waysider

T-Bone asked: "If one of the sins of the teacher is lying, then what part of the teaching is truth?" To which Oldies responded: "The implication being that if a teacher lies somewhere, a teacher can't teach the truth... The content of plagiarized material isn't true because it has been plagiarized. You shouldn't drive the Autobahn because Hitler was involved in building it. and so forth..." ---------------------------------------------------------------- That's a complete distortion of T-Bone's question. It's simply a blatant attempt to exonerate Wierwille. And yes, it is a strawman. It's diverting the question at hand away from center stage and replacing it with a stand-in.

I find it rather sad that what started as an effort to remember Sandra Ann Sullivan has deteriorated into a platform promoting the "Wierwille Admiration Society" (As do far too many other well intentioned threads.)

Sociopaths make perfect middle managers. They are the business version of a "survivor".They will praise you for anything you do that helps THEM. Sometimes they will praise you for things that don't appear to have an ulterior motive and the praise will feel oddly hollow.If they think you have become a liability or have discovered some dirty secret about them, they can drop you like a hot potato and never feel a drop of remorse. They may feign remorse because they know that you and society in general will expect it. But, in reality, they are "play acting". It's to your benefit to know if you are dealing with a sociopath ahead of time because the more you can know about the opposition the better off you'll be. BTW---I'm only telling you this because I care.

Hitler never declared himself a monster.

"If you gotta go You better live your life before you pass away Don't waste a day All your life's been spent locked in your room You never had a chance to roam Away from home." ------------------------------------------------------- (Not a real big hit but a memorable one.)

Oldies I couldn't care less whether or not you would feel remorse. (Especially in light of the fact that you've previously indicated you wouldn't.) What's being discussed here is Wierwille's lack of empathy, not yours. He displayed no sense of remorse for his involvement in the stated events. Debate the significance of that if you want to but don't deny the reality.

Is it Cinnamon Girl by Neil Young?

David Garibaldi is playing drums for Tower of Power. (Or at least he was 6 months ago)

shiftthis Take a chill pill,dude. Life is just too short to let yourself get that worked up. It ain't healthy That is, of course, if you really are as worked up as you appear to be. Personally, I don't really understand how you could possibly be associated with the same organization that is being discussed here and not understand what people need to heal from. Have you taken a little time to read some of the things I suggested on the home page? Were you around when the way taught "the one true household"? Do you recall what they said would happen if you ever ventured outside the "hedge of protection"? Take a few minutes and listen to the latest podcast, "Through The Fog". It's on the home page. This stuff is not fabricated. There are people here who did much more than simply "go to twig". There are people here who were branch leaders, limb leaders, trunk leaders, etc. Do you really think they are making this stuff up? Why would they want to do that? Did you know Wierwille was a chronic alcoholic who drank incessantly? Did you know he was a sexual predator who preyed on young Corps women? Did you know he used the ABS to buy a fleet of motorcycles and classic cars for his personal enjoyment? OK--I know, that's a lot of questions. Just one more though----- Do you still tithe/ABS and where does the money go?

Johnny and June

Maybe this is off topic but, have you ever noticed that people with these tendencies seem to have a "knack" for finding their way into middle management positions?

shiftthis There are some excellent threads here that discuss these very subjects at great length. Might I suggest you "study" them a bit before you formulate your final opinion?

Re: The order to fire http://www.kboo.fm/node/2983

Suzanne

Dot Quit beating yourself up trying to equate OT vows with modern day "promises". They're not the same thing.I took a salt covenant the first time I got married. It was basically one of those "any two believers-------"kind of arrangements.It didn't work out. It no longer matters to me why it didn't. I'm just glad we didn't stay together simply because we went through the motions of a ritual that holds a different meaning today than it did in the OT. Maybe she's even on GreaseSpot. I don't know. It doesn't matter. I have no animosity toward her. I hope she has none toward me. I'm glad now that we went our separate ways. It was the best thing for both of us. Hang in there, Dot. Don't try to solve too many puzzles at one time. It's too stressful. Just work on the day-to-day stuff for now. That's my two cents. Probably over priced at that. Love ya waysider

Hi there, fellow North Coaster! We have our ISP as part of our cable TV package. We run the cable into a N3tg3ar router that has 4 hard-wire ports as well as wireless.Right now, we run 1 PC(mine) and 2 laptops off of it. Our house isn't very big. I don't know if that enters into the picture or not. Can you tell I'm not too savvy about this stuff?

Phil Nice to hear from you. There is a prayer thread here, too. If you want to put a prayer request in there for your Dad, we would be honored to pray for him. Not saying you should or shouldn't. Just letting you know it's there if you want to. Thanks for the "heads up". waysider

Shiftthis It's all tongue in cheek. Yeah, I know, we have a warped sense of humor here. That's part of the attraction. Though I will tell you this, there are some who are 100% convinced PFAL is God Breathed. No amount of reason or logic can sway them from that conviction. Stick around awhile and maybe you'll cross paths. Hey! Have you had a chance to check out some of the games in The Reading Room? Stop by and help us play "name that tune" or "movie pictionary". Or, stop over in the "Doctrinal Room" if you want to get all "heavy". Enjoy!!

Part of the problem for many of us is that we were buying a product we knew little to nothing about. We were discouraged from comparison shopping and, in fact, were told there was no similar product with which to compare it. Yep, it's the first one to come down the production line in 2,000 years. Whether we knew it or not, there were a lot of "hard sell" tactics being used. "Ya know, if you don't take the class next week, there may not be another one for months!" "If you don't get in this "film class", you might have to settle for a "tape class". And on and on and on and on. Long story made short-----We bought something under false pretenses.

I think it is particularly relevant, from a standpoint of context, to bring these events to the awareness of our younger posters. I would suppose that some of them may find it a bit baffling why we ever got involved in the first place. This is the world that was influencing us "oldsters" at the time we were exposed to PFAL. We had grown up in a world that was completely different from this new, changing world that was being thrust upon us. So, PFAL wasn't just another "fad book" on a daytime talk show. It was something that seemed to have answers to the very real problems that were woven into our lives. It was like light at the other end of a dark tunnel. Maybe that's why it is so hard for some folks to admit to themselves that, to a large degree, we were pawns in a massive hoax. As usual, that's just my opinion.

WE ARE UNDER ATTACK!

Hmmmmm! Maybe more like I Think We're All Bozos On This Bus or Nick Danger, Third Glass Eye.

Holy shmoly! How did that big glass eye escape my scrutiny??

shiftthis I can't remember if I said "welcome" so Here goes WELCOME! Hearing this stuff for the first time can be a real slap in the face for many people, including myself. The thing is, there are people here who not only know about it but also experienced it first hand. I too was in The Way for quite some time and never had a clue about what was really going on. Yes, I saw things at specific locations that were suspect but I thought they were isolated incidents. Without trying to sound like I am being contrite, consider the following: Wierwille taught that alcoholism is caused by devil possession.(spirit of leviathan if I recall correctly.) Yet, He lived his life in a constant drunken stupor, including the times he stood in the pulpit.( What did you think was the purpose of the "mints"?) He taught that any kind sexual deviance, whether it be homosexuality or predatory behavior, was caused by devil possession. Yet, he himself preyed on the vulnerability of, God only knows how many, young women with whose well being he was entrusted. He taught that cancer was caused by devil possession and yet his cause of death was cancer.(A copy of his death certificate is here on GSC if you care to find it.) My suggestion is to examine some of the materials you with find on the home page such as the editorials, the doctrinal errors in PFAL, the actual errors in PFAL, etc. I also encourage you to listen to the podcasts, especially the latest two.(Through the Fog and Losing The Way) I sincerely hope you will stick around so we can get to know each other a little better. One little question(and I hope this doesn't sound out of line.) Is there still a tithing/ABS policy in place? What is the percentage? Where does it go? Again----Welcome aboard.