pritect him from her dog instead of locking up the dog or killing it. When she comes home, the kid is dead, and she say's "it was his time to go". I used to live and work in that SF, Davis to Sac area, and this sort of thing is probably typical of the mentality there. Those who think liberalism is a mental disorder are correct. I hope this woman goes to prison for a very long time.

I lived in Davis CA for a number of years during the clinton times. I remember Dianne Feinstein, Barbara Boxer, Judy Pertanski, the pervert weddings, the politically correct nonsense, "Davis, the First non nuclear city" etc etc etc. Davis is the leftist hate and hypocrisy capitol of the northern hemisphere....southern, too. Actually, I was considerably more moderate and "democrat" until I lived in Davis and got a huge dose of leftist reality. ESPECIALLY U.C. Davis!!! ACK, PTUI