now I see

No one just does that. Normal people don't leave the door open and just stand there and turn to deliberately expose themselves. This guy had to have been preying on women early on to be so bold. He nonchalantly asks Jimmy and Judi Do*p about orgies being ok will God, he preyed upon his secretary before twi in Van Wert, he had a mysterious nefarious liason with the woman who told him about Bullinger, I wonder if he preyed upon Dorthia before he married her? His perversions had to have started way back when he was young. He just ain't right, these actions just ain't normal.....

October Sky?

I've heard the robe thing from other posters here, seems like it was a common thing for him, he was already prepared to get what he wanted, those special campus suites and the motorcoach were set up for these things. I almost don't want to read Kristin's book because of how much the last line of the part II interview upset me, I feel I will have to be in a certain mindset to read it in order to weather the intensity of the revulsion I'll feel toward that basturd and the regret and pain I'll feel for his victims. I am embarrassed that I was ever proud of my association with twi...

Is it Macbeth?

Farengi Claw Foot Bath-tub

I found an old 1971 Time magazine article on VP and TWI Jesus Movement online: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/...43882-1,00.html

You don't have to "get used to dissapointment" because your guess is right! You're up!

John Hartford sings, Going to Work in Tall Buildings, he sang this the last time I saw him perform

Shellon, So glad your daughter is ok, and glad you were unscathed from your untimely deer encounter. I have met a deer in a similar manner before, I fared better from our meeting too...

To order Losing the Way: http://astore.amazon.com/greascafe-20/104-...UTF8&node=1

RumRunner, On the Talkshoe phone chat this past week you talked about identifying the Americans abroad by their loudness, my husband has been saying the same thing for years, I thought it was very funny you said almost word for word the exact same thing he's observed in so many countries.

"Oh, the sot has spoken. What happens to her is not truly your concern. I will kill her. And remember this, never forget this: when I found you, you were so slobbering drunk, you couldn't buy Brandy! And you: friendless, brainless, helpless, hopeless! Do you want me to send you back to where you were? Unemployed in Greenland!" "I would sooner destroy a stained glass window than an artist like yourself. However, since I can't have you follow me either...Please understand I hold you in the highest respect." "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

Footloose?

OMG, that last line in the part II interview really grossed me out, what a Fn vile man. Breathes there the man, with soul so dead... If such there breathe, go, mark him well; For him no Minstrel raptures swell; High though his titles, proud his name, Boundless his wealth as wish can claim; Despite those titles, power, and pelf, The wretch, concentred all in self, Living, shall forfeit fair renown, And, doubly dying, shall go down To the vile dust, from whence he sprung, Unwept, unhonor'd, and unsung. Sir Walter Scott

My husband is technically in China right now, actually in Hong Kong, he travels the world, and yes, it is a different world over there. We talk nightly on Skype, and we have a running joke over what mystery meat he ate that day at either a street vendor food stand or at the food court stall. What we consider housepets, over there could be considered fair game for numerous business uses. I'm aware of dogs and cats being used for food and in the clothing industry, but I don't know about torturing animals, please explain what you mean, if you would. China really doesn't have the environmentalists and animal rights advocates that we do here. Their society doesn't have the judicial system either that would institute checks and balances on ethical treatment. Their society is coming from a very dark period and it is low on the social order of things to be concerned about. It's a hard place with hard people, some desperate to survive, I wouldn't expect much change from China soon. The USA used to lead the world in steel production, because of environmentalists concerns, the USA is no longer in the steel industry as it once was, now China leads. They call the Hong Kong harbor area a nickname, Fragrant Harbor, because of the smell and toxic waters, the air polution and smog there is the worst anywhere, China even does unregulated shipbreaking. They are a developing industrial nation and human rights as well as animal rights, and environmentalism are very low on the priority list of the govt. It's a tough place to be as a human too, it can be a very hard life to be born in China.

Thanks Groucho, you've offered me good advise...definitely the "law" of believing is bunk, this website has been very helpful so far, its just that when I read the bible, so much of my critical thinking skills, when I do read, are based on wierwille pretzel logic, I fear it will taint everything I might ever read, I don't think I trust my presumptions on the bilble anymore. So much of what I knew that I knew, is now what I thought I knew, after the information here on GS has proven it wrong...I do want to go through everything and see for myself what the bible says. Thanks again Groucho, your thoughts are appreciated..

Slightly older...

New stuff, its got a beat and you can dance to it...

Since I'm still relatively new here, and I have no idea how I am going to do it, my interest in the bible currently is to unlearn all the crap I learned from twi. I'm not even sure of what is the crap and what is not, unraveling what I think the bible is and what it is saying about God is a mountain I've been dreading to climb. It is something I must do, but I have no clue on where to start.

I agree, the Yahoo groups ex-way site is sort of different, sort of a social group rather than informational and recovery oriented. There are some posters here who post there too, but it's much smaller and just different than here. Thank god for GS, it was the Rx I needed. As far as support help, I dunno, I find it hard to tell others about my experience post-twi since m departure impacted me so much, I was devastated, very hard for people who've never been involved with a detrimental religion to empathsize and comprehend. I searched for the answers for 20 years till I found GS. Family doesn't understand, old friends still in splinters don't either, Gspoters would be the support source, other than paying for a good phsycologist that specialized in cults. BTW, there's a forum here, the Archive Forum, with a heading, Getting help for cult dysfunction, which has some very good information.

Working Girl with Melanie Griffith and her big hair! Guys, I didn't want to respond to the former clue cuz it looked like George St G was working on it and almost there! I go ahead next time though..

* Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow You were closer with the Narnia guess...

Regarding the repetive twi prayer thank you for's, christians outside twi perceive that kind of address to God in prayer as being hauty, presumptive, arrogant even, thanking God for something he hasn't given you yet, sort of like trying to twist the hand of God to bend your way. Regarding SIT, the admonision by vp that SIT builds up and energizes the inner man never did sit well with me, and it didn't work that way in practicle application. There always have been plenty of spiritual people walking with God before tongues, and after who didn't SIT. That teaching point was always a fuzzy area that never was explained or taught to my satisfaction, something that never fit quite right.

It also stands to reason that in order to perpetuate thewell crafted image of a "christian minister", vp had to be publically "nice" to many, especially in the early days while the ministry was growing and where at HQ's people had more direct access to him in person on a daily basis. This ultimately fulfilled his overall goals of a cash cow ministry, public accolaide and prestige, power, and indulgence in his perversions. The narcissists and sociopaths that I've known always have a posse of supporters who loyally follow and approve of the narcissist, primarily because they have been systematically and deliberately manipulated by him and have only seen his good side by design.

Waysider, Good observation, if vpw had been normal, the response would have been different...