waysider

Making stuff up: VPW was fond of doing that. Like the now famous blizzard story. Back then, it was easy to fool us with this stuff. Now, with the internet at our fingertips, you can actually look up all sorts of wacky facts like, you know..... weather reports.

Good point. How are we supposed to learn from the past if we never remember it?

The Way frequently employed this tactic to deny people the necessary opportunity to grieve, as well. To be fair, The Way is not the only organization that does this. However, we're not really talking about what other groups do or have done, we're talking specifically about The Way. Many years ago, I needed time and space to grieve the loss of a close friend. I was told I couldn't change what had happened and that I needed to move on immediately. After leaving the cemetery, having served as a pall bearer, I went straight to the next session of Dealing With The Adversary, at the urging of leadership. They told me I needed to put the past behind me and move forward right away. No time to cry over what can't be changed. "Word over the World must take precedence over all else", they told me. "Emotions are the devil's way of tricking me out of staying focused", they said. As you said, you can't change the factual realities of the past but you can change the way it is interpreted. I was manipulated into relinquishing a grieving process that I really needed. Shame on them for promoting this nonsense. And, shame on me for listening to them.

Amazing, isn't it? We bought into this nonsense while, at the same time, we followed a guy who was the poster child for devil possession. I'm curious how Way people explain the incongruity today.

"To "escape" a cult you need to play things close to your chest. I think secrecy plays a huge part to establishing new networks, support, and a new life. I don't blame people for not coming forward, or never coming forward (as was mentioned in the article). Hindsight 20/20, I would have been a lot more secretive with people outside TWI. (My mind was focused on pushing TWI away.) Even casually mentioning TWI to "outsiders" was a mistake." In retrospect, I can understand this and agree 100%. I've even heard of (non-cult related) people inventing whole, new, innocuous personal histories to mask embarrassing baggage. I don't blame them at all. It's nobody's business but their own.

I knew a guy who had one of THESE but he couldn't make the payments and it got re-possessed. (Not really, just kiddin'.)

I wonder. Have they ever done a side-by-side comparison of VP's behavior with the Advanced Class teachings on that subject? (pg.12-24, in particular) It would probably scare the beejeebers out of them if they truly believe what they profess to believe..

Much the same argument could be made regarding people who, by no fault of their own, have family ties to people who have committed heinous crimes against society. It's unfortunate and we can empathize with them but we can't change the reality of history to accommodate them. edit: I know that sounds cold but it is what it is.

"Many of us left so thus, our kids were not forced to join to twi." The person who started this thread was born into and raised in The Way. There was no option other than to become part of the environment, willingly or otherwise. Much of what you see in this thread is tempered with that reality.

Where are these examples I'm just not "getting"? My personal beliefs have no bearing on your lack of ability to produce specific examples.

Sometimes it's hard to hop on that cognitive dissonance bandwagon all by yourself. You need a caring soul to help you climb on board.

Exactly. This is the stage where cognitive dissonance really kicks into high gear.

The organization was multi-cultured. There was one culture that represented the average Joe B.Leever you were apt to cross paths with in the local fellowship. This was the mushroom culture. (Keep them in the dark and feed them "the stuff that mushroom's flourish on".) Then there was an intermediate culture that flourished in the various training programs. In this culture, it was revealed, in part, that Way life would not be all peaches and cream but it served to instill a sense of obligation and commitment. The true innermost workings of the organization were intentionally withheld from this group and replaced with a candy coated version that wasn't made known at the local level, either. Then, there was an inner, very select culture that was well aware of the organization's true nature and mechanisms. It was at this level that VP's behavior was consistantly normalized and ignored. This was the culture that was in the driver's seat, pushing on toward what would eventually result in a horrific crash and burn scenario. This is the culture that so many unfortunately refuse to acknowledge.

Don't forget the Communist takeover of 1976 that never took place because of....you guessed it.....our believing.

Allow me to rephrase my request. Please produce specific examples of how and where The Way Int. had a major impact on the course of world history. edit:Parking space anecdotes not withstanding.

You are the one who made the claim.(post #32).... The burden of proof is on you to show that it did.

I can only answer for the area I came from, which is Cleveland, in the early 1970's. It wasn't unusual to have 150-200 people show up to the Sunday night branch meeting so I would say we were a pretty good sized, representative branch. Not all of those people were regular twig attendees so you can downplay the numbers somewhat. Lots and lots of hippy types, including myself. Drug use was not at all prevalent though I'm sure it must have existed to some degree. I would have to say that drug use was not a contributing factor to the growth of the Cleveland area. If anything, I think some folks were burned out on the drug culture and saw The Way as an alternative.

For whatever reason, most people in that era (not just Way people) didn't equate tobacco with drugs, even though it is clearly a drug. Smoking was very, very common among the Way followers. Breaks during PFAL classes were typified a by mass exodus to the outdoors to grab a quick smoke. (followed by a cup of stretched coffee, served in a reused styrofoam cup)

Drugs were strictly forbidden in FellowLaborers. (mid 1970's) We couldn't even have any type of alcohol, including beer, in our "houses". On a more localized level, the buzz was that any type of drug could open some sort of trap door, allowing devil spirits to enter your mind. No one wanted to be associated with that, of course. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if someone comments on how The Way helped them wean themself from the drug culture. Does that answer your question?

". but it appears "the world" caused the cults (the kind we here have in common)." I can get with that thought. It was a very trying time in history. Young people were desperately looking for answers to life's puzzles and felt a real compulsion to be a part of something that could change things for the better. (*better* as we perceived it) I don't think it was too much different than what leads young people to associate themselves with radical extremist groups today.

No, we worked at the limb HQ until about 9:30, drove back to the complex, which was about 30 minutes away, and then had night fellowships from 10:00 to 10:30. The remaining time was used to wash dinner dishes, prep the next day's breakfast, have house meetings and so on. It was a struggle at times to get everything done by midnight.

The Way had virtually no impact on the overall course of the world. The only impact it exacted was on individual lives. And, that impact was, for the most part, disruptive and detrimental. To think that what we did somehow altered the course of world events, in even the tiniest way, is pure delusion. It's like dreaming of his non-existent impact on the history of football.

For (most) working people, it's self-induced. For people in the Way training programs, it was mandated and enforced.

The 5 hour sleep pattern isn't a new thing for me, Rocky. It's been that way ever since FellowLaborers. (I had previously been a real bear to wake with less than 8 hours.) And, I'm not necessarily blaming that on the program. Maybe it was a natural shift. I know, however, it's not simply a matter of the aging process as I've experienced this since leaving the program in my late 20's. The good news is that if I stay awake for about 2 hours I can easily get back to sleep for another 2 hour stretch. Those 2 hours are sweet! The point is,looking back, I can see how "running on empty" made it much easier to manipulate our thinking and behavior.