Twinky

Thanks, I'm doing fine as I am without pondering "standing" and "state." You don't know what I study. You don't know what I have studied in the past. I can tell you what I don't study (have a guess, the initials PFAL might give you a clue). And you really don't know how my life has changed, post-TWI. (Nor, for that matter, do you know how badly it changed as a result of being "in.") Are you using the word "you" aimed at me specifically? Or would the word "one" express a more general point? Your post is quite hard to read. You might not think of it as jargon, but you express things in such a TWI-type of style, phraseology, that it comes across as Waybrained. Probably three or four Wayish expressions in every line. It can be helpful both for the speaker (or writer) and for the hearers (or readers), to find a different turn of phrase to express the same thing. Go on, challenge yourself!

Y'know, I have NEVER heard any other organization talk about "standing" and "state". Haven't thought of it for years. Rarely have I heard talk of one's "walk." I attend two very good churches regularly. I have heard much practical teaching and suggestions as to how to live life with Jesus as the focus. There is teaching of fellowship with Jesus, God and one another. There is teaching of relationship with Jesus, God and one another. There is teaching on repentance, forgiveness, and a good many other things. There is even, sometimes, confession of our shortcomings, in public prayer (in vague language along the lines of "we have done what we ought not to have done, and not done what we ought to have done." And then a public act of forgiveness. ("Jesus Christ cleanses you from all unrighteousness.") I spend time pondering right application of Biblical principle to situations. This time, such an action might be right. Next time, some other action might be right, and the first type of action quite wrong. To think one set of responses is always the right and only set of responses is to think too shallowly, too rigidly, too black and white. What, it seems to me, is always right is to consider whether one's actions are the most loving, most considerate, that can be achieved at that time. This talk of "standing and state" seems to me to smack of jargon and thus divisiveness. And thus, not loving.

Tell us all what you think, DWBH!!

The food was fine - there wasn't much of what you might call junk food. Many in my Corps lost weight. But they had plenty to lose. They looked a lot better for it, and were a lot fitter. I, on the other hand, put on weight - and I looked a lot better for it.

Yeah, but probably a bit ruder. Coarser.

And now back to our regularly scheduled program, "The Ceroc Teacher." Oh sorry, the Zero Teacher.

Heh, my Corps bros (also internationals) had a lot of fun on one occasion teaching Brit/Commonwealth slang to unsuspecting Americans. There are some words ...that you just don't use in polite society. Found out about it when someone came to me and said, "R and P say that this expression means..." and they watched my eyes grow wide and my jaw drop. "Hmm," said this person. "I didn't think it meant what they said it did."

Waysider, a "bog" is a very slangy none-too-posh term for a toilet. Lavatory. That thing you put turds down. ["Bog off" is a rather rude way of telling someone to go away. It's rather more offensive than telling someone to "bug off" or even to "bug(ger) off."]

Going south, probably.

It is a gorgeous location. I got myself exiled there and was more or less on my own for a week or so, before some other Corps were sent in to get ready for the family camps. A great big dorm, with just me in it. Used to get out of bed, go to breakfast, pausing on the steps down to gaze at the beautiful mountains in the distance. Seemed like Paradise. I did do one season of Family Camps, which was six (or was it eight?) one week camps, two weeks back to back and then a cleaning/turn-round week in between. It was hard work but I enjoyed it, being with the little kids and generally having fun. I do think that for the adults and older children, it was hard work. "Classes" all morning, communal lunch, a bit of free time in the afternoon, communal evening meal, and then more classes. Not much of a holiday, or time to fellowship with friends. For some perverse reason, I was assigned to flag-raising duty. Me?? A Brit? To perform this sacred American duty? (We don't care much for flags in the UK. Don't fly 'em much, don't particularly pay any attention. Show our patriotism in different ways.) Can only think that giving me flag-raising duty was to force me out of bed in the morning. I've never been a "morning person," so therefore anything involving getting up early (like snow clearance) was a task deliberately shoved my way. Others might have been genuinely pleased or felt honored to have done the flag-raising. Why give the job to someone who couldn't care less? It still puzzles me. It seemed (to me) to make a mockery of the task. Surely ... TWI wasn't mocking the USA?? Ho hum.

I figure that's about all the people on this campus that they can raise. And they don't look overly thrilled at the privilege of being there.

Very sorry for derailing your thread, Sky. You can tell T-Bone and me to "bog off" if you like. (Does that trans-a-late into American?)

"Turd of wisdom"? Turd of knowledge?

Didn't you mean feces-ious?

Naw... let's just blame the thief. The zero teacher.

So... if we can "blame" the "Zero" corps, can we also "blame" BG Leonard?

Hey, they could make a decent website, for one. And keep it up to date. For two, they could include a Contact Us email address. Not an invitation to write to them. It's just for show anyway. They don't need more followers, more money, more anything (except abusees). Just need to sit pretty with what they've got. There's enough in the bank to see them through till the leaders all drop dead. And then, there's always land they can sell off.

What does Mrs Wolf think? Was she a Wayfer? I'm sure Wayfers would have a very different take on it from non-cult viewers.

Based on the book by Margaret Atwood. Anybody been watching this? Set in the "not-too-distant future" (though the book was written in 1985) and portraying a fundamentalist "Christian" takeover of the USA. Everybody's afraid, everybody's spied upon. Well acted and rather frightening.

Presumably you've sent a copy to HQ? Let us know if there's any response. Not holding my breath, though.

I'm glad to know that. Something I can accept, then, as not a VPW invention. The arrogance of that PoS wanting reputable preachers to evangelize and then send their converts to him (gag!) to corrupt and ruin. I don't think many church-attending people are aware of the Red Thread; it doesn't seem familiar to them when I've "tested the waters" previously.

Good post, T-Bone. I'd add that even if we had quite well-developed critical thinking skills, these were also constantly undermined by the allegation that we weren't spiritual enough to understand... and we weren't meek enough to receive spiritual information... and (esp in rez WC) that we were in training and shouldn't expect to know everything but learn to wait on the Lord... blah blah. I saw information/plans deliberately withheld from those involved, simply to teach them to trust leadership. Yeah, a great confidence booster. Save your questions till the end, folks.

I really loved this bit from John R's letter (though it appears he didn't get to send it before he got M&A'd: Nice idea ... but ... venture out of the secure fortress of the household at HQ??

How ridiculous, Mrs A has a wealth of knowledge. And that's appropriate to share. It's part of the Body of Christ working together, every part contributing what it can. Mrs A, having raised all your kids, could contribute a lot in the realm of childcare, and what was an appropriate cause for concern and what was "normal" for a kid growing and developing. There were so few people with kids at that time, most were singles. I'm sure that later, F was able to advise and guide some of the others who later had kids, and that's nothing specially "spiritual." In fact, that's a significant reason why TWI failed. Didn't meet people's needs, kept them in enforced infancy and dependence, didn't allow natural growth in personality and development in changed circumstances, etc etc. God gave us common sense for a reason and TWI was out to destroy that as "senses knowledge" and replace it by its own "mystery religion." So thankful we're all out. ((Hugs)) to ((Mrs A)).

Splendid: same concerns ("these are specific things that are wrong"), same response ("come and see, things are different"), followed immediately by shunning. John knew that if he accepted the invite to go to HQ, he'd get a real face-melting. And yes, pretty much that letter could have been written now.