Twinky

Can't recall anyone of that name. Where did he live? I knew mostly the Birmingham believers.

I think the new technology with mRNA is, as you say, going to open the door to new solutions. Despite some saying it's new and untested, it isn't actually that "new" in that research has been carried out for at least 20 years on just this type of vaccine, and in fact I understand that a SARS vaccine was developed using this technology in around 2003. SARS is a coronavirus, similar to but just a little different from the current version that is so devastating. My vaccines were both AstraZeneca. There have been a few incidents of death caused by blood clotting; not many. Of course that is a sad loss to the families of the deceased, and I don't belittle that. However, those people may well have died anyway, whether covid related or not. And the fact is that millions of people have been vaccinated with AZ and they've had no problems at all. I can certainly speak for the UK, where there has been a mix of AZ (traditional method) and Pfizer (new mRNA method) and both have been extremely effective at preventing serious illness and especially death. Of those hospitalised, somewhat over 80% are unvaccinated; of the less than 20% vaccinated, they are rarely in the most serious condition or die. I will be getting a booster jab next week and that will be Pfizer. In the summer this year, I served as a volunteer vaccination steward in a mass vax centre, and in a couple of months we did 55,000 vaxes, all age groups. Many came in singing and dancing (I jest not; these were older people who got dressed up for this, their first outing in a year!); they were delighted at getting vaxed as a release from the lockdown that we enduring during the previous 12-15 months. We also had many walk-ups (often of younger people not yet eligible) just in case there was a little vaccine still available at the end of the session. I don't know what you have in mind to discuss, Bolshevik, but I really don't understand the vaccine-averse lot, who seem to listen to fantasy theories and not to people who actually know the science, or have seen outcomes in hospitals. I only know one person who refuses to get an anti-covid vaccine of any type, and he's into some weird ideas about other things as well. mRNA vaccines are also being developed to deal with various cancers. One might wonder if the vaccine-hesitant for covid might be equally as hesitant if they had an aggressive cancer and a new mRNA vax was likely to be the most successful way to treat that.

Yes, I encountered this document earlier today; it was linked to something more recent. But what kind of perversion is this? Lyle Jeffs’ estranged wife Charlene Jeffs describes a group of followers called “seed bearers.” “A seed bearer is an elect man of a worthy bloodline chosen by the Priesthood to impregnate the FLDS woman,” according to Charlene Jeffs’ petition. Under a new doctrine, “FLDS men are no longer permitted to have children with their multiple wives. That privilege belongs to the seed bearer alone,” the petition said. “It is the husband’s responsibility to hold the hands of their wives while the seed bearer ‘spreads his seed.’ In layman terms, the husband is required to sit in the room while the chosen seed bearer, or a couple of them, rape his wife or wives,” according to the document. It sounds like something out of "The Handmaid's Tale," with a bit of a twist. What kind of man lets, watches and abets his wife being raped by another man? And not only that, but: Warren Jeffs has withheld any relationships between husbands and wives, Brower said. Any touching between spouses outside rituals like these, even a simple handshake, can now be considered adultery in the church. Unbelievable. Unless one has also been in a cult.

Pretty extreme FLDS cultic abuse. I don't think things were quite this bad in TWI. What is it with some men? How can they (a) convince themselves that this is okay; and (b) convince others that this is okay. Court document: FLDS sect limits sex to 'seed bearers' | CNN

That's a sad story of your first marriage, Oakspear. I fear it may not be the only marriage of its type, though. Glad you've found a new love and life with Mrs O2.

I put some money in. As it started life as ££ it may be some wacky amount in US$.

If not eligible for YARock, how about a "winter wonderland" holiday? No hypocrisy here, celebrating holidays, "decking the halls" and such like. (Cough, cough!) Or does TWI celebrate Christmas now? Enjoy entertainment with the family (could be better than staying home, eating too much, watching too much TV and playing too much Monopoly) (and having a family fight). Anyhow. For any of you who might have been interested, sorry, you've missed the closing date. Note, the "lodging of your choice" costs extra.

"Delicious food." Dragging out that ole chicken frying machine again?

And yet, his granddaughter is/was a Wayfer. Corps, no less. Hahahaha.

VPW being buried at or under a fountain in/by/near a pond made me think of those (worse) cult leaders who got dumped in the ocean. See, VPW even plagiarised a dead cult leader buried at sea - had to have his own little sea to be buried in.

22Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know... 35God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ... 37Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 38Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. 40And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. 41Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. Now that's "revival." Bold preaching of the message, of Jesus Christ, so convincingly that 3000 people were converted there and then. Do you know what? That sort of thing still happens. In Africa, specifically I know in Burundi (Simon, a missionary from our church goes there a lot and tells great stories of the people there). Simon is passionate, enthusiastic, boundless in energy and vision, an evangelist of some high order. Not only does he do this in Africa - he travels the cities in the UK preaching the gospel in the streets. Okay, we aren't all evangelists. But we do our best. Does R&R even know what a real evangelist is?? Have they any passion for the lord Jesus Christ? Has any of them encountered him, away from the printed page? Does TWI know what a real evangelist is?? Have they any passion for the lord Jesus Christ? Has any of them encountered him, away from the printed page? >> Now you know I'm joking, right? !! << I did know one real "TWI" evangelist, likely some of you here know him too - and they crushed him into nothing, destroyed his family - wife was a petite blonde, "just the type" for certain people. How about TWI "reaching out" to repair some of its horrendous damage to various individuals and families? Starting with paying, no strings attached, for genuine, qualified counsellors and therapists to help heal some of the wounds?

You are bloody joking, aren't you?! How do they propose to get people to come back? Are they sending out invitation letters? Will such letters begin with a humble and heartfelt apology for past treatment of the addressee (and his/her family)? No? Tough, then. Bye.

Absolutely your decision, T-Bone. And absolutely made under duress. If you chose to do something different, likely you'd have been castigated nastily, your supposed sins used as an example, and woe betide you if anything went awry - you'd've been accused of dabbling with DSs, and lucky not to be M&A'd. I don't know if you will be familiar with the expression "coercive control." Used in the UK to define the mental abuse that one partner in a relationship exerts over another. Often, the pattern of behaviour (physical or mind-games, or other) that a male partner will use to belittle and disenfranchise his female partner. You might find this interesting: Coercive control - Womens Aid. Do any of the examples at the beginning of the article sound familiar? I regret many, not all, of my actions on my WoW year. I would really like to apologise for my actions to some of my WoW family. Those actions weren't the real "me" - they were a conditioned and bullied "me." I doubt my WoW family would really understand, but you would, T-Bone, and others who had been in rez. Thank God I am no longer that person - that pretend person.

Hope it goes well for you, Mark. You've put a lot of work in.

Was that your choice, or was it the choice of your coordinator? I know when I was in rez, a couple of people were allowed to go to family funerals - if they took another way believer with them (gotta withstand those DS, and move two by two), and didn't stay overnight unless absolutely unavoidable. Last chance to show respects, etc (even if "under guard" from the other believer). On the other hand, others weren't allowed to go to weddings, not even close family members. Because there would be the opportunity to see them later, after WC training was finished. (As if they'd be missing anything worthwhile from WC training (snark)!).

Lots of us were like that, T-Bone. Nothing like a high-demand cult to make you drop all your "normal" commitments - like to wife and family, other relatives, and to your community at large.

Oh, how many things in TWI were "make work." Constant vacuuming the carpets, washing floors, polishing things. Yes, some things/places do need constant cleaning (kitchens!), but not everything. Yes, we all like things kept nicely - but twice a day, to keep in rez corps busy?? How, one wonders, are they coping without all that cleaning and polishing because the in rez Corps isn't large enough to do such things? Out on the field - constant meetings, witnessing sessions, classes... doing "bless jobs" for leaders. This is a really small example. It took place many years ago, but still bugs me: I recall watching a small team type up some notes of a meeting (this is outside, not at HQ). They were using Word, which as no doubt most of you know has short-cuts and ways you can program in a few keystrokes which will reproduce as a commonly-used phrase (like "pfl" might always reproduce as "Power for Abundant Living" or "bsl" for "be strong in the Lord"). They were all proficient typists/Word users, so they should know this. Ideal, for TWI jargon-speak. And yet, every one of them was typing out these phrases in full, no shortcuts. I observed this and asked why they didn't do shortcuts. "Because Rev xx says to do it this way." Rev xx probably hadn't a clue about shortcuts - his only concern would be whether the notes were accurate. But that's only 3 keystokes, as opposed to 25/21 - reproduced many times. Very minor, I know, but if repeated many times/session, it just wasted the time of those women.

You might find this of interest, Allan. Do watch the short video. Vaccine Ingredients – Fetal Cells | Children's Hospital of Philadelphia (chop.edu)

Husband: "I'll just chop your dick off then, so's you won't rape my wife, or any other women, again." (Very loving, and showing willingness to defend all women)

Good post, T-Bone, though somewhat off topic. Would be interesting to discuss in Open.

I watched their promo video (well: listened to it, while I did more worthwhile things). It runs from Aug 2022 to June 2023 and they are sending these "Ambassadors" to areas where there is already an established branch into which they can be "integrated." So there's a couple of changes. Now: why to where there is an established branch? Is it because (1) after all these years, they realise that sending a bunch of strangers (to each other) to a strange new city (to all of them) isn't actually very helpful; or (2) they can be prodded and spied upon on a daily basis by local leadership. I'd like to think that it meant that failure was less likely (from the participants' PoV) and that real guidance was on hand locally. In actuality, I suspect it will mean that participants will be "overseen" and brought under the thumbs of meanie leaders. Good luck to 'em all. Unlikely anyone at the Cafe will be signing up.

I know, I know, T-Bone. Forcing financial support wouldn't work against every putative father. In cases where the male can't pay (broke, in prison, etc), perhaps make the State pay? At punitive rates? Since the State imposed the bloody silly law, it should take responsibility for that which it causes to happen. Texas is a rich state. Plenty of dosh. Rape is a bit off-topic in this discussion, but personally, I've been all in favour of making the punishment fit the crime. Chop the man's "tickle tackle" off. Then he can't rape with that any more (of course, he could use implements like bottles). So. Let's chop his hands off as well. Tattooing his forehead announces him to the world. And specifically to women. Yeah. Fierce penalties. I'm a woman. I'm entitled to feel fierce about my own safety and my own body. (I'm not serious about that load of penalties. But I'm damn sure that if men had to face the reality of the violence perpetrated against women by suffering it themselves, they'd treat rape and all forms of violence against women rather differently.) In any event, there are many, many, more reasons than rape, as to why women seek abortions. And few women will treat it as lightly as cutting their fingernails. Even if that is how TWI treated it.

The Texas law wouldn't be quite so awful if it imposed and enforced on the father of the child an equal responsibility for caring for the child and supporting it, especially financially - for all of its life - as most parents do, for their kids of any age. And if the mother didn't really want the child, the father were to be forced to bring that child up himself. With financial contribution from the mother, of course. But I digress. No such options were available within TWI. Everything they did was to avoid financial responsibility.

I do not know if there is a single right answer in this debate. I do know there are many wrong answers, and a blanket "No abortion under any circumstances" is one of those. As also is, "You must abort!" It seems doubtful that any cogent argument can be made for TWI's stance, except that unplanned pregnancies, especially by women not the spouses of the head honchos, would be very embarrassing (cough) for them, would blow the lid off their lewdness and bullying - and worse! (horror!) could involve some of those head honchos in providing financial maintenance for the children for many years.

I am sorry to hear that, Galen. It's almost surprising that the pregnancy continued and didn't naturally abort. Such a child is a huge burden on not just parents, but all the extended family and friends of the family. Not to mention on wider medical resources, which might be otherwise used for children who could truly benefit. You didn't say if there were other children; I assume not. I am sure this one is dearly loved by at least his mother. And you too, by the sound of it. Suppose such a child was born and there were two or three other children. Those children find themselves without any life, because all the effort goes into looking after the ultra-needy one. I know of one family where the disabled child (some sort of ultra-spine-bending illness and tightness of all muscles) had to be fostered out on a 1:1 basis, so that the other children could live a normal life. It was the most loving thing to do in all the circumstances. The foster-mother was very caring and the family visited regularly. The child lived until about the age of 7. I don't know if the illness could have been foreseen.