Suda

Fabulous thread, Oakspear, and great comments from all. You expressed my concerns about the bitterness I sometimes encounter on these threads much better than I was able to express my thoughts and feelings. Thanks.

I believe that at the gathering together we will all be spiritual beings as it is the spirit that returns to God. In his resurrected body, Jesus Christ was recognized at times, others he was not. So it's not definite that we will always recognize who is among us in heaven. But since we'll no longer have mortal thoughts, I guess we won't be bothered by our emotions like we are today, no matter who we do or do not see there.

Have my airline tickets. Will arrive at Kansas City International (MCI) Friday, July 14 at 4:20 p.m. Leave Sunday, July 16 at 5:13 p.m. :( 2life, we're anxious to hear from you. Hope you can join us. Suda

Our son has been in private Christian schools 2nd through (now) 9th grade, and we have been extremely pleased with all of them. He had to be in private school in elementary school due to learning disabilities, was not a choice for us. He is completely mainstreamed now and doing beautifully, and I think that is largely due to the small class size. Wish we could have afforded to send our daughters to private Christian schools, also, just because of the social environment. Attended kindergarten and 1st grade in private Christian school, but then switched to public when we moved to a better school district. But that may not have helped anyway as "birds of a feather flock together" so our wild child probably would have gravitated to the wild children in the Christian schools, and they do have their fair share, as she socializes with many even though they are different schools. Our eldest did wonderfully in public school, was in honors classes (as is my wild child) and was able to get lots of academic merit scholarships for college. The PTF's in Christian schools are awesome. They become like extended family in many ways. Have met lots of great people through PTA also, but the closeness is not there. Have never experienced any problems with parents not wanting their children to socialize with my son. Really never encountered much discussion of religious beliefs - all surface, no in depth. Hope it works out for you if your daughter enjoyed her visit today. Keep us posted, please.

41, and quite true.

Hope your day is very happy! Suda

Just finished segment one of GS Radio #3 - so interesting! Listening to it is a perfect way for all GSCafers to celebrate this anniversary. Looking forward to the next segment!

allan w Regarding Not bored, just interested in learning. As a newcomer, there's still many gems here I have not yet had the opportunity to mine. Have taken a look at some of your other posts. Have learned some things from you when you were not stalking Temple Lady to lamblast her LDS beliefs. BTW, I enjoy her posts and learning about LDS. Guess to me, learning will always be an exciting lifetime adventure.

What does STFI stand for? Wonderful, enlightening thread. Thanks to all of you (except allan w.) for your contributions. And allan w., if you don't have anything to contribute, why do you post? Just to see your name in type? (Bitterness in threads bothers me. Can't we be civil to one another? Love thy neighbor as thyself? Do unto others as you would have them do unto you? Maybe you would benefit from a book by Miss Manners, probably available at your local bookstore.)

April 21 - A reason to Celebrate Six years ago today, the GreaseSpot Cafe opened it's doors, and the famous THE thread was posted. Many thanks to Pawtucket (and Raf) for all the good times. Time to celebrate! Feel free to post your favorite GSC memories/moments/happenings here in celebration. Mine was finding the Chat Room. Nice to place to unwind at the end of the day. Come join us anytime! (And, can you believe it? I actually started my very first thread and posted my first picture. Old girls can learn new tricks!)

Moving footage - just horrific. Yeah, remember being told about the myths of the Holocaust, even bought the book to read to dispute it, but never got around to reading it. Could never understand the point behind saying it was a myth. Remember something about none of the "original" Jews still left or something (is that what the 13th tribe was about?) Maybe he was ashamed of his German heritage?

1. What time do you get up? School days, 6:15 a.m. Others, not before 10:00 a.m. if I can help it, and later if I can. My family’s motto “Sometimes I wake up grouchy. But usually I let her sleep.” 2. If you could eat lunch with one person, who would it be? I would love to eat lunch with my father again (he died in 1995, so that’s impossible). If I had to choose one person now living that I’ve never had the privilege of meeting, I guess I’d go for dining in the White House with George or Laura Bush. 3. Gold or silver? Silver, actually white gold. 4. What is the last film you saw at the cinema? The Passion (I’m a Blockbuster girl) 5. What is/are your favorite TV show(s)? Law and Order - all of them. 6. What did you have for breakfast? Nothing today. My favorites are Eggs Benedict or Corned Beef Skillet breakfast. 7. Who would you hate to be stuck in a room with? Any evil person. 8. What is your middle name? Given, Ellen. Now that I’m married, Saunders. 9. Beach, City or Country? Beach! Would love to retire in a beach community. 10. Favorite ice cream? Chocolate. 11. Butter, plain or salted popcorn? Butter, with salt, please. 12. ? 13. What kind of car do you drive? Chrysler LDS, or LTS, LTD, or something like that. 14. Favorite sandwich? Ham with pimento cheese, mayo only. 15. Favorite flower? Calla Lilly or Poinsetta 16. If you could go anywhere in the world on vacation, where would you go? Cruise of the Greek Isles. 17. What color is your bathroom? Blue, green, pink, white 18. Favorite kind of clothing? Brands? I go for comfort. Favorite store is Chico’s. Prefer casual to dressy. Prefer slacks to dresses. 19. Where would you retire to? Oops, answered this above. A small beach town, like Southport or Beaufort, NC. But as hubby not a beach lover, probably won’t happen. 20. Favorite day of the week? Why? Sunday. Day for resting with family and going to fellowship. 21. What did you do for your last birthday? Ate at Ruth’s Chris Steakhouse with my family, and had a weekend away at a bed and breakfast with my husband. Both delightful. 22. Where were you born? Welch, West-by-God Virginia. 23. Favorite sport to watch? Basketball. 24. Who do you least expect to respond? Publisher’s Clearing House Prize Patrol. 25. Person you expect to respond first? One of my children. 26. What fabric detergent do you use? Why? Tide, liquid. Always works for me. 27. Coke or Pepsi? Coke! 28. Are you a morning person or a night owl? Definitely a night owl. 29. What is your shoe size? 9 or 9½ quad (super slim) 30. Do you have any pets? Two precious Scotties, Laddie a white/beige brindle, and Jock, a black/silver/auburn brindle. 31. Are you happy with your job? It’s fine, I enjoy it and the people I work with. Would prefer to be an at-home mother. 32. What is one thing you want to do in life that you have not done yet? Travel around the world. 33. If you had the chance to get married again- would you? n/a. But if my dear husband passed on before me, probably not. 34. if you won the lotto what would you do? Give to Living Tree Academy, help my kids, fully fund my retirement and retire, support lots of charities, help those in need, and travel. 35. If you had three wishes - what would they be? 1. Financial freedom and comfort, ability to give more. 2. Perfect health. 3. My children realizing the dreams of their hearts. 36. What are your hobbies? Reading, studying and teaching the Bible. Would love to be able to garden. And would like to take up cross stitch again. 37. What are some things you always hope you get for christmas? “Love Letters” from my children, pictures and letters from family and friends.

Correct - your turn. Probably is on another thread, where we were to post favorite lines from movies. Forgot I had put it there. Ooops!

A great one, but not the one I'm thinking of. Only heard it in twi. Snappy tune. Seems like the only words in the chorus were, "He got up" da da da da da dah "He got up" . . . . several times. Remember a sole female voice singing it.

Yes, Freud, please!

"I am not steak. You can't just order me."

Do we get to vote on who will be the next subject (#4)? Guess not, the list would be way too long. You're doing a great job. Know we'll all enjoy #3, and all the future ones. Keep up the good work!

Responses here seem to reflect Mars and Venus, the differences between men and women. Anyone else notice that, or is it just me? May be something I need to consider a bit more deeply. Both sides are extremely helpful. I appreciate the input. Tom Strange, I am sorry I have created a situation that has made you uncomfortable. I apologize to you and anyone else I have made to feel ill at ease. It was not my intent, and I will try to avoid doing so in the future.

Thanks for the input. My heart focuses on I am confident we will find the peace we desire to completely restore our happy household.So sorry for choosing the wrong place for advice and counsel. I apologize for those I have offended. I was truly looking for help, not an avenue to air dirty laundry, as I thought our differences were already known from other posts. You all know my husband and what a wonderful man he is, and I was not trying to demean him in any way. Again, so sorry for my error.

Kingdom of Heaven?

Ressurection Sunday always reminds me of the wonderful song with the chorus, "He got up". Anyone know the name of that song or where I could get a copy of it? Happy Easter to all of you.

Belle, Your approach to go back to ground zero, so to speak, seems like an honest and logical choice one could make. And the more hubby and I have discussed his change in beliefs, that's basically what I think he has done, also. It makes it much easier to accept his viewpoints once it is explained (versus defensive arguing or refusing to talk about it at all). But me floundering in the dark trying to understand was upsetting, to say the least. But to his credit, I can see where when initially he found his beliefs to be polar opposites from me, and knowing how strongly I feel about my beliefs, it would make sense to just keep quiet on the subject until he had more clarity to what he believed. What would be the benefit in upsetting me when he wasn't even sure what he did and did not believe? Why subject me to his confusion? And maybe the reason he is still reluctant to engage in conversations is because, like you, he is still trying to figure out where he stands. Bramble and shazdancer, In response to I don't think they invented it or cornered the market on it. I have seen this type of manipulation/control behavior in all facets of life, many of which had nothing to do with twi or any kind of religious group. Many examples in corporate life, while teaching at a university, in PTA meeting at children's schools, just to name a few. But from the posts I've read here, twi certainly worked on perfecting it. Of course such manipulative control only works in the short term, and is morally wrong. That's why it should have no place in family. That has been driven home to me clearly in dealing with my teenagers. As a parent, you realize you reach a point when you cannot and should not try to exert too much control over your children. You have to allow them the freedom to make their own choices, even if you know they are not in their best interests, or not in agreement with your preferences. You just have to hope and pray that the influence of your past instruction and current advice, when solicited, will help keep them out of too much hot water. But they can't grow and develop if you do not allow them the freedom to do so. Learning should be a life time endeavor, and spouses will grow, mature, and change in the course of their relationship. Guess that's another area where good communication would be a real benefit. If you talk about it as you go along, no one would get knocked upside the head when a major shift takes place, as you've been kept abreast of the change as it evolves. Never think it's honest in a marriage relationship to hide what you really think, always better to get it out in the open and talk through it. You may not always agree on the subject, but at least you have a understanding of the what/when/where/how/who your spouse is coming from. johniam, Good words for me to ponder. Will have to mull over them more before I can respond.

MarkOMalley, Had to look up the word apostate before I could answer your post. And the aswer is unequivocally, no. I could not become an apostate. My love for God has been central to my life for as long as I can remember. It is the most defining component of my life. After my parents had died, and we siblings were cleaning out the house, we found folders that our mother had kept of major projects/assignments in elementary school. In the 2nd grade we had to "write" a fill in the blank autobiography with statements like "My name is ____________." To the one, "When I want to grow up I want to be a _____________." my response was "good Christian." (I assume the answer the teacher was looking for was teacher, nurse, or some other vocation). When I read it some 40 odd years later (I did not even remember the assignment) it brought tears of joy to my eyes, realizing that my spiritual walk hand in hand with God had been the desire of my heart since childhood. And to this day, this is still what I want to be as I continue to grow older and wiser. Living a Christian lifestyle is my vocation.

Pirate1974, Thanks for the background on Easter Monday. Very interesting. And to all of you, Happy Easter or Resurrection Sunday or whatever you wish to call it.

Greeting to all you Campers and Groupies of all Categories, First of all, my apologies for trying to pigeonhole the wonderful people here at GSC into any kind of groupings. Suffice it say that our one common thread is twi, and our experiences and reactions are too diverse to be narrowed down into a few groups. Any attempt to do so can easily elicit negative feedback, because generalizations can never capture the myriad of viewpoints posted here. I very much enjoy reading the differing perspectives and have learned a great deal from the variety on the menu here. The diversity at the GreaseSpot Café is to be celebrated, not homogenized. Shazdancer, I so agree with your statement, And a home with the peaceful co-existence of two ex-twi’ers would be the result from the above if each could be content with the other’s choice, and refrain from the “ verbal digs and arguments” in an attempt to force the other to accept their point of view. And when change is not effected, then escalate into bitterness and hostility, in hopes the other can be cowed into acceptance. What seems to be missing is Both parties here have been guilty of lacking respect and empathy, and are working on having them be the norm in our home again. ChasUFarley’s thread on Becoming Agnostic was wonderful for me. Her opening questions were great. The major hurt and confusion in my life resulting from my years with twi did not rear it’s ugly head until about 15 years after we left. We both we in agreement that it was time to leave after the POP mess and the mark and avoid teachings came out. But we remained a Christian couple, and raising our children in a Christian household was of upmost importance to both of us. We visited local churches, and found one that we were comfortable attending. We were both very involved. Hubby taught Sunday School, became a deacon, was chairman of several committees. I taught adult and pre-school Sunday School, Children's Church, Vacation Bible School, worked with children's choir. I finally left after about 7 years when I was told I was no longer welcome, but hubby stayed on (and still teaches Sunday School there now). The kids and I visited other churches, but never found one for the family. The girls found ones they liked where a lot of their friends attended. Son attended with his cousins on occasion. And I found a home fellowship that was run by ex-corps that had moved back into the area. So we all had our church homes we liked, although not together, which would have been our preference. Then, as I start taking my son to fellowship with me, the bombshell hits, hubby announces he is an atheist and heated arguments fly over whether or not my son will be allowed to attend with me. I felt like I was in the middle of a Twilight Zone episode. How does my husband go from being a Christian to an atheist? And why does an atheist still attend church and teach Sunday School? There had been signs along the way, remarks about lots in the Bible being myths rather than truth, no more prayer as a family or a couple, but I had accepted his explanation that he was confused about some things and was sorting things out. I know people go through times of questioning their faith and can accept that, I just wasn’t ready for the I am an atheist stance. Believing as I do, that marriage is an institution ordained by God, not a piece of paper you pick up from the local justice of the peace, I was floored, really upset. To my mind, it was like the end of our marriage when he threw God out of the equation. It has taken several years, but I have finally been able to accept the wide chasm in our beliefs. (He tells me now he considers himself to be a Christian because he believes in the basic tenets of the religion - of being a good, moral, decent, ethical person - which he is and has always been. Of course, many religions teach these same basic principles, so he couldn’t he just as well consider himself to be Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, etc.?). Nor was I ready for the don’t take my son around that cult who teaches nothing but bullsh** stance and his venomous attacks on my beliefs. After all, didn’t he often consult twi materials (among other reference materials) in preparing his Sunday School lessons? I had never been one to accept what vpw and/or twi taught hook, line, and sinker. If it did not make sense to me, if my research did not bear it out, I didn’t buy it. And I never had any qualms about taking my questions to my local leadership and discussing them. While in twi, I was always blessed with great local leadership who did not frown on questions nor demand blind acceptance of teachings from hq. If that hadn’t been the case, I would have been out of there in a heartbeat. So the long and the short of it is, we are still working through our differences, and both are committed to finding a zone of peaceful co-existence. We’re not there yet, but I think we will eventually arrive. Due to the bitter attacks I have received from him, as well as from others (some anti-twi, some twi-friendly, and some with no knowledge of twi) I guess I’m sensitive when I feel a post here carries that same venomous tone. And I have seen VERY FEW here, less than a handful. I have no problem with heated discussions and venting - in fact, I think they are beneficial. But attacks are something else. I know when I attacked my husband in the atheist aftermath, it was due to my confusion, hurt, and anger. I had to work through the turmoil of those emotions before I could get out of the attack mode and be able to have logical, calm disagreements and/or discussions. That is why when I think I detect that kind of bitterness here, it concerns me for that person. Working through the turmoil is painful and at times it seems it would be easier to just put a lid on it, and stay put in that place, versus pushing on. But if you stay stuck, things just fester and boil and come rushing out in a negative way. Though it’s hard, I think it’s much better to “face midnight” and keep pushing yourself until your heart is empty of the garbage, so true healing can take place. Over the past several years I have dealt with lots of personal garbage only to find that when one can is empty, another is waiting to be dealt with. But I’m glad I still have the stamina to keep with it, and hope that one day soon it will all be out at the curb ready for final pick up and disposal. I do not mean to come across as airing dirty laundry in public. I think a major purpose of the GSC is a forum for people to come and discuss their questions and concerns, and use the feed back from others to help them through the healing process. Our differences in beliefs is common knowledge here, and I’m sure that the marital discord my husband and I are working through due to the divergent paths our journeys of faith took us after leaving twi are not unique. I obviously love him dearly or I would not strive so diligently to repair the damage in our relationship (and vice versa). In fact, the reason I am here at all is because of his constant urging over the last several years to visit and learn in hopes that we could come to a more common ground concerning our mind-set on twi. Temple Lady, as I am still a relative newcomer to GSC, you would be in a better position than I to know I have seen bitter posts from twi-friendly as well as anti-twi. I haven’t had enough exposure yet to be able to keep tabs. (By the way, I’ve really enjoyed learning more about the LDS from your thread. Our dental hygienist is LDS and I’ve learned a lot from her, and we have been comparing notes on Big Love - am glad it’s not slamming your church.)Belle, so true, the sweetness of my twi days was always at the grassroots level. Ex10, yes, I think 99% of the posters here are venting, just as I am doing now. Guess I’ve blown the 1% that come off as bitter out of proportion. But it’s what stirred a response from me because of my internal churning as I continue to work through the garbage in my own life. Thanks for letting me share my thoughts. I look forward to any feedback. I know it will be helpful to me.