Linda Z

Hi Holly...welcome. I believe "LEAD" stood for Leadership, Education, Adventure, Direction, but my memory isn't what it used to be. :B) The test you refer to was initially called the "solo," but later they changed it to "duo" to represent you and God. I did have some food that I'd saved...a bag of gorp and some other stuff. My duo was, I think, somewhere between 48 and 60 hours. They came for me in the nick of time, right after I stood up inside my "hootch" and knocked the whole thing down and just as it started to rain. I was told afterwards that there were LEAD staff patroling the area where our hootches were, to make sure we were okay, so maybe they should have called it a "trio." :) I like camping. I like the great outdoors. I did not like the rock climbing or the hiking with 50 lbs. of cooking utensils on my back.

Hahahaha, Raf, your reference to ashes triggered an ad at the bottom of the page for "cremation unrs." I don't know which is funnier, the fact that it showed up or the fact that some poor, dyslexic soul couldn't spell a 4-letter word. I'm not making fun of dyslexia; I actually have dyslexic moments myself. But you'd think someone would actually proofread an ad before posting it for all the world to see. Back to the topic: Happy whatever it is, WW!

I was in la-la land w/ George. All I know is I was in Los Angeles. I think I watched it on TV as it was happening, but I'm not sure. At the time I was more interested in exploring inner space than outer space.

I was in twi for 17 years; 4 of those were spent at HQ and 2 at Rome City. I never saw or knew of anyone held against his/her will. I never saw or heard of food withheld as any kind of punishment. I never saw or heard of anyone beatean with boards. There was a young guy who used to come to a home fellowship I went to pre-twi. He got into the group that's the subject of the first post. We went to see him. We were not permitted to see or speak with him. This was way before there was much about cults or abusive religious groups in the media, and we were young ourselves, or maybe we would have called the cops and asked why we couldn't see our friend. I hope he woke up and left the group.

Does Rosalie actually write anything for the Way Mag? As the prez, I'd think she'd have to, but she's more of a behind-the-scenes kinda gal, pulling the strings from backstage. Twinky, it would be interesting to see an example of what twi is putting out in print these days, but keep in mind that we can't post whole articles on here without violating copyright laws. Someone could post a paragraph or two, though, if the source were cited.

I don't know if it changed after I left Way Pub in '86, but when I was there, no one ghost-wrote for LCM, unfortunately. He did it all by himself. We editors used to use a phrase to describe his writing that's similar to the subtitle for this thread: "Why use one word when ten will do?" Editing his writing was like trying to untangle a bag of yarn that a litter of kittens had been playing with--in the mud. And to change anything, we had to get the approval of his sec'y, who sometimes guarded his words as if they were inspired by God Himself. There were were several good writers on Way Mag when I started there. Of course that was when David C was editor, before Rosalie expanded her empire to include Way Pub. Under her rule, not many of them stuck around. Many of the other authors of magazine articles, however, weren't writers at all. They were mostly twi "leaders" who had something they wanted to write about or who were asked to write an article. I haven't seen a Way mag in a couple decades, but I have no doubt that under RFR, the writing became more and more as Chockfull describes it.

I don't foresee there ever being a healthy dialogue with any leader or member of any offshoot on this board. I can only imagine what it must feel like. Probably a lot like slathering oneself with honey and standing on a hill of red ants. I've never been to a CFF meeting and have no interest in going to one. I have no stake whatsover in SOWERS and no current relationship with any of its board or staff. In other words, I have no interest in defending anything except everyone's right to express themselves here without being treated with disdain and having every word picked apart right out of the gate.

Rascal, thanks for trying to give a new poster a chance. You too, Tzaia. Okay, so Caleb made a misstep when he alluded to being ready to fight. He's 22. He's probably been reading all the criticisms of the group he's in, some of which have been nothing more than pure speculation, and maybe he came in with a bit of a chip on his shoulder. In that one regard he got off on the wrong foot. So? I was 22 once, too. Were any of you, those who are so miffed that he hasn't responded to your demands to answer the grilling he's gotten, ever 22 years old and enthusiastic about something? Apparently not. At least he apologized for the harsh words in his first post. But that wasn't enough for some people around here. Apparently they expect him to walk in here, denounce the group he apparently enjoys being in, and not only that, but to answer for every freaking wrong thing that was ever done under the twi banner. That's asking rather a lot, don't you think? Caleb, I'll say it again. Welcome. And thank you for apologizing. If you decide not to come back, please don't go away thinking everyone here wanted to shout you down, because that's not the case. I wish you the best, whether you stay or go.

Thanks for the suggestions. Paw, I do have IE8, which I've found to be a lot more buggy than 7 was. I guess I'll have to DL firefox. My sister's been bugging me for ages to get it. I resist change when it comes to computers. BTW, when a page doesn't fully load, neither does that window with the "IP Board" in it. I'll try your link to my PMs later.

I already tried clicking on my name, on the little down arrow in the box my name is in, and even the "picture" next to my name. I get no drop-down menu. Also, I'm having the same problem George St. George is having with not being able to access the last post in a thread. I was able to access the last post in the thread he's talking about, but not in a couple others. The thread seems to stop loading sometimes when there's a YouTube video embedded in a post that comes before the last one.

How do you access your PMs? I know when you first get a message there's a number or something by your name, and you can respond to the message. But if you don't answer right away and want to come back to reply, where do you find them?

I'll add my welcome to the recent SOWERS grad...welcome! You offered to answer questions. Boy, do the posters on GSC have a good supply of those! :) Some of the questions asked are good; some of them read like a script for an interrogation. I only have one: Is the intention of the SOWERS group to build on what was good about VP's (the grandfather) organization (specifically, The Way Corps, since that's what SOWERS seems to be modeled after), and do its leaders acknowledge what was not good about it, and are they endeavoring to correct those things? I'd suggest that you answer the questions you feel qualified and want to answer. You came here volunnarily. You're not obligated to defend or speak for the entire SOWERS organization. As Sudo says, our beliefs are all over the board. Some people (in the minority here, by far) still hold to all they were taught in PFAL and/or The Way Corps. The rest of us hold beliefs ranging from "similar to what The Way Int'l taught" to believing "a lot of it was BS but some of it was sound" to believing "none of it was true or worthwhile." There are evangelical Christians here, Mormons, Catholics, other Christians, Jews, Pagans, Wiccans, agnostics, and atheists (and probably more categories I don't know about), so be prepared to be disagreed with on a variety of fronts. :D If you're up to it, slip on your asbestos suit and have at it. If you want to debate doctrine, it would be a good idea to take that to the Doctrinal Forum rather than here. And it would be a great idea to leave the hints/threats of physical fighting on the playground where they belong. If you see my old pal Fred Sedahl (I knew him when I worked in Way Publications and he was doing PR for twi), please tell him I said hello and that I hope he's doing well!

Good point, Waysider!

Thanks for posting that, Roy. I had missed it on TV, and I'm glad you gave me another chance to see it. That was a three-Kleenex video clip! Good tears, though!

Exsie, GT said at the beginning of the thread that the chat room is on his "to do" list. As for rating posts, I think it's a bad idea. I could see this turning into a popularity (or unpopularity) contest. I don't like it. As Ex said, "I liked your post" works. It's always worked in the past, as has, "I disagree with your post." I also don't like the idea of closing threads that go off topic. The posts in the forums are writtern conversations. Conversations here evolve and change, just like face-to-face conversations. Sure, it can be annoying sometimes, but at other times conversations that veer off the track are more useful or interesting than the original topics.

Please note which forum I posted this in. I thought it was funny.

"A 16-year-old girl thought she heard her mother being assaulted by her boyfriend and rounded up some friends who beat him up, only to learn later that the couple actually were having sex, the woman and police said. The girl misinterpreted the woman's amorous screams, and she and four other teens went to the woman's bedroom in the Torrington home on June 6, police Lt. Bruce Whiteley said Thursday. "One of the teens beat the 25-year-old man with a bat and others punched him, police said. He suffered a black eye and several bruises." The whole story is at: http://www.rr.com/news/news/article/rr/6818193/8233768/Police_Conn_teens_mishear_sex_screams_beat_man This reminds me... We used to have fellowship at our apartment on Sunday mornings. Every Sunday, like clockwork, a couple in our complex had sex during our fellowship time, and the woman was very vocal. Needless to say it added some humor to the weekly meetings, especially in the early summer when we (and apparently the two lovers) had our windows open.

I don't believe using your brain (and your senses) is mutually exclusive with having faith in things that can't be detected by the senses. I believe we get information both through physical means and spiritual means.

What you want to believe or not is your business. You certainly don't answer to me. (Aren't you glad? :) ) I get annoyed, though, when it is stated or implied (IMO repeatedly) that any person of faith has taken complete leave of his or her senses.

While I agree that it's not a pretty sight (horrifying is the adjective I'd use for the treatment of that young man), I disagree that "this is the natural progression of things" or that one must "abandon reason" to embrace faith. My Christian faith isn't even on the same planet--no, not in the same universe--with behavior like that shown in the video. We get your point, George. You've made it often enough that my two dogs ought to be able to get it. I think even my cat (she's a little slow) is catching on.

I'm not sure, George. I don't think Aramaic was his "thing," but I could be wrong.

Penworks, thanks for confirming and clarifying what I thought I remembered. At my age you can never be too certain. :lol: By the way, we must have worked together, or at least been acquainted, since I was in Way Pub from 82-86 and had fairly frequent contact with the Research Dept. on the material we edited and they reviewed. I'll PM you.

Frank, here's a sweet bit of trivia about your movie, from IMDb: "While Christopher Reeve was filming this movie, the local theater decided to show his latest hit Superman (1978). Many of the "Somewhere" cast joined the locals for the event. Early into the screening, the sound went out. Reeve, who was seated next to Jane Seymour, stood up in the audience and delivered all the lines." Can you imagine being in the audience when that happened? If you liked Somewhere in Time, check out the book Time and Again by Jack Finney, written in 1970. The movie isn't based on that book...well, not exactly. The person who wrote the book the movie was based on (in 1975) "borrowed" liberally from Finney's book, and in fact called his character "Prof. Finney." Finney's book also involved an old coin, a hotel room, and a love that spanned time. In Finney's book, the time-travelling main character is an artist in an ad agency and the setting is New York City. It's an illustrated novel; the illustrations are supposed to be done by the main character. Time and Again is one of my all-time favorite novels and is my all-time favorite time-travel story. I always thought Somewhere in Time was based on it, until today when I looked it up. So thanks to you, Frank, I learned something. :) Well, two things. I also learned that Jack Finney wrote The Body Snatchers, basis for the classic horror movie Invasion of the Body Snatchers.

By the way, it's a collection agency. :D