Allan

OOOOHHHH Templelady, sometimes I feel disdain for you and other times you make my heart melt !!! I just got a picture of one of my daughters in my mind, thinking of you !! As I said before Bless you for standing on something (godly) Mormon church does not believe in s.i.t. so they are at a disadvantage right there in 'rightly dividing' the truth of baptism. Evan..I believe that 'right doctrine' always lines up with 'right practise'. For example I was never 'water baptised' yet I did confess Jesus as Lord and 'experienced s.i.t.' I believe that with the coming of the greater the lesser disappears. I believe that truth is simple, that Jesus came to uncomplicate things. I believe that I only have to look at a family to see the truth behind a Father and His son. I believe that when I look at a dead person, I can see they're dead. I believe that no one church is 'the true church' (sorry MO) but that every born-again Christian is part of the body of Christ. I believe that Jesus said "why say to me Lord, Lord and DO NOT the things I say" etc..etc..

I think the kindest thing for me right now would be for me to not even reply to those points of yours, maybe someone else will ??!!

How about this Mormonlady.."and I Joseph Smith was directed by an angel called 'Moron-i' to a place to dig up some gold plates, and when I dug them up they had strange writing on them that I didn't understand, and the angel 'Moroni' translated them for me and this became the book of Mormon. And bug**r me, I then had the plates taken off me, but I do remember also the revelation given to me that Jesus went to America and preached to the Indians because they are the remnant of the tribe of Israel" Watch those 'glasshouses' MO !! At least VPW was a bit more credible than that, come on !!

Thanks Dave..I'll have a beer on you ! By the Way..there are a number of single women in our ministry if you're ever looking..but beware..these women are all well trained in the art of 'BACK OFF BUBBA '!!! Karmicadebt..no I am not gay,married (still) for 22 years to my childhood sweetheart, 6 well-adjusted children (all of us ex family 20)and 4sometimes not so well adjusted grandchildren !! Keep my life busy with them and helping them be on fire for Jesus sorry..it was Coolchef that asked the question !!

Hey Pond..in case no-one has already..WELCOME TO GREASESPOT !! You sound like someone who has their head screwed on, so I presume you are not still in TWI !! Anyway, not that it matters, but I pretty much agree with your post. I have nothing to hide; my name is there for all to see; I have no (real) fear !!

Probably because the number of 'homos' is actually very small (thank God)

Bramble..thankyou for your reply, I do not regard the person as filth (only their actions) or I would not have welcomed them into any of our foundational classes. I do not think VPW ever seriously discriminated against them either, at least not as bad as Martindumb did..but happy to agree to disagree with you especially in an 'adult way !!

Baptism of fire ?..try posting on GSC !! Never been 'water baptised' but definitely baptised with the holy spirit. I don't 'feel' I need to go back to the water. If it makes a person 'feel' clean, should it be a regular thing ?

Templelady..that old chief in the Amazon will be judged in the ressurection of the dead, but not be in the 'gathering together'..to 'baptise for the dead' is bizzare, playing God and pandering to emotions, nothing more. Read EW Bullingers explanation of the verse (what is the use of a man or woman being 'baptized' if it is only for them to REMAIN dead.) God is NOT the author of confusion ! My previous question was "could a LDS person be 'baptized' for say someone like Hitler" ?

You guys really are a scream..screaming hypocrites that is !! The tone of your posts towards others who do not agree with you and your thinking I don't mind at all..but don't label me a hypocrite. I still believe and practice what I previously believed to be straight out of the Bible..the rest of you make excuses for it. DMiller..looks to me like you're trying to impress Belle (among others) is that wedding bells I hear ?? Were you that 'flippant' in twi ?? Oh my gosh Allan..you're so nasty and vicious in your posting (translated as..just let us ridicule, flame, abuse, and don't you DARE answer us back in that way) you guys really are a riot act !!!

Sorry Karmicadebt but I will not get drawn into 'attacks' on a personal level, you yourself should know that one still reaps what they sow.. However, I would suggest that maybe you find another avenue to 'vent' your feelings.

Sorry Mark but the only reason the 'Catholics' never suceeded in stopping the free course of the Word of God was because in persecution the church of God flourishes ! Even today this principle holds true. Templelady..you forgot the part where Jesus went to the Americas and preached to the American Indians (who are the lost tribe of Israel) (all 'divinely' revealed to Joseph Smith of course)!!!!!!!!! aaahhh..so YOU were the Mark that private topiced me berating me for not believing in the 'trinity' etc.. Just for Oakspear and DMillers 'enlightenment' are you another one who never were involved in twi ??!!

Karmicdebt..I suggest if you felt shameful and dirty after hetero sex you should have demanded your money back !! Outofdafog..thanks again for your advice..similar reply to many others who disagree with your line of thinking. JFYI..we have run classes even recently with 'homos' in them, they got b/a, s.i.t. etc.. so I KNOW God is a lot bigger than all that junk ! Then it is up to them to decide if they want to be pulled out of the fire AND SOME HAVE (I only hope that doesn't disappoint you.)

Maybe he did Outofdafog..maybe 'butch women' and 'limpwristed' men just got too much for him ! Bramble..I think you described 'homos' much better than any of us could !! Teens full of 'spirits' ? Not surprising given the media etc..

JJ..I have 'spoken to'..'counselled' a few 'homos' over the years(and recently) and an interesting side note is that after they have 'copulated and climaxed' pretty much straight away they feel remorseful and 'dirty'. Which to me lends credence that it is 'spiritual', that they are 'caught up' in the 'anticipation and lust' factor and once that 'spirit' is satisfied, the individuals own 'godly' conscience 'kicks in'. It's pretty sad.

Well said Oldiesman..I think words being bandied around like 'viscious', 'attacks' etc.. are a bit melodramatic don't you think ?? They are used 'conveniently' by certain posters at times to suit, a bit like a spoilt child crying "meanie, meanie".

Seeing as my name has been mentioned(by Templeladys' wife) here is my reply..I still believe that PFAL was/is great truths and light revealed from Gods' Word (regardless of who and how it came to pass) after all, most people here truly believed it at one time or another.. I believe that some of it definitely was 'inspirational' but not necessarily all of it. That puts me at odds with Mike on probably that one issue. Having said that, I also believe that some of the 'detractors' from it are only trying to come up with excuses for not believing it, whilst others are downright envious at having 'reassigned' themselves to other churches KNOWING that their church would not have a bar of it..not because of any wrong doctrine it promulgates but because their church is too 'set' in their own.

Idiots, halfwits etc..you couldn't have said it better yourself MStar, especially after reading some of the posts over in the 'politics' forum..nod, nod wink, wink !!

Thanks Dave, a nice balanced reply ! That message could well be heeded by all the posters !!

The 'big' differnce is..the Book of Mormon has been shown to be a crock of cr*p ! It was 'supposed' to have been 'divinely' translated and written into the English of today ! Check out the myriad of ex-Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints sites ! yahoo search brings up literally hundreds of ex Mormon sites..type in ex lds or ex mormon Geesh..some of the stuff on there makes VPW look like a saint !!

DMiller..if people look through my posts they will see that I very rarely 'push' my 'beliefs' that I ascertained to be the truth whilst in TWI, however, they will see that I 'defend' my beliefs when attacked and ridiculed by others..(don't most people) especially from those who were never in twi at all and those who fire their shots from churches of differn't persuasions, bless ya.

Hey Brother Speed..what do you call a group of people wearing bombs around their waists cruising through town looking for victims to blow up ? (I'll give you a clue..starts with 'T') What is the differn'ce between a 'democrat' and a 'liberal' ??!! You see 'labels' have always been around and always will be.The undesirables and evil 'groups' are the ones who try to shrug off a 'tag' because it 'exposes' them., after all..aren't you serving with (in your own words) LDS ??!!

I 'hope' you're still receiving counselling Belle !! Again..just the hypocricy of people in other churches continuing to throw the same old stones whilst sitting in their sunday pew 'drinking in' their own doctrinal garbage..and Belle..wrong on all of those flippant little comments of yours as well !!

The whole point Templelady was to check your own 'backyard' before 'poohpoohing' what 'others' may believe as per taught previously in TWI. Some of you others..if you weren't in TWI for the Word, what were you in it for ??!! Some of you post like you never believed any of it whilst you were 'in' ? So what parts did you read Oakspear and what part didn't you agree with ?

Come on Templelady talk reasonably..we're talking thousands of years with the tablets of Moses in foreign countries and a hundred or two with these 'golden tablets' in the Mid-West !! The Bible talks about parts of the memory being erased when it comes to the annihilation of unsaved loved ones, no more tears, the memory of them is forgotten. Otherwise that would mean Hitlers mom, Osama Bin Ladens' mom (if she became a LDS) would expect to be with their family forever !! This is where the illogicalness of 'feelings and emotions' begin to take over the truth of Gods' Word. That is why the Mormons are also right into 'baptisms by proxy' (baptism for the dead) and geaneoligies which btw God said to steer away from..!! Thanks for the 'discussion' I think enough has been revealed.