waysider

When people were thrown out of Fellow Laborers, in the middle of the night, hundreds or even thousands of miles from home, we were not allowed to question why or even discuss it amongst ourselves. We were supposed to act like they never existed. There's a sometimes poster here (I won't mention names) who could tell you first hand what a traumatic experience that is. No "presumed innocent", no trial, just toss them out like yesterday's fish heads. And then they used that to let us know that we could be next.

You make a good point, newlife. These people are actually DOING something for the less fortunate with what they consider to be their calling. Now contrast that to what many people in The Way did with their "ordinations". We thought we were living like the believers in the Book of Acts, when, in reality, we were living a contradiction.

Your post makes no sense. Do you mean there are non-TWI influenced people who also use the word "advance" when they really mean "retreat"?

The Way--Living in Love Page 78 Our Dad said, "you haven't even learned to work well on the farm. You'll never make a good preacher." But VP used to practice by preaching to the trees". Uncle Harry chuckles at his recollection. "He'd go out in the woods for hours. Dad thought he was just loafing, but I knew what was going on. He was preaching to the trees." (The preaching to the trees aspect, by the way, was "borrowed" from an experience that Billy Graham had previously spoken of.) *********************************************************** "I would paddle a canoe across the Hillsborough to a little island where I could address all creatures great and small, from alligators to birds.If they would not stop to listen, there was always a congregation of cypress stumps that could neither slither nor fly away. The loudness of my preaching was in direct proportion to their unresponsiveness, so the trees got my voice at full blast." From: Just As I Am----Billy Graham (This is Billy Graham remembering his early days in the ministry in approximately 1937.)

Oh, man! I saw this one done in concert in a very small venue. That's one concert I'll never forget!

YEP! :)

Just yesterday morning, they let me know you were gone.

Interesting.

We'll never know for sure. My opinion, though, is that is was a con man at his very core. He obviously didn't believe in the old "reach up in Daddy's cookie jar" thing. It's been shown here that he took information from Liberty Lobby propaganda and led us to believe he got it by revelation. Then, there's the subject of "excellor sessions" in the Intermediate class, and after. He tricked us into actually practicing a "spiritual" sleight of hand game with TIP and prophesy. Ironic, ya know? He used a shell game to keep us from seeing it was us that were hosting the game. I think that secretly, he scoffed at the notion of a spiritual realm and snickered at our innocence.

I don't think we knew we were being duped. Even after all these years, there are still people who can't face that reality. We all do things and say things that, in retrospect, can be seen as hurtful, even damaging. Wierwille made a deliberate and conscious effort to do and say things he knew would victimize his followers. The pattern is very clear in hindsight. His intentions were laced with selfishness, greed and malice. I believe this "element of intent" is one that partly characterizes the vast difference between what VPW did and what we did. Our intent was to help others by promoting these ideas, such as the "law" of believing, misguided as they were. His intention was to help himself. He had to have been cognizant of the damage he was causing. He saw people suffer and die and gave no indication he regretted his culpability. He displayed no apparent remorse when one of his victims took her own life. He made no apparent attempt to repent or change his behavior in spite of it. He just didn't care. If he was, indeed, a victim of abuse, he willingly and consciously succumbed to its effects rather than work to overcome it.

I have moved this here from the "The Way Corps" thread. QUOTE (Watered Garden @ Mar 12 2009, 10:25 AM) * I think most WC were as much victims as anything, of the hype and false promises and lies that lured them into what they thought would be service for God. WG Bolshevik responded: "---but then these victims bring in more victims. Who in turn bring in more victims. Extrapolate back and argue vpw was a victim persuaded by the logic of victims before him . . ." *************************************************** So the question for consideration is: Was VPW a victim? How?------ Why?--------Of Whom?

I'm going to start a new thread off this so this thread stays on track.

Amen, Sistah!

Looking at their web site, I see they have Family Camps, Devotion With Motion, Campfires, and Advances. Nope. No similarities there. :blink:

Me too, Twinky. My comments weren't aimed at you in any way, shape or form. Sorry.

Here's to hoping it's a great one.

Here Come Da Judge!

Hey, TZ Maybe you could hit some of the local jams and do some 145 stuff, ya know? The old 12 bar blues. That's usually good for meeting local musicians. If nothing else, they're usually a lot of fun.

Read the context, WD. It's talking about living, breathing people, not dead cult leaders.

Unless I'm mistaken, no one really seems to be talking about disposing of bodies, necrophilia or the harvesting of sperm. Wierwille croaked a long time ago. People are now free to expose him for the drunken, sexually deviant, con man that he was.

Anybody ever hear BB King play rhythm? A lot of people have speculated that he can't play chords. Here is a rare clip that dispels that myth.

Like Wierwille once said, "If a man wants to be stupid, let him be stupid."

Exactly. That's why some of them become masters of ambiguity. That requires deliberate effort, demonstrating their cognizance of the fraud.