waysider

Kinda looks like they weren't as "spiritual tuned in" as they would have had us believe. Wierwille claimed suicide was caused by a devil spirit yet he failed to spot this supposed "spirit" in this young woman. That's not a very encouraging endorsement for his so-called "spiritual perception". In fact, it's not much of an endorsement for the whole concept of "devil possession".

That sounds a bit counter-productive to me. This is a forum for voicing opinions. Those opinions will not always be in agreement. Voicing an opinion that is in disagreement with another poster's opinion does not constitute a "personal attack" in and of itself. If another poster voices an opinion that appears to me to be idolatrous, there is nothing wrong with me or anyone else voicing an opposing view to that opinion as long as I address the opinion without attacking the poster. IMO

The problem with the truth that Wierwille spoke(and, yes, I believe some of what he spoke contained "truth", at least in the conventional sense.) is that it's like mixing flea poop in a pepper shaker. How in the world can you completely separate it all back out again?

More like they pushed her back in after she thought she had made it to the safety of the shore.

C'mon, Baby, do the Locomotion--------Little Eva

Perhaps you don't quite understand what a person attack is, Oldies. A personal attack is when a person attacks you rather than the position you take or the opinion you express. Here is an example: Speaker#1. "What you are saying is false." Speaker #2. "Are you calling me a liar?"(Changes the subject) Speaker #1. "I am not calling you anything at all. I am simply stating that your premise is false." Now, if the person, instead, called you a liar, that would be a personal attack because they are no longer attacking the opinion, they are attacking you as a person. My post did not accuse you of being an idoloter. What I said was that your distortion of T-Bone's question is an blatant attempt to exonerate Wierwille. If I have misunderstood your purpose in making the comparisons you that you made, maybe you could explain why it is you believe they illustrate a valid analogy.

T-Bone asked: "If one of the sins of the teacher is lying, then what part of the teaching is truth?" To which Oldies responded: "The implication being that if a teacher lies somewhere, a teacher can't teach the truth... The content of plagiarized material isn't true because it has been plagiarized. You shouldn't drive the Autobahn because Hitler was involved in building it. and so forth..." ---------------------------------------------------------------- That's a complete distortion of T-Bone's question. It's simply a blatant attempt to exonerate Wierwille. And yes, it is a strawman. It's diverting the question at hand away from center stage and replacing it with a stand-in.

I find it rather sad that what started as an effort to remember Sandra Ann Sullivan has deteriorated into a platform promoting the "Wierwille Admiration Society" (As do far too many other well intentioned threads.)

Sociopaths make perfect middle managers. They are the business version of a "survivor".They will praise you for anything you do that helps THEM. Sometimes they will praise you for things that don't appear to have an ulterior motive and the praise will feel oddly hollow.If they think you have become a liability or have discovered some dirty secret about them, they can drop you like a hot potato and never feel a drop of remorse. They may feign remorse because they know that you and society in general will expect it. But, in reality, they are "play acting". It's to your benefit to know if you are dealing with a sociopath ahead of time because the more you can know about the opposition the better off you'll be. BTW---I'm only telling you this because I care.

Hitler never declared himself a monster.

"If you gotta go You better live your life before you pass away Don't waste a day All your life's been spent locked in your room You never had a chance to roam Away from home." ------------------------------------------------------- (Not a real big hit but a memorable one.)

Oldies I couldn't care less whether or not you would feel remorse. (Especially in light of the fact that you've previously indicated you wouldn't.) What's being discussed here is Wierwille's lack of empathy, not yours. He displayed no sense of remorse for his involvement in the stated events. Debate the significance of that if you want to but don't deny the reality.

Is it Cinnamon Girl by Neil Young?

David Garibaldi is playing drums for Tower of Power. (Or at least he was 6 months ago)

shiftthis Take a chill pill,dude. Life is just too short to let yourself get that worked up. It ain't healthy That is, of course, if you really are as worked up as you appear to be. Personally, I don't really understand how you could possibly be associated with the same organization that is being discussed here and not understand what people need to heal from. Have you taken a little time to read some of the things I suggested on the home page? Were you around when the way taught "the one true household"? Do you recall what they said would happen if you ever ventured outside the "hedge of protection"? Take a few minutes and listen to the latest podcast, "Through The Fog". It's on the home page. This stuff is not fabricated. There are people here who did much more than simply "go to twig". There are people here who were branch leaders, limb leaders, trunk leaders, etc. Do you really think they are making this stuff up? Why would they want to do that? Did you know Wierwille was a chronic alcoholic who drank incessantly? Did you know he was a sexual predator who preyed on young Corps women? Did you know he used the ABS to buy a fleet of motorcycles and classic cars for his personal enjoyment? OK--I know, that's a lot of questions. Just one more though----- Do you still tithe/ABS and where does the money go?

Johnny and June

Maybe this is off topic but, have you ever noticed that people with these tendencies seem to have a "knack" for finding their way into middle management positions?

shiftthis There are some excellent threads here that discuss these very subjects at great length. Might I suggest you "study" them a bit before you formulate your final opinion?

Re: The order to fire http://www.kboo.fm/node/2983

Suzanne

Dot Quit beating yourself up trying to equate OT vows with modern day "promises". They're not the same thing.I took a salt covenant the first time I got married. It was basically one of those "any two believers-------"kind of arrangements.It didn't work out. It no longer matters to me why it didn't. I'm just glad we didn't stay together simply because we went through the motions of a ritual that holds a different meaning today than it did in the OT. Maybe she's even on GreaseSpot. I don't know. It doesn't matter. I have no animosity toward her. I hope she has none toward me. I'm glad now that we went our separate ways. It was the best thing for both of us. Hang in there, Dot. Don't try to solve too many puzzles at one time. It's too stressful. Just work on the day-to-day stuff for now. That's my two cents. Probably over priced at that. Love ya waysider

Hi there, fellow North Coaster! We have our ISP as part of our cable TV package. We run the cable into a N3tg3ar router that has 4 hard-wire ports as well as wireless.Right now, we run 1 PC(mine) and 2 laptops off of it. Our house isn't very big. I don't know if that enters into the picture or not. Can you tell I'm not too savvy about this stuff?

Phil Nice to hear from you. There is a prayer thread here, too. If you want to put a prayer request in there for your Dad, we would be honored to pray for him. Not saying you should or shouldn't. Just letting you know it's there if you want to. Thanks for the "heads up". waysider

Shiftthis It's all tongue in cheek. Yeah, I know, we have a warped sense of humor here. That's part of the attraction. Though I will tell you this, there are some who are 100% convinced PFAL is God Breathed. No amount of reason or logic can sway them from that conviction. Stick around awhile and maybe you'll cross paths. Hey! Have you had a chance to check out some of the games in The Reading Room? Stop by and help us play "name that tune" or "movie pictionary". Or, stop over in the "Doctrinal Room" if you want to get all "heavy". Enjoy!!

Part of the problem for many of us is that we were buying a product we knew little to nothing about. We were discouraged from comparison shopping and, in fact, were told there was no similar product with which to compare it. Yep, it's the first one to come down the production line in 2,000 years. Whether we knew it or not, there were a lot of "hard sell" tactics being used. "Ya know, if you don't take the class next week, there may not be another one for months!" "If you don't get in this "film class", you might have to settle for a "tape class". And on and on and on and on. Long story made short-----We bought something under false pretenses.