waysider

I am embarrassed and ashamed that I was involved at both an assistant and instructor level in running this class. My heartfelt apology goes out to anyone who may have sat through a class that I was involved with. waysider

KUDOS No small task, for sure!

DISCLAIMER! The following is not really about death, per se, and is strictly---JUST MY OPINION. I no longer believe that devil spirits are beings or creatures or whatever the correct term is. Still, I think they represent something that IS real. Example: Page 20 0f the Advanced Class syllabus states that alcoholism is caused by a DS named Leviathan. I don't believe that "Leviathan" is an actual being but rather a symbolic representation of something very real that takes place in the human psyche. Perhaps it even interacts at a so-called spiritual level. I don't know. Even so, I think it is representative of something real, though not a "being" or spiritual "entity". So then, even though it may really exist in a person's life, it is idiotic to think that simply ordering it to "be gone" will penetrate the complex network that surrounds the human mind. I'm not at all sure how any of that relates to the subject at hand, which is DEATH, other than we somehow got onto the subject of devil spirits infiltrating the mind at times of weakness, such as at the time one is having a near death experience. Sorry---- I'm just rambling again.

Hi Nero I still speak in tongues silently. I find it it be an effective way to clear my mind and refocus. Here's an example: I'm sitting in the dentist's chair and the pain is intense. I start to speak in tongues to myself, not as a prayer or anything like that. I find that it tricks my mind into ignoring the pain. That's enough reason right there for me to keep it. I do think, however, that TWI was very wrong in what they taught about ALL of the so-called "manifestations". But-----That's just my opinion. OK--- Now it's my turn to feel silly. What the heck are XP and :3?

Rats are rodents! I don't mean that to sound like a personal slam, they just are. Opossum, on the other hand, are marsupials. You know, those critters that have a pouch where they keep their young'uns. Their related to kangaroos and wallabies and wombats. Now about this here hollerin' stuff. I always heard you should holler at a 'possum to stay away from your supper. If you saw some of the stuff they will eat, you definitely would think twice before tossing one in the stew pot. No, actually, "holler" is a slang term for "hollow" which is a valley nestled into the hills. It's used in this sense as a noun, not a verb. (Had to throw that in on account of the "research" aspect of our backgrounds.) There's also a place nearby known locally as Skunk Holler, though that is an unofficial name. Here's some more local "speak". Roastin' Ears---------That's corn that you put on the fire while it's still in the husk instead of cleaning and boiling it. Yum,Yum---That there's good eatin'!

Thanks, JB That accident was 20 years ago. I've had similar experiences before and after. Guess I'm either accident prone or willing to take too many chances to put food on the table. Same thing every time, extreme instant sadness. Personally, what i think happens is that the body is confused by the abruptness of the trauma and starts sending out chemicals without examining the RX very closely. Thus too much of this, too little of that and so on. The thing I always laugh about when I watch those shows is this: Why would Aunt Minnie's spirit want to hide in my linen closet? I mean, it's a spirit, ya know? If I had freedom to go where ever I choose, I think I'd pick someplace other than a linen closet. Like someplace where I didn't have to look at white sheets all day.

cman I think I see part of what you are getting at. I call it the "state of death" in order to differentiate it from the actual "act of dying". Maybe that terminology isn't the most descriptive. The point is that, I was trying to show "death" and "dying" as being two different things. Kinda like the difference between "falling into a sleep" (not the death variety) and "being asleep".(having already gone through the falling process)

Irisheyes It does indeed sit here idling for several days sometimes. Lots of reasons, really.----- TS travels a lot, from what I understand. I'm not always at a computer that I can log on to.---- People get involved with other threads that interest them---- and the list goes on. As far as rules go------ It has to have had "airplay". If lyrics vary from version to version, the answer should reflect the version posted. NO GOOGLING! It's not a rule, but the older stuff usually works better here 'cause --well--- most of us ain't spring chickens, if you get my drift. And most importantly------- it's just for fun. I let my curiosity get the best of me and googled this one. I think it's a really good one. I even have the album it came from but who knows the last time I played it? Somebody will probably guess it.

"Where does one get a Prophet's License?" Well now, seems like a TRUE prophet would know EXACTLY where to get one, no? Hmmmmm. Maybe I'm confusing prophet with psychic. Which makes me wonder why Miss Cleo didn't see it coming when the long arm of the law closed in on her. Just rambling here.

Sorry, I don't have any guesses to offer regarding the similarities in experiences. Do you have to be conscious to have an NDE? Maybe that seems like I'm jesting but I'm really not. I came very, very near to death in the operating room once. (That at least accounts for the ND part of NDE.) I have absolutely no memory of it. I wouldn't even have known if a family member hadn't "let he cat out of the bag". Another time( one of several, actually) I had a construction accident that was extremely close. I was 4 stories up, all alone, in an unfinished structure when the accident occurred. There were no stairs so I had to climb down a series of ladders to reach the ground, all the while holding my head to try to control the bleeding. The flush of emotion happened at the very moment the accident took place, not during my descent. At the hospital, I discovered that I came within 1 or 2 millimeters of having my carotid artery severed. It was surreal to think about, but still, this was after that moment of extreme and acute emotion had passed. I think at that moment, my mind saw dying as a foregone conclusion and was struggling to comprehend the state of death it anticipated. No bright lights or anything like that, just an overwhelming sense of sadness.

Here's kind of a goofy thought that crossed my mind. I talked to someone recently who has had several people close to them die in the past few years. The person told me they are not afraid of dying and that if it happened today, they are ready. (No, I don't think this had any suicide connotations.) I didn't really think to ask this at the time, but now the question crosses my mind. When most people ponder this subject, do they ponder the STATE of death or the actual ACT of dying? Of course, there's no way to look at that statistically but it piques my interest. Personally, I'm not afraid of being dead, but I'm REALLY not keen on the actual dying part. I know that's probably weird but it seemed related to the subject. On a side note: I have had some experiences in my life that appeared to be events where, momentarily, you think to yourself, "This is it, it's over." Events that happened accidentally and quickly. Looking back on them, all I can remember, on an emotional level, was having an incredible swell of sadness overtake me. In a moments time I went from being "just fine" to being more depressed than I had ever been in my life. It wasn't a thought process, really, more of a flood of emotion. So I guess my question is: are we talking about the act of dying or the state of death?

WHATTTTT!!!!? They left out dmiller!!! Idiots!

Yep "White bird must fly or she will die." I think I have the vinyl here someplace along with Basket Of Light by Pentangle. Hot Tuna---Jorma has a place not far from here where he holds workshops. Jack Cassidy is involved in it too. Zydeco---What's not to like? Saw a good zydeco(kinda) group at a festival this summer called Robin Lacy and DeZydec. Lots-O-Fun!! Eat More crawfish!!!!!

Oh, Lordy!! Forgot all about "duck and cover" and fall out shelters. Let's see if I remember correctly. Get under your desk and put your hands over your head. Yup, that'll keep those nasty radiation bugs from gnawing on you. Uh-Huh.

Amen to that, sister.

Oh, my gosh!!! You don't really feel that way, do you? We're having waaaaaay too much fun to think that way!!! ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Did I feel like the veil had been lifted when I left? No. Not at all. I didn't know about what had happened so I spent a long time feeling like I had "tripped out". I didn't realize that all I had really done was to break free from a cult. --------------------------------------------------------------- That's all for now. I have to go investigate a strangely bright light and whirring noise coming from my linen closet.

Hi there, JeffSjo Glad you could make it to the party. The band is on break at the moment, but the music should start very shortly. If you need help finding something or doing something, please don't be shy.

Nope. No joke. There were people in Fellow Laborers who were rousted out of bed in the middle of the night and given this directive. Imagine being in the middle of rural Ohio with very little money and a car that ain't worth a poop and being told you better clear the state line before the sun went down. We had people from Ohio, Penn., Virginia, Kansas, New York, New Jersey, Texas, California, etc. This same type of thing happened in the way corps, probably even more so because the corps was so much bigger. We weren't allowed to ask questions or discuss it. We had to carry on as if the person never existed. Anyway, after seeing some of that stuff happen, I don't think God will hold it against us if we were wrong about "believer's meetings".

Maybe the questioning phase is a vital part of the process that we are supposed to go through. Just a thought. But, hey! If we adhered to the dogma of session #7(never even consider) we would miss out on that completely. Anyway, no matter what you believe, you can't go too wrong with the "love your neighbor" stuff even if you don't give much thought to the "Love God" part.

If you tried to "believe" that your spouse( who had left you because you couldn't recognize you were in a cult) would have a miraculous epiphany and come back home, you were in a cult. NUTSO!

I wouldn't worry about it, Nero. Think about all the leaders who could supposedly see a debul spirt hiding under a flat rock 3 counties away. Or maybe this: "Thou shalt leave MY state before the sun sets tomorrow or face the wrath of God!" <_<

Here's a bit of a twist on the "concept/reality" train of thought: Gravitational force is a scientific concept. One can perform scientific tests to prove its existence. Still, under some circumstances, its effects are reduced or even nullified. ----BUT------- If you should step out of a 17th story window, the concept will immediately and profoundly take on an element of reality. Perhaps the devil is like this, also. His entity is conceptual in nature but failure to follow the prescribed "rules" will evoke a very real effect. Maybe death, too, is a multi-faceted concept that takes on a very real identity when we cease to breath. Now, I suppose one could pose the question, "Is God a concept or reality?" That would be a fair and reasonable question for the human mind to ponder. Countless numbers have done so through the course of time. Perhaps the very act of pondering this question is part of the "master plan". It may allow you to see truths you might never see if you adhere to the edict heralded in session #7 of PLAF. ie:" Thou shalt never consider.(ponder) Without the ability to at least consider and even respond, we commit ourselves to accepting what is handed to us. That's not always in our best interests, as we have seen from observing the very real outcome of the concepts expounded by TWI. As alwaYS---- jUST MY OPINION.

I tried to "lift" VPW once and he smiled back at me with a smirk as he flipped me the finger! Totally unexpected and bigger than life. No kiddin'!! I had only been "in the Word" for about a week or so and hadn't even taken "the class". Freaked me out! Does that one count? I'm not making that up to get a laugh. Thing is, Roy, I think God sometimes shows us things that are just for us alone as individuals. They may be just for you to help you understand something about life.(or a scripture) When you experience some wonder of nature or witness a baby being born, I think God is communicating some word-less lesson about life, or even death, that goes beyond scriptures and written words. You may well be the only one that understands a particular "vision" and I think God intends for it to be that way. I think it's really cool that you keep a record of these things. Even though you may think that you don't understand them, perhaps a part of you really DOES in a manner that supersedes the presence of words on a page. Holy hugs to ya, Bro. I'm proud to say I know you, even if it is only through cyber space.

Hmmmmmm!-----How badly do you want them? We might be able to strike a deal.