oldiesman

He is really THIS!!

Free PFAL segments on the Net.

Well that's it then, I just KNEW that s.o.b. wouldn't show up. :D-->

Goey, best I come up with right now is that "godly fear" means something far different than fear.I do admit that I understand and still believe VP's version of fearing God as meaning reverance and respect. Different from "fear", which I liken to a mouse running away from a cat. In contrast, godly fear is having awe and reverence for God, but not wanting to flee from him, like a mouse would fear a cat, or like a lamb would fear a lion. I see God as a God of love, and as such wants us to come boldly to him, not see him as a killer we are to run from.

I still don't know what we are supposed to be afraid of. God has sanctified us in Christ. Justified us in Christ. Made us righteous in Christ. We are accepted in the beloved. There is nothing to fear. We are already seated in the heavenlies.

Nice memorial Eagle.

Hi Jim Happy Birthday.You said you made a stand against him when he went back on his word? May I ask, why did you remain with the ministry after that? I don't see you EVER taking a stand against him when he was alive. At least a meaningful one. To the contrary, did you not later become the limb leader of Maine, and stay for many years? Additionally, according to The Cult That Snapped, you knew Wierwille had many women. But all these things may not have bothered you all that much back then.

If that's true then I must be one who falls on the side of believing God wants us to love and respect Him as any Father would rather than fear Him.

The following letter from John Lynn was probably read by most of us but I note it again here as this thread is about CES/STFI.

removed by request.

Good points Danny.

I must admit, I don't get that God wants his children to be afraid of him.

So long Maynard.

Baaaaaa...

I agree Cool. I think we ought to be able to know how to live and do the right thing, without "fearing" God in the process.

I do not mean to suggest that CES (or more appropriately, STFI) is guilty of the word for word liftings like VPW did.What I'm referring to are the teachings that are the same thoughts/ideas/beliefs as twi, but without giving twi any written acknowledgement. IF plagiarism is using the thoughts/beliefs/teachings of a group one learned from without giving the proper written acknowledgement, then it might be worth examining whether STFI is guilty of much the same thing twi did when it taught the teachings/beliefs/thoughts of those who VPW learned from, without giving proper written acknowledgement in his writings.

I think it's very funny and worth reading, even for us who believe twi was on the right track once upon a time.

Mr. Hammeroni, I think you are correct.Most of what they teach is TWI doctrine, with a few words changed here and there, but the same meanings. some examples: gathering together = rapture mystery = sacred secret Couple of items that stick out in my mind right now that are completely different from twi is the "personal prophecy" belief. also teachings on premarital sex and adultery. There could be others. But the fact that their teachings are so harmonious with twi leads me to suspect/ponder that they might themselves be guilty of plagiarism? They do teach a lot of twi stuff without mentioning twi. is that plagiarism? Don't know. Otherwise, I think they've taken the baby and thrown out the bathwater, in large part.

I've done enough arguing for one day. Have a nice weekend folks.

Rascal if you refer to my words, please quote them in context, as I wrote them.What you did would be like me surmising that you worship fetuses, but that wouldn't be fair and might be a misrepresentation of your position.

I never dismissed their pain. But, their pain is really irrelevant to the argument of whether they had a choice to make decisions or not, which is what this topic covers. Please read what I wrote in the context it was written.

Goey, why didn't you say all that in the first place? :D--> From what I understand of the gist you are saying that God set hurricanes in motion long ago for a good purpose and man shouldn't be living where it's "natural" for hurricanes to be. Is that correct? I can accept this viewpoint, although I still leave room for the possibility that hurricanes could be a byproduct of the calamity between Gen 1:1 and 1:2. Also fits with a point I made before about New Orleans being a calamity waiting to happen because their levees were inadequate. Garth and Goey, I didn't suggest or mean that God or Satan pulls the strings NOW on hurricanes. I think hurricanes could have been caused when things got out of whack between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2. Goey's explanation is just as good, I really have no problem with it. In any case, I believe that God doesn't want people destroyed, so people should make certain not to live in these centers of calamity where occurrances like this cause great damage, whether from God or Satan.