oldiesman

Tom, like everyone else, I have significant time invested in TWI, and I'd like to continue to express my viewpoint about it. That's the best answer I can give you at this time.

Rascal, I view "spitting out the bones" as a good thing; you view it as a bad thing. Our experiences with TWI were so very different that I don't know if we'll ever have agreement whether TWI was a godly organization or a devilish organization. To be fair, I think it was both at the same time.

I think this is where they blow it. They should just offer the class to interested believers who have completed the other class requirements, like it was in TWI-1.

Zix, I'm not sure how more circumspectly i could express myself on this thread, except to just be quiet.

The open exchange of ideas is what Greasespot is all about. Sometimes things are said that cut into my heart like a knife, as well. But that's all part of participating in a public forum. No viewpoints are immune from scrutiny and examination. If that changes, I'm sure Pawtucket will let us know.

Abigail said: In other words, I should just be quiet and not express my viewpoint? OF COURSE it's up to others decisions. ALL I AM DOING is expressing a point of view.

Again, I think being manipulated by TWI, if one views it as such, is one's own perspective of how they viewed it then, and how they view it now. I don't think I ever allowed myself to be manipulated, at least to any great extent, and there's lots of folks like me. Here's what John Lynn said, which I tend to agree with:

I think this is too general a statement for everyone. Personally, for me, it doesn't apply. Experiences vary.

At one time, you could have been missing twig for months, and still attend the Advanced Class. No more.

I'm so glad I was never a part of TWI-2.

Mal 3:7 Even from the days of your fathers ye are gone away from mine ordinances, and have not kept [them]. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the LORD of hosts. But ye said, Wherein shall we return? Mal 3:8 Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. Mal 3:9 Ye [are] cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, [even] this whole nation.

"Christians Believe The Preposterous" but, in fairness I'll say that when I was involved in TWI-1, folks had the option not to tithe and still be around and get blessed. That happened to me for years.

Insurgent, I thought they changed and now don't bother folks who buy cars and houses?

Christians Continue To Believe The Preposterous

Yes, when you have some leisure time, go to the Barnes & Noble Self Improvement section and explore the reams of books on Self Improvement. Lot's of goodies there. If you think you're mentally ill, consult a physician and have a medical examination.

Steve, I do actually characterize CSBP as junk science. For instance, the series of tithing "laws" that are supposed to work with mathematical and scientific precision, are as follows: The Law of Prosperity God's Basic Law of Prosperity The Law Of Proportionate Giving God's Immutable Law of Prosperity God's Law of Supply The Law of Systematic Giving God's Absolute Minimum Law of Financial Liberty, Prosperity and Abundance The Proportionate Giving Principle The Law of the Renewed Mind Financially The Law of Receiving Prosperity

Linda Z, I still think victim mentality can be overcome, if someone who engages in it desires to overcome it. That's a big point of her book and why she's overcome. That's my vote, anyway.

Christians Believe The Preposterous

And they call *me* heartless, geeze.

Sounds kinky.

Kit, I missed this offer. Do you still have the statue? My VPW shrine is waiting...

Ginger, I think you're statement is a good one. It sort of reminds me of something said by Naomi Judd in her new book, "Naomi's Breakthrough Guide -- 20 Choices to Transform Your Life." As you may know, Judd has had her share of problems. It says on the jacket of her book that she missed her high school graduation to deliver her first child, endured domestic abuse, lived on welfare, put herself thru nursing school and overcame a life-threatening illness. Wow, that's a lot of hassles. She asked: Sounds like she was once a participant in the "victim mentality" but overcame it. [This message was edited by oldiesman on January 12, 2004 at 16:23.]

Bob, I had no idea you were under that much hassle. Thank you again and again, for staying.

Oakspear, I agree with you on that point, especially in relation to "Christians Should Be Prosperous," which is an excellent example of fear motivation. "You Cannot Afford Not to Tithe" etc. etc. etc. However, it's still your free will decision to have that apply in your life. We could have walked away or not complied at any time, for example. I had questions about Tithing and ABS for years and because of not getting answers that satisfied me, I gave what I felt like, instead of tithing, for a long time. It was a joke, actually. But it was also at a time when TWI wasn't keeping track of what money you put in the basket and you could still give cash. TWI-2 was much worse in that aspect, I hope you agree. For example, people insisting paying by check to keep track, etc.

Although I agree with Paradiseden and Johniam, the above statement by Evan is a good one. I no longer rely on just one group or religion for truth, and the things I do have strong faith on (like salvation by grace, Christ in You, the hope of glody, SIT, etc.) I don't believe will go away even when exploring other views. We learned in TWI that we are children of God and I totally believe that... even if we explore other views it won't change our sonship; even those who now say they aren't christians or children of God having eternal life...I don't believe them, because of Jesus's life and sacrifice. I've changed my mind on a few things too, thanks to Greasepot (like the seed boy teaching, believing=receiving, etc.)