GrouchoMarxJr

Wierwille prided himself on his "administrations" teachings...but when it came to practice, he was old testament all the way. He passed off his mog status with the cliche "You walk on my feet until you can walk on your own"...Of course, the rank and file of twi never DID get to the point of "walking on their own feet"...In reality, Wierwille taught that God speaks to each of us but his waytree hierarchy negated the opprotunity to to experience that. All revelation had to be cleared through the waytree! Wierwille HAD to know that his waytree structure was diametrically opposed to his teachings... How can a person "operate all 9 all the time" if every decision has to be cleared and approved by someone else? Of course, the ultimate insult was for Vic to equate himself with Moses...His own ego and his own insecurities gave him an unsatiable hunger to be the MOG! In other words, he never really believed his own teachings. The amazing thing is that it took so long for many of us to recognize this.

..."calloused indifference"... That is an accurate description on MANY of twi's top "leaders"...not all, but MANY. I watched dozens of young people, who had committed their lives to this thing, receive heavy verbal abuse and public humiliation...dished out by twi "leaders"...without a second thought and without regard. Many of these young people were devastated by this treatment...most of them were. While in residence, I realized that I could never be that hard on people...thus, I realized that I would never fit in with the twi "leadership mode"...sadly, at the time, I thought it was a deficiency on MY part. As I look back today, I am grateful that twi was never able to turn me into a mean bastard. It just wasn't in me. So....when I think back to people like LCM, TJ, CG, and a LOT of other people like that...I think that a lot of these people were "disturbed" to start with...Wierwille just exploited that meanness that was already in them...gave them a reason to legitimitize their abuse towards others...they "dug it". How many of them are sorry now for how they treated people? How many have repented and asked for forgiveness and have changed their ways??? To tell you the truth...I really don't care. We are all ultimately responsible for the things that we do in this life. Since I left twi 18 years ago, I avoid people that are manipulative, controlling, mean, and condescending. Life's too short to spend around people like that.

I believe that was the fore runner to "Christian Family and sex"... Yeah...Veepee had an interesting perspective of Christian sex. He believed that all the women in the kingdom belonged to the king (He, of course, was the king)...Sex outside of marriage was fine as long as you "could handle it"...and abortion on demand was the order of the day. Wierwille's dysfuntional sexuality set the pace for many twi leaders who followed in his footsteps...Sexual abuse by twi leaders has caused serious damage to many many people.

As Vic's body broke down, Martindale looked at him like a wounded animal that needed to be thinned from the herd. Soon after his death, the purging of Vics influence could begin...and king okie could take his rightful place as the holiest athlete to ever sit upon the throne of his own self image... ...In the meantime Wierwille was dying from cancer. A little damage control, a little spin, a little lockbox intrigue and suddenly...the myth of how Wierwille died began. No demons from the black pit got OUR fadder in da werd! He simply turned his face to the wall and saw snow on the gas pumps...oops, that's a different myth.

TJ was the kind of man who would enjoy stepping on your fingers and then scold you for having them in his way... ...Like many twi "leaders" of that time, he was quite taken with himself and expected you to be also. I was surprised when they sent him to Gunnison...he always seemed more comfortable in an office or classroom, not the outdoors type. Fortunately for me, I didn't spend much time around him.

July of 1975 for me also... Ahhh, the memories of being inducted into a mind control cult...makes me feel warm and fuzzy all over.

Sudo...All I can tell you is that it makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside...similar to the feeling a person gets after an injection of novacaine. :P

...Martindale felt a need to demonstrate his "spiritual perception and insight" to his followers, even as his predecessor (the cornfield wizard) did... ...Maybe king okie should submit his writings and theories to the National Enquirer. Move over batboy, make room for the lesbian snake.

That's a good start oldies... ...

I think most of us can relate to what you are saying...just the other day I rode past a slaughter house and when I caught a whiff, I immediately thought about Emporia... ...seriously though...there are certain "trigger words" that dredge up certain twi concepts in my mind...and yes, a conscious decison is required to get past it.

Reading the various accounts of WHY the corps chalet was built and HOW it was built is a good example of twi's utter failure to live up to the standards they promoted and their pretentious ideas of "divine guidance" in their decision making processes. Wierwille used to sit upon his mogly throne, telling anyone who would listen, how the standards of the world were not good enough for "Gawd's ministry"...he would explain that when twi built something, it was the VERY BEST because Gawd's hand was upon their lives and HE provided the details on how to do it the BEST way... ...Yeah, right. <_< Either Gawd needs to "go to school" and learn the proper way to build a log home...or maybe, just maybe...Wierwille was a lying bag of wind.

I think Sudo is jealous because he only has 2, 917...

I finally hit the 3000 mark on my number of posts! Now I know how Carl Yastremski felt when he got his 3000th hit!

Jet...No...I don't know it for a fact, nor can I prove it. Can they sue me for what I said in my post? ...sure they could sue me...IF it's a false accusation.

One sick puppy is right. Martindale's complete obsession with his perverse sexual desires, colored everything he thought about. When you add to the mix, the idea that lcm knew about his wife's lesbian affair with Rosie...it all fits like a hand in a condom...oops, did I say condom?...another Freudian slip.

OK...I just ran the GreaseSpot Cafe through the cult test...I gave it 1.5 points. A lot of folks here share their experiences to show that recovery from twi is attainable ...and we have invented some new words to explain certain concepts: such as: "waybrain" "the forehead" "king okie" "the cornfield cult" "Rozilla" "twits" "The bus driving pimp" The list is endless B) ...as far as charismatic leadership goes...Raf almost got a half point...almost, but not quite.

Lifted up..."pc for greasespot"?...If by that, you mean that there is a general consensus at GS, that twi was a manipulative, self serving, cult that hurt a lot of people...I agree...but I certainly felt no need to get Raf's points "up there some"...or anyone else's. Perhaps we should apply the same cult test to the Grease Spot and see how many point's IT gets?

I gave em 33 points also... If a person was in the corps, the points will probably be higher than a person who wasn't... ...But, just because a person didn't involve themselves to the full extent, doesn't negate the fact that the "cult" itself was at the "high point extreme"...it simply means that they didn't experience it themselves...but many others did.

Whitedove...I agree that twi's "intent" was to have corps grads spend the rest of their lives working for twi...taking assignments year after year after year...there's no debate about THAT... ...What I am saying is that the official waycorps committment, on paper, presented to me, said that taking assignments after the 4 year training was complete...was OPTIONAL. I realize that I am speaking in terms of a technicality...but that's my point. They soft soaped people to lure them in...I recall numerous people who told me (BEFORE they went into the corps), that they hadn't decided as to whether they would take assignments or not when the 4 years was up...but after they graduated from the corps training, they felt OBLIGATED to take assignments...something had changed....bait and switch...it was quick and it was subtle... ...and I might add...That's where the concept of "corps status" came from! This term was invented in order to keep people taking assignments! If you were simply a "graduate" of the waycorps training, they couldn't take anything away from you...it was over, you completed it! ...Buuuuuuuuuut, once they came up with "corps status", it was no longer a 4 year educational program...it was now a "special club" that you had to maintain membership in! We all remember how certain folks (including ourselves) were labeled. "He's corps"..."He used to be corps"...If you refused an assignment, you fell into the latter description. They would drop you from their "special club". Twi never intended to train people to go out into the world to be Christian ministers...Their intent was to control people and further their own narcisstic agenda.

Wasn't Chris Lingle the seller of potato chips? No, no...that was Pringle not Lingle :blink:

Burnt out his life for us?... ...It's more like...He lived fat off of our hard earned money and died from that nasty devil spirit "cancer"...

Hold the phone right there!... ...Oldies, how the hell do you conclude that Cowgirl had received revelation from God? I totally reject your assumption and can only assume that it is your "waybrain" slipping out through your teeth again. The world is full of crazy people who believe that "Gawd speaks to them"...This concept is the basis for untold miseries heaped upon mankind. You live in a delusional world that is both dangerous and stupid. If a person hollered "Be gone in the name of Hank", loud enough, they would probably get the same results...ask Sudo about Hank.

diazbro makes an excellant point... ...The natural tendency for young people is to find their "own thing"...which oftentimes includes rejecting their "parent's thing"...In twi this is magnified for reasons already stated. An old dog that's been conditioned to stay in his cage, will do so even if you open the door for him...open the door for a young pup and he'll take off running, snapping at the wind with his teeth... B)

I wish I still had the waycorps brochure that defined the 4 year committment followed by OPTIONAL assignments, but unfortunately, they were thrown into the bon fire on Uncle Harry day... ;) Am I the only one here who remembers the "OPTIONAL ASSIGNMENTS" part of the corps program? You gotta be kiddin' me. Yes, the implication was that you take assignments from twi after your corps training was complete...and most did. But those assignments were OPTIONAL according to what I signed on for. If you declined taking assignments your committment to twi was called into question...but I am CERTAIN that the assignments after training were presented ON PAPER as optional. ...and the slap happy "book" that Elaina Whiteside threw together, where we first heard of the snow on the gas pumps, was NOT the official criteria for the corps training committment. "A lifetime of service"...If I were to say that going to law school for 4 years, to become an attorney, prepared a person for a "lifetime of service" in the law profession...would that mean that you were obligated to take assignments from that law school telling you where and how to practice law? When I made the 4 year committment for the corps training, I NEVER felt obligated to take assignments from twi after the training was complete...to me a "lifetime of Christian service" meant that I was now equiped with the education and training to serve however I chose and with whom I chose...I never committed myself to taking assignments for the rest of my life or I NEVER would have went into the corps. Doesn't anyone here have an old corps training brochure that they can post?...I am certain that the OPTIONAL assignments was in there...

...And let's not forget that twi was training people in the corps to eventually become a FREE WORKFORCE. There was a lot of pressure put on corps grads to recruit others into the corps...even as there was pressure put on twiers to recruit people to take the class and to go WOW. The requirments? Usually, if you had completed the advanced class, had gone out WOW and could read without moving your lips, you were considerd "corps material". Why were so many sent home? When a person was booted from the corps, they left but their money stayed...kapeesh?