grand-daughter

AMEN!

Shell, OMG! I'm so thankful you have the sense to not believe that crap anymore. Honestly when I got out I use to fear being stricken dead because of starting to believe what I was seeing as the real truth. Makes me feel kind of sorry for those who are still under that wicked belief system. So yes, I pray for them as well but know this, you and Kelly are definately in my prayers and I trust God will help you through it all. Thank God for the stripes that our Lord Jesus Christ bore to free us from all sickness. I sure hope that 1 day those still in will really start believing in those same stripes and they will be healed from their blindness. Much Love

If I may add another aspect of this... in the splinter group I was in and I will only speak of this because I can from first hand experience, anyhow besides me I have heard that Victor Banard who was the MOG(blah blah blah) has slept with almost all of the women in the ministry. Yes he is his fathers son. But heres my point. As the saying goes you never truely forget your first love...meaning the one you give yourself to. Alot of these girls I have heard he slept with (possibly even my own daughter) were definately virgins, what better way for him to steal, and control their minds and hearts? It's first love and apple trees my foot its more like I'm your first love forget Jesus Christ I have all you need. Yuck!!!!!

Oh boy do I remember the vow thing so well, in the splinter group I was in I left 3 times. The first 2 times I left secretly and the fear of being caught was unbelievable but it was the guilt over broken vows that made me come back. When I left the 3rd time I had plans on going back but thank God for GS and the enlightenment that it brought to my head. I still every now and then think about well was I wrong? Did I break a vow before God? I just have to remember all the junk I went through to quickly get past it.

Omg! that is so good I loved it! I remember the fear I had whenever the kids dad called the first year we were out and I got a christmas tree, I sure didn't want him to know. But now who gives a rats azz.

I wasn't in TWI but I was in an off shoot. We celebrated Christmas the normal way with a tree, gifts, family and food for a while. We were in twig so we did tell the kids the truth about Santa however which of course I took great grief from my mother of course about stealing the magic of Christmas from my kids. Later as the cult we were in got more and more controlled, we no longer were allowed to celebrate any holiday right along with not talking much with our outside families or watching tv, you name it it all stopped. Being out now, I do celebrate Christmas and all the other holidays with the kids. They still know I'm Mrs Claus...well...Ms Clause now. And yes I do talk with family and watch tv...hehe

AMEN CHERANNE!

I'm so sorry for your loss. May God bless you and your family with peace and comfort through it all.

Oh Yay an easy thread.....hehe. Let me see. What is in the fridge? I am hungry anyway... ok well theres some velveeta singles, some ketchup and mustard, a half gone turkey I made the other day oh and let's not forget the empty pop box that nobody threw away. In the freezer hmmm a whole lot of venison that was just processed... I guess its Mcdonalds for dinner, lol

On October 28th 1992, I had another child. We named her Victoria after Victor Banard. (a name she hates now) (sorry Tori) It's crazy how even after he said what he said to me, that I would name a child after him. Even stranger yet is how close Victor and I would become. But being who he was to me I was nothing but loyal . I felt like God had sent him to me and hard times and all I was blessed. I am my beloved's and my beloved is mine. (yuck!) I'm not exactly sure how this all came about but the church was going through a time when we were learning about personal prophesy. We were also told about this group or class, whatever you want to call it, called Momentus that we were all encouraged to take. After all is said and done I will just call it nasty. Dave and I really had no choice in the matter. We were told that Victor would not marry us unless we took this class. I know, I know, I'm sure you are wondering why I would ever want to marry him anyhow. But the vows I had taken in my heart before God were stronger than my desire for earthly happiness. I don't know chalk it up to stupidity? Insanity? To me I just wanted, desperately needed to be right before God. So off to the devil's playground we went. Now I must back up here. If you know me at all then you would know that I am not one to bring attention to others faults without clearly stating my own. S I will not begin to do that now. It so happened that Daves mom died and he had to travel to Canada to take care of her estate. Although the year prior we had had the baby and things had calmed down a bit because of her, I was still far from happy. Our relationship was still far from peaceful. So I did something I never though I would do. I cheated... It was a one night stand. It was a few fleeting moments of excitement and attention I so deeply craved. However, no excuses, it was wrong. I was wrong, and I was determined to never let it happen again and certainly to never let Dave find out about it. I don't know if any of you have ever heard of or participated in Momentus, so I will tell you just a little of how I experienced it. As far as I recall it was only a short class, only four or five days, but it was all day and if you really put your heart into it pretty much all night as well due to homework we were given. It was centered around certain verses in Gods Word although twisted for their own purposes, just like anything that would or could suck a christian unawares. I know I could hardly think straight due to lack of sleep or food during the class. The music which seemed to never end was so loud and very disorientating. Every part of this class made you feel it was hard but it was exactly what you needed. The whole basis of this trap was in order to be free you needed to be completely honest. So here I was trying to hide the biggest secret of my life and all the while feeling like the biggest sinner in the world. I was so full of fear that it would come out. As expected, it did. In the middle of this circle of people I hardly knew, I was like a fish out of water gasping for breath and trying to lie to save my foot. It didn't work. Like so many other things that should have never been uttered, my secret came out. Now don't get me wrong, I do not condone lying but in that place and time it was just another thing that should have not been said. I honestly believe that there was no real reason to speak this horrible truth. But as it was everyone was speaking things you would have never expected. It was I assert this I assert that, filling in the blanks with whatever they thought or felt about just about everything. This is just an example of what I was told. "You were not my dream woman because you are not tall enough, your legs could be longer, you're not blonde oh and your boobs aren't big enough." Oh and also, "I often wonder what it would be like to sleep with Victor's wife." Hmm, makes you think about... A fool uttereth all his mind. But anyway, there I was ashamed, embarrassed and completely broken. Not knowing what to do, out the door I ran. I never wanted to return. Lo and behold, like in the past, my friend, my beloved, the MOG came after me. Outside he begged me to return. He stated he didn't want to continue without me. I was his little one, he loved me, all was forgiven and together we would get through it together. As I sit here writing this, I am in tears. I am so hurt going through all of these memories. To this day it hurts me and I miss the friendship I thought me and Victor once had. To wrap up the Momentus period I will briefly tell you how it all turned out. People forgot about love and graciousness along with mercy throughout the church. Everyone spoke their minds no matter who it hurt. The women rose up against their husbands and tenderness was a thing of the past. As the weeks wore on the strain around our home became worse. Dave was mad. We fought alot. He hit me and something was new, I hit him back. One night, I can honestly say I don't remember why but we began fighting again. I won't go into great detail but it started on the couch and I tried to get away by running to our upstairs beroom. It didn't end. We fought and fought. He was nuts, his face looked different and he even sounded different. I don't think I had ever been so scared in my life as I was that night when he tried pushing me out the bedroom window. I remember crying out to God. Please don't let me die this way. I thought about my children. Who would take care of them? I somehow got out of his grasp and made it to the top of the stairs yelling the whole way. The next thing I knew was he was shoving me down them. I don't know how I survived that night and surprisingly I wasn't even physically that hurt. Praise God! So to end this bluntly. It turned out I had gotten pregnant from that one moment of stupidness and to save my marriage I had an abortion and added one more thing that I would not speak of again unless I was forced to.

Have you ever had a timewhen there was so much going on that you could hardly breathe, but strangely enough all those things were exactly what kept you going? That is what the few years in this section were like for me. I have struggled with keeping all of this in some sort of order in my mind. (I have a sound mind, I have a sound mind) HAHA! Sorry, just a memory of something a room-mate and I would say to each other in passing while we struggled through our days. I will probably jump around more now and have to return to sections so please bare with me if this is hard reading. So ealier I shared how close I got to my twig leaders, M&SV. I began to open up to them a little about what was going on between Dave and I. I know it broke their hearts to find out what was going on in our home. So a midst the fellowships and elders meetings and raising children they tried to be a steady form of support. MV talked with Dave and SV was a consistant shoulder for me. Somewhere in all of this there was a time when we switched twigs which made me feel very alone in it all. Details and dates escape me so I won't touch on that now. So anyway, life went on. The fighting, the silence, the unbearable truth that everything I had hoped for was falling and crumbling around my feet. SV shared with me that she finally took the situation to Victor Banard, the MOG. I was hoping that things would finally begin to change. Maybe there was help after all. Nothing, nothing and still nothing. I lost hope and came to the conclusion that this is what my life would look like until I took my last breath. But then I got the call.... If there were ever any words I thought could hurt me as much as when they said my Nathan was dead, it was what he, Victor Banard, the MOG would say to me at that moment. "Well Dawn, you spread your legs to him, so now there is nothing you can do." I was in complete shock! Now it is true that we were not married as of yet but before God I felt I was and what he said that day only confirmed those thoughts. Life went on as usaul...sigh...twig face...sigh...

Shell, (((((for you and your girls)))) I'm so happy your journey is coming to a great place! You are an inspiration to me and I so look forward to meeting you face to face some day. I'm so happy for you and Jeff and hope all the best in your lives together. Jeff, you and I have traveled down alot of the same paths and am happy to see God is still on the throne in your life. Take care of those wonderful women like I know you will. And let me say again thank you for the help you have been to me in years past. Your Friend Dawn

Hi Long, I don't have any great words of wisdom with what you posted but do thank you for sharing. I have been through things in my life where I have attributed them to my stand on the word as well but not like you have shared here. I mean there is that verse about those who live godly = suffering persecution but I honestly believe we can't live our lives trying to associate every bad thing to that because we then may turn from God himself and or forget to see the good that He brings our way. I don't read like I use to. I have just chosen to love God my way and talk with him with no pressure to believe this or that. I adhere to the good and simple things like being kind and honest and let God teach me as I go along whatever He thinks I need to know and along with trusting He will do that I trust him to protect me if any harm should come my way for my beliefs. If He doesn't it is what it is and He'll sort it out in the end. :)

Oh Dear Shell, I cannot think of words except I thank God for you.

"I know what you're thinking" hmm are you sure that wasn't a point where he tried to step up from the place of Christ into the place of God? Things that make you go hmm?

Ha ha I love that, if I use that am I in danger of being caught back up into a self serving, self righteous, over-bearing group of idiots?

Oh my God Shell, I'm sitting here in tears thinking about how hard it all must have been for you. I remember when my Nathan dies so vividly as I read your story all I can say is I'm sorry you ever had to go through all of that. ((((HUGS)))))

Thank you all for your replies. I think it bugs me so much about these dreams because I use to be plagued with nightmares and then I was able to learn how to work with them while I slept so they didn't scare me so much. Alot of my dreams throughout life came true which is always a bit weird. So with the recent dreams that I have had over the last year especially it doesn't really surprise me to see what's really gone on in this particular group but it's still discomforting to dream about it all and then to find out that alot of it's true it's just bizarre, I have to honestly wonder if theres more to them then just me thinking on the situation. Well either way thanks again.

Aw my 3 year old son always comes up to me and says "Mom, you're the best!" thanks God he is a GS baby and not 1 who grew up in the ministry because some days it's what gets me through the day.

Ty for your replies at least now I know I'm not weird. It use to be a blessing to have these dreams when I first left because I had intentions of going back but since I have come to my senses so to speak yuck! With everything thats gone on lately with this group the only dream that would be welcome is to see everyone get out! Oh and Victor Banard in jail!

This may seem like a weird topic but it is something that honestly bugs me, so I'll bring it up. Does anyone ever dream about all that they had went through or do you see certain people in ypur dreams from your past? I would say at least 4 times a week since I have been out I dream about mostly Victor Banard but also other people in the ministry as well. It drives me nuts. I can go to bed not even thinking about this stuff but they still come. As of late however their faces have been distorted. I have a feeling that's because I am seeing them in a different manner now but still I know who they are. Some of my dreams are at least good in the sense that I tell them off or I have even in 1 spoke prophetically to them. But I just am tired of seeing their faces altogether at this point in my life.

Clay, I would never say you have to do anything my way. For 1 thing honestly I'm still sorting out what my way really is. But I do know that you came in here and started blasting people calling this place a splinter group which in some strange way may or may not be true. However, I know for me this place has helped me to vent a little, hear other peoples stories so I didn't feel alone in my own and also be able to read some very good points about doctrine that I have never either considered or at least not allowed to mention in the group that I was in. So by all means pease do things your way but p[lease remember respect for others while you do it. :)

Oh I will never forget that day. I was still in my little splinter group in Finlayson Mn. when it happened. Some of the ladies and I were processing tons of tomatoes and apples in one of the houses. We were all called outside for an important urgent meeting as the children were shuffled away. We were not allowed to watch tv or listen to the radio so none of us women had heard of course but when they told us I remember the horror that seemed to fill all of us. Oddly enough it led us to a very scarey time for us. Victor Banard who was the MOG came that evening for a meeting with us all under a sheepfold. He was somber and we all followed suit in our behavior. He informed us that he believed it could be the beginning of many sufferings that were to befall us. He said he thought it quite possible that there would be a police, FBI or at least a raid from the people in town. He gave us at that time the oppertunity to leave or to stand on the word and to stand with him even if it meant death. It was a crazy night filled with fear bt also a confirming within ourselves that we would stand no matter what. We were all encouraged to give what we had moneywise and the men went out and purchased all that we thought we would need including food, toiletries guns and ammo. Of course the raids never took place. I never did see the actual news coverages of any of it until I got out and until then I never did really ever feel sorrow for those people due to our own fear and determination to live ourselves all instilled by this MOG so to speak. So no I will never forget that day.

Sorry ClayJay, you may think my name is respectful but in all honesty its a slam against all that i have been through and those that put me through it.