waysider

Oldiesman I may have misunderstood your explanation of why the lives of Paul and Peter(add Stephen to that, if you like.) ended in the awful ways they did. Please feel free to correct me if I have. (misunderstood) Your stance appears to be that these men died these horrible deaths because they were deficient in their ability to operate the "law" of believing in regard to deliverance. In other words, it was their own fault. Is that your contention? Aren't you the same guy who can't understand why people didn't just walk away from The Way? What is that phrase you have used,"No one held a gun to their heads."? The Way taught people that to walk away was equivalent to leaving the "hedge of protection" that the "one true household" provided. In essence they were saying that to leave would put you out of fellowship and at the mercy of "the adversary". And, of course, if you are "out of fellowship", it's impossible to receive revelation that might be required for personal safety and survival. You could end up the same way these men of Biblical note did if you walked away. Is that how you justify why these aforementioned men died? Because they brought it onto themselves through "unbelief"? Please clarify if I have misconstrued your meaning.

You are correct. It is, indeed, Donovan. Dylan has never done it, though it certainly has that same kind of flavor. When Donovan hit the scene in the mid 1960's, he was often referred to as the UK's answer to Dylan. (He is Scottish) That particular style was quite popular at that time. Lyrics were of utmost importance to this type of music. Another singer/songwriter that took a similar approach was one of my all time favorite "folkies", Eric Anderson. Eric actually started out as a contemporary of Dylan. Anderson, Dylan and Phil Ochs often played the same clubs in Greenwich Village. Here is Eric Anderson in 1970 in case you would like a sample. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g70zT3lXPZc Yer Next!!!!!

A liter is just slightly larger than a quart.

Thanks, jen-o I don't think you are rambling at all. You're making perfect sense.

"In the chilly hours and minutes of uncertainty, I long to be in the warm hold of your loving mind."

I sure wish I would have had your wisdom and insight when I was 18. Que Sera Sera.

Good Lovin'-------The Rascals---?? (Or were they still called The Young Rascals then?)

You got it! Written and recorded by Tom Waits but far better known for the treatment it received from The Eagles.

The dictionary cited seems to contradict itself. Definition #1 suggests that polytheists are pagan whereas definition #2 excludes the theistic requirements, either partially or in total. Hellenism is characterized by polytheism and the exclusion of a connection to Abraham.

Slight diversion

It sounds like it might be describing the ill-fated Franklin Expedition to find The Northwest Passage.

I understand the concept and agree with the essence of it. Part of the problem, though, is that some of the damages done to people are not at the conscious, thinking level. I recently posted a somewhat analogous example of a WWII vet who suffered from what we now call PTSS or PTSD. It's like a virus that lived inside him, biding its time until conditions were right to surface. It's not something you control by "thinking" about it. You can forgive people on a conscious level and, according to The Word, you should. It's not beneficial to carry grudges and retaliatory thoughts. Plenty of medical and psychological studies will bare this out. So, forgiving at the conscious level can certainly be a valuable part of the process but it's not the complete answer all by itself. You can "never think about it again" and still suffer from adverse reactions that are tied to something deeper than the thought process. IMO

Even if you find a number, it's accuracy would be dubious at best. The Way never considered itself a cult. I suspect many others fly "under the radar" as well. I used to work with someone who, at one time, belonged to a cult called The Fellowship Of Believers. From what was described, it was remarkably similar to TWI. I have never been able to find any information on them at all. There is a church that uses that same name but, as far as I know, there is no connection. You might try the following link: http://www.caic.org.au/zentry1.htm

I heard this being used as early as the early 1970's as a corroboration of something that VPW taught. It might have been four crucified. I don't recall off hand. The point that people made was that if two people who knew nothing of each other's work had reached the same conclusion, it surely must be true. This reasoning is tainted on more than one level. First, because we now know that Wierwille WAS aware of Bullinger's work. Secondly, because Wierwille presented this as being unique information that was given to him personally by God. Third, because Wierwille had stated that he had hauled all his reference material to the dump and started over. Fourth, because we now know it is faulty research that arrives at an erroneous conclusion. Wierwille not only used someone else's work as if it were his own, he never even did the proper work required to prove or disprove its validity.

The commonality that exists among "The Big Three" is that they are monotheistic and all consider their origin to be with Abraham. It's an academic point, not a subjective evaluation. Here is a "Wiki" that explains some of it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abrahamic_religion Sorry, I know that strays from the larger topic but it addresses the sub-topic at hand.

Here's the next one. It's not the opening line but I think it's pretty recognizable. (At least I hope so.) "Now the sun's coming up; I'm riding with Lady Luck, freeway cars and trucks".

Drive downhill-----Both ways.

Actually, two come to mind on this one. 1. Day Tripper-------Beatles 2. Kind Woman-----------Buffalo Springfield Or is there another one?

Here's Rupert Oysler as he kicked some serious butt on an old Sonny Boy II song yesterday.

Brought to the top for new arrivals. (Click on little red arrow at top/right to go to start of thread.)

I could be wrong on this but, it was always my understanding that the word "pagan" referred to someone who was not Jewish, Christian or Muslim.(Simple as that.) The Native American peoples, for example, had spiritual beliefs that were deeply seated but since they did not fit this criteria, they would be technically classified as Pagans. It's a matter of semantics, really. Many people use the term in a derogatory sense but I don't think that's an accurate usage of the word.

I'm not sure I know how to answer your question, jeast. Seeing things in perspective now, I realize I never turned my back on God, I walked away from a cult. That's about the best I can explain it. It reminds me of an old joke that has some wisdom laced in it I saw a man standing next to a wall. He was methodically banging his head against it. I said, "Why are you doing that? Doesn't it hurt?" "Yes", he said, "It hurts terribly----but it feels so good when I stop."

Don't be so sure. I think a lot of people here can "relate".