waysider

Not trying to step on any toes here, but, if no one minds, I thought I would toss in an easy one (I hope) just to keep the party going while we wait for Pawnbroker. A preachment, dear friend You are about to receive On John Barleycorn, nicotene and the temptations of Eve. No parking by the sewer sign Hot dog, my razor's broke Water dripping up the spout But I don't care-----------------------. Hint: It was released the same year that the "Summer of Love" took place. (Now that's what I call Pre-'86!) :)

Hi Joe. We met briefly,not long ago, in Guitar Talk. I would like to hear more about this current guitar venture you are working on. You mentioned you are a blues fan. Do you do much with bottleneck or open tunings? Hopefully we will meet again in Guitar Talk. Waysider---------

What am I doing wrong? I still see the same one as usual. Hmmm! Maybe if I believe a little harder---------- :)

VPW and his "crew" were not only fond of borrowing doctrinal material but also were known to borrow anecdotal material as well. Consider,if you will, the anecdote of teaching to the trees. This one was "borrowed" from Billy Graham. There are others as well that have been documented to have been borrowed. It would not suprise me a bit to find this instance in the writings of E.S. Jones, since he spent so much time in India himself. It also seems like somewhat of a modern day reenactment of Mark 3:1-5. I believe VPWs' recounting of this story was in PFAL session one and also in the corresponding section of the PFAL book. In the opening session of the advanced class, he(VPW) taught a similar story about a man looking for his wife who was arriving on a train.He used this one to teach word of knowledge. He may have borrowed these from Rufus Mosely or Glenn Clarke or any one of the many others whose names he mentioned in his teachings. Whether it's true or not, what puzzles me is this: Here is this guy who says he doesn't believe in Jesus who gets the healing while we, on the other hand, were supposed to SIT endlessly, go to endless meetings, learn scripture after scripture after scripture and so on in order to be considered worthy of Gods' blessings in our lives and most of us saw zip in the way of results. OOPS! I just realized he was using this to sell us on the validity of that whacky "law of believing". What was I thinking?

I find it an interesting topic to read but have little to contribute in the way of posting experiences.

"While I am on the subject, let me make myself more unpopular." ---------Full Circle------------------- Why?, because you are not afraid to open up and speak what's on your mind? I, for one, think you brought up quite a few valid points. I do agree with you on being told what to expect and then using that to justify an experience. The experience I posted (#34) happened before I even knew what "revelation" was. That's why it concerned me so much and I sought the advise of the twig leader. I had been "in The Word" for only a matter of days, perhaps a week at that point. Another experience I had happened years before my involvement with TWI and involved something my Dad said to me that had to have come from somewhere other than his own thinking simply because it was so immediate and had a profoundly lasting effect. Outside of these and a few that were similar, I never really saw "The Manifestations" happening at all, especially DOS which always seemed to me to be more like the discerners' "Freudian Slip Showing". Charging for classes: Heck! The Fu!!er Brush Man charges for brushes doesn't he? PFAL and the rest of the classes were merely "the brushes" that TWI hawked in order to build a financial empire at the expense of their unwitting customer base.Unlike TWI,though, the Fu!!er brush man didn't try to convince you he was tapped into some holy wisdom that could change your life. He just offered a better way to clean your toilet. Hmmm. There's an analogy hiding in there but I can't quite put it into words.

Here's the thing. Those of us who were around for the VPW years had a tendency to hang on his every word and suggestion because we thought that maybe it was: A.) revelation B.) rooted in a deep spiritual understanding of the scriptures C.) a combination of both In reality, it was nothing more than the personal opinion of a guy who grew up on a farm, in rural Ohio, during The Great Depression. Add to that, a fondness for pretending that things he said and wrote originated with him. He also was quite fond of leaving us to draw our own conclusions as to whether what he spoke was divinely inspired or not. Just because VP said "this is how it is" or "this is what the scriptures say", really means very little in light of what we now know about what the real VP was like. What if Farmer Jones had told us the same things? Would we place such a high value on their importance? I think,too, we must consider the culture that existed when The NT was current and try to understand some of the directives in it in that light. Sure, truth is truth, but we do not live in that culture and must temper our understanding with that realization. The pay and promotion indiscrepancies are very real, not just in third world counties, but right here in good old hometown US of A. Much of this is not likely to change drastically in our lifetimes. That is why we as individuals must make a consentrated effort to try to rise above these inequities on a daily basis. That's just my opinion--------everybody has one.

This is a man's world But it wouldn't be NOTHIN' Without a woman or a girl---------James Brown(The Godfather of Soul) Now, if you like your commentary with a little musical accompaniment,you just might like to check out a group called-----------Saphire: The Uppity Blues Women--------These ladies are world class musicians and pull NO punches when it comes to stating the case for womanhood. OK. I guess I got a bit off topic, sorry.

If my memory serves me correctly, Bumpy made an off-the-cuff remark on a thread called"There's Something About TWI Stuck in My Mind." (or something like that) and then the topic moved here in order to keep the other thread on track. Anybody else recall if that's where it started? edited to correct somewordsthatrantogether.

Hi, Guitar Lady! Happy Birthday! --------------------------------- ------------------------------------

Are these two different tunes? The last part sounds like something out of "Space Jams" by Quad City DJ's

When I first got "in the Word", in the early '70's it was common to say "Would someone bring forth------", implying a voluntary response. My first time was before I took PFAL and I had only been speaking in tongues for a matter of days. (Some of these time frames are hard to pin down because they were so long ago.) RE: other manifestations.--------word of knowledge and word of wisdom were the two that I would have to say I definetly believe I saw. I have posted on this before but I can't tell you how to find it. I put two examples on this very thread(#4 & #34). Number 34 sounds like I am making a joke but I assure you I am not. The impartation manifestations?------Not so sure I ever really saw those. Healings used to scare the crap out of me because here was this person counting on me for their healing or miracle, and I was getting zip, zero, zilch as to what to do or say Anyway, I don't think "SIT much" or being a "fireball" in a believers' meeting has squat to do with whether you get word of wisdom or word of knowledge. I have to say "nada" on discerning of spirits. Somewhat off topic: You mentioned on another thread that TWI was thinking about going back to VPW teachings. I think it would be time well spent if you examined two specific threads/ articles. Those two are ACTUAL ERRORS IN PFAL and DOCTRINAL ERRORS IN PFAL. (sorry, I'm not yelling; I don't know how to do that italics thing yet.)Maybe someone else can tell you how to find them.

Don't despair, my young friend. We still haven't heard from the ones who DID succeed, despite this silly idea. (And I know for a fact that there are some.)

Sorry!

Anyone remember when this concept was taught and subsequently vigorously promoted? TWI certainly is not the only group to push this agenda. Additionally, there may be many who initially followed this advise and built lasting marriages. There are probably some even here at GSC. The point is, does any organization have a right to dictate who their members may date or marry? Many Eastern cultures still follow this mindset but it is done within the context of their societies. My first marriage was based on this and it was a fiasco. Anyone else have any thoughts on "inbeeding"?(Keeping "The Household" a closed corporation.) (Either as a participant or observer or maybe someone who would just like to comment.)

Something in RGs' post sparked an idea for a new thread. Anyone remember how VPW taught that "any two believers can make a marriage work"? This set the stage for a rash of in-house marriages or "inbeeding" in you prefer that term. OK------ Off to discuss it on another thread.

Based on the cadence and the"YO,******" I would have to guess it's rap. That's as close as I can get. Hmmm------Now what rhymes with "orange"?

"O'Shanta McLachaseetay For Yea, me lads and lassies-------------" Sorry. Got a bit carried away then,didn't I? Nope. No Irish here. Nary e'en a wee bit.

Likeaneagle----- Your incident reminds me of the guy who beats his wife until, one day, she threatens to blow his cover and leave him. "Oh, Honey",he says, "I can change and I promise things will be different." Well, things are better---------for a while-------------and then one day,out of the blue, the woman finds herself searching for her sunglasses to hide her blackened eyes in shame. She is sure it must be her fault because he promised he would change. TWI is not going to change. They can say,"I promise things will be different." til the cows come home, but those problems are so ingrained in their very fabric of thinking that it's only a matter of time until the "sunglass search" would begin. I have been out of TWI for a long time but I still remember that whenever adultery was taught, there was almost always a smugness that implied,"If you are REALLY spiritual, you will see that it is referring to "spiritual" adultery and idolotry. What a crock of horse hooey. They tried to make you feel inferior because you saw it for what it actually was! Even in CF&S, VPW taught that intercourse was a "spiritual "event.(his words) Well,gosh, what woman wouldn't want to share a "spiritual" event with the greatest MOG to have walked the Earth in the past 2,000 years? Did that sound cynical enough? They are not likely to change because, quite simply, it would negate the doctrine they have spent the last umpteen years drumming into their followers minds. As to inviting you back: Who knows, maybe your return would be regarded as some kind of spiritual "score". I don't know if that's the case, but think back on the trophy mentality that permeated the organization during your association with them.

RG For what it's worth, I still believe that at least that part of it was not a myth.

Hi Joe! Just wondering if your handle is a hint that you play bass. Ya know, like"Play me a 1/4 note "walking bass".? This next tune is in AMajor so jump right in when your ready. (That would be a D harp for all you cross harp players.) Anywho, welcome to our little juke joint.

Who the he!! cares?!!! It was probably "borrowed" like everything else he said anyway!

Shortfuse---------I know what you mean about "the last jar of mayo" kind of thing. My experience was quite different so I will try to recount it as best I can 35 years after the fact. I spoke in tongues very shortly after being witnessed to. No one led me in . Then I manifested in a believers' meeting just because the meeting leader said "someone bring forth-------" (That drew some memorable looks on unsuspecting faces.) I told my twig leader and he instructed me in how to do a "lift list". I knew very little about the organization and even less about VPW. I had seen his photo in The Way Mag and that is what I tried to visualize for my lift list.(This was my first time doing a lift list thing.) Instead, I saw an image of him wearing that silly neck scarf that I later found out he liked to wear. He had a menacing smirk on his face and he was -----well------flipping me the bird.He was uttering a well known phrase that starts with" f "and ends with "you". It was very vivid and not based on any previous experience or knowledge. This exact experience never happened again but I can still see that image in my memory like it was yesterday. I felt at the time that it was a sign that something was very wrong with what I had become involved in. I talked to my twig leader about it and he said I should chalk it up to unrenewed mind. This was a concept to which I was extremely new also, but he seemed to know what he was talking about so I put it on the back burner( but it resurfaced from time to time, not the image, just a recollection of having had the experience.) I've had similar types of experiences through the years but nothing ever even came close to the intensity of that one. It was like opening your front door to leave for work, still half asleep, and being confronted, face to face by a snarling gorilla. I know that is probably not a very good depiction of what happened but it's the best I can do. Waysider

Told the repo man this mornin' "Go ahead and take the damn TV!" I'm tired of lookin' at stuff I can't get When there's things we really need. They oughta have a "Poor Folks' Channel" For people down on their luck Where they don't advertise not one thing that costs you more than a buck. I've got 14 dollars in the bank, Fifteen hundred worth of unpaid bills(just this month) Told my baby,"It's gonna be alright" (But I don't believe it will.) --------That's from "$14 in The Bank" by Paul DeLay-----It's one of my favorite P.D. songs Sad, sad news in the music world today. I just learned that the Gentle Giant himself, Paul Delay passed away last Wednesday ,3/07/07, in Portland, Oregon. Paul had just played a gig and felt under the weather. He thought he might have bronchitis so he went to the hospital. It turns out he was in the very last stage of leukemia. That was on Monday and he passed away on that Wednesday. He was only 55. There will be a special memorial concert in Portland on April first, but I don't know any details. Besides being perhaps the greatest harmonica player that ever lived, he was a super "all around nice guy." I have a couple Paul stories, but I'll save them for another time. May you rest in peace,Paul. You will be missed in a very big way.

That's how it is livin' "life by the drop".------------SRV