GrouchoMarxJr

I think there are a lot of people who can be proud of the effort they put forth...and their intentions and what they believed to be true...it was a noble effort for those who did not become corrupted. They should feel proud for what they sincerely tried to do. ...but proud to be waycorps?...no

This whole concept comes from the insecurities of an egomaniac...Wierwille needed to be placed upon a pedestal...this was the doctrine that put him there... ...it went hand in hand with the "absent Christ" doctrine. With Christ "absent", Veepee was more than glad to take his place as the head of the body... ...Ludicrous, devilish, unbiblical, and foolish... I think that Galen's explanation came right from a twi handbook...totally wrong in my opinion. believing believer?....twi doubletalk.

Actually ck...Chris Geer DID pimp for Veepee...many, many times....the number of eye witnesses, victims, and first hand accounts...are well established. Credibility lends itself to the vastness of these testimonies...otherwise, how could you ever believe anything outside of your own first hand experiences... ...I did have personal, firsthand experiences...I saw this guy leading young girls off to Wierwille's motorcoach...you can believe what you like, but Geer was a bus driving pimp...I was there.

The fact is...some folks have turned Vic Wierwille into a diety of sorts... ...pfal (to me), is riddled with so many errors that it is looks like swiss cheese...A lot of the teachings of pfal are not just erroneous...but they are very DESTRUCTIVE to the individual... It's better, IMHO, to throw out the baby, the bathwater, and the damn basinet...right out the freaking window... ...Lower your denominational flags, set aside your quest to be RIGHT, and experience life.

What I see in pfal fans and also the offshoots...is this undying quest and determination to be RIGHT!... ...Pouring into the holy writ, they wrestle with the exact definition and useage of every word in every sentence...they conclude, they formulate, they write down their "belief statements"...they raise their flag and they stand their ground...The "Us versus Them" concept very much alive in their thinking... ...It never seems to occur to them, that having read this book...it's time to put it down and start actually living it themselves...too preoccupied with studying the lives of other people of yesteryear, they begin to mentally calcify into "intellectual Christians"...determined to be RIGHT! How?...by making claim to having the exclusive "proper" rendition of the holy writ...Why? Perhaps it has to do with something "spiritual"?

...and Allan, if ya can't be that night in shining armour, at least try not to be the turd in the punch bowl... <_<

Hmmmm...I have been told by 3 different ex clergy (that attended), that Geer did pull out his gun and laid it on the podium...but again, that's second hand information...I wasn't there. ...In either case, it doesn't seem like it was an "ordinary" type of fellowship...There are people who claim that their lives were threatened because they walked out of that meeting... ...These were intense times...a lot of folks went off the deep end. I suppose the biggest question that remains is WHY did the board of trustees allow this wacko to stand up and spew his venom? Who was he? Before you start mentioning his "credentials", keep in mind that this same bot sh it canned some pretty impressive leaders...showed them the door without a second thought...but Geer? They bow down to this clown...still a mystery to me.

I believe that Shroyer's group is big in Ohio...probably has fellowships in Akron...

The book "Jesus Christ our passover" was written by an 8th corps guy...it was the paper that he turned in for his thesis (with some filler added by other research papers)...Wierwille never consulted with the guy, he just published it and put his own name on it...word for word. The guy posts here at Greasespot.... ...maybe he'd like to comment?

WordWolf...That's a good run down of the facts. Any objective person that is familiar with the facts can clearly see that Wierwille was a liar. His motives were just as obvious... There will be some who cling to the myth, who will close their eyes to anything that shows that their mog was anything less than what they want him to be...they have put him on a pedestal and they bow before him... ...it's pathetic and sad. The man was a grifter.

...Yeah, I remember looking at Geer's eyes...the expression on his face...no doubt about it, the guy was nuts.

..."To walk in the way of abundance and power"? Hmmm..."power for abundant living" means that the "power" is a means to get to the "abundant living", which is the end result...walking in the way of "abundance and power" however, means that both the abundance and the power are both an end in themselves. The fact is that you receive neither abundance nor power when you associate with twi...You are actually giving THEM your abundance and giving THEM power to control you! The roots of a tree are hidden underground and receive their nourishment in secret...

Gosh George...Don't you see the value of sitting through the "class" again? ...I mean, if you tell a lie often enough, people will be more likely to believe it! The constant repetition of Wierwillian doctrine...over and over and over and over...until the glassy eyed individual has spittle running down their chin..."shanta Lo Kalamista" they cry out at the end, giving absolute proof that they have bought into this universe of fantasy... Move to Belize and start selling pfal materials on the internet!...Begora! why didn't I think of that? Is 8th corps Gilmore shopping for his own personal jet yet?

I recall sitting through pfal for the first time in July of 1975 (there was no snow on the ground), as I was listening to the class, thinking to myself... "hmmmm, interesting...", suddenly, the guy teaching the class claims that God spoke to him audibly!...something about "I'll teach you the word like it hasn't been known since the 1st century if you blah blah blah"... ...My eyes got as big as saucers and I slowly looked around the room to see the reaction of the other people there. The grads of the class had a "knowing smile" on their faces...and I thought to myself..."holy sh it! God spoke to this guy!!!" This was the "hook"...This was the moment that my brain became infected. This was the moment that I became a wayfer... Wierwille's claims of God speaking to him were the foundation for his entire cult...Without this claim, he was just another preacher flapping his gums. He needed this outlandish claim to provide credibility to what he was trying to do...and it worked! It worked like a charm as we can see that there are STILL people who refuse NOT to believe it! I don't think that Wierwille ever imagined that there would be folks who actually checked his stories out...so he just made it up as he went. Snow on the gas pumps? Sure why not...A snow blizzard in Tulsa?...Hell, he could have claimed to have seen Jeezuz riding next to Santa in the sleigh and there would have been folks to believe it. Wierwille believed in the idea that there is a sucker born every minute. He built a successful organization out of that idea...Once a person believed that God spoke to him, the rest fell into place...It opened the doors for his "absent Christ" doctrine (which made him the head of the body)...it allowed him to generate enough revenue to make himself filthy rich and in control of thousands of people who worshipped the ground he walked upon... ...but of course, when it came to selecting his successor, he chose style over substance and thus we ended up with king okie...and we should be thankful for that...because with king okie in charge, the "spell" that held so many captive was broken and the house of cards came tumbling down. This is usually what happens with personality cults. Did God talk to VP?....How you answer that question to yourself will determine the extent of waybrain you still harbor within your life...as for me... Don't sh it me, I have a turd in every pocket.

Although I was regular corps (10th), I did a stint at Rome city for about 4 months... ...and yes, I also had the priviledge of going into that small basement slaughter house and relieving hundreds of chickens of their breath life... My job on the assembly line of death, was to take the featherless (or nearly featherless) carcass, split open it's abdominal cavity and remove any eggs that were either partially formed or fully formed. :blink: . The fully formed eggs were set aside for later consumption by the glassy eyed minions... The stench of this underground pit of death was beyond description as the smell of blood, guts and entrails permeated the very pours of your skin. The poor individual whose job was to sever their heads in the funnel started out squeemishly but by the end of the day was sadistically laughing as he would decapitate them with such remarks as "sure love ya bro" and then slash their poor heads off with a swing of the blade that would make Zorro proud... and upon completion of our death task...we entered into the dining room for a scrumptious meal of fried chicken...almost lost my cookies.

Jonny Lingo...You're the man...I know how you are feeling as I lost my older brother on the 4th of July a few years back...I know how you feel......................... It's very informative to hear from those of you who were actually there...I suppose one of the reasons I started this thread is because of the new poster "RumRunner"...he's an old old friend of mine who was clergy and also attended that meeting. He was in the upper echelon of twi and knows a lot of "stuff"... ...How about it RumRunner...anything else to add?

The way corps training was an excercize in how to increase your ego and manipulate people... ...If you find that of value...then be proud.

Did Gawd speak to Veepee?... ...lemme see now...God chooses an adulterous, drunken, lying, egomaniac who was fired from his church for illicit sexual affairs... If you believe that Gawd spoke to Veepee Wiewille, I've got some swamp land in Louisianna that I would like to sell you.

RumRunner... Isn't it funny how certain people were designated as having a "gift ministry" as long as they could generate revenue...as soon as they stood up and spoke their minds, they were "children of the devil"... ...One day we ordain this guy, the next we pronounce him born of the "seed"...they counted on their glassy eyed followers believing whatever they said. Unfortunately for them they underestimated most of us. So...Chris Geer was insane? Yeah, I agree with that ...had to be! It still amazes me to this day how totally ruthless and uncaring the top leadership of twi was (and still is). Ministers of God? What does the bible say about shepherds who screw their own sheep? Bend over, the cornfield preacher is on the prowl.

I believe that this infamous meeting was a pivotal point in the great exodous that occurred in the late eighties... ...I recall a lot of clergy guys who left for that meeting with fire in their eyes and returned with poop on their lips...are there any Greasespotters who were actually there? This meeting changed the course of twi in many ways. I know this subject has been discussed before...but who was actually there?

OK RumRunner...I'm back in the saddle again...does spending time in Louisianna make you a coonass?

Good point Rascal... Some folks ask me why, after leaving twi nearly 20 years ago, I still post on the GreaseSpot... ...The answer is easy...because twi is unrepentant and STILL doing many of the same things. As Bob Dylan once said: "...and I'll stand on their grave till I'm sure that they're dead" and I'm convinced that if Paul Allen hadn't started Waydale and brought the law suit...lcm would still be doing the same things... oldies...quoting erroneous twi doctrine doesn't hold much sway with me.

I feel fortunate that I left in 1987 before the legalism got out of hand... ...I always had a hard time with "confrontation"...some folks reveled in it, but it just wasn't my personality...don't get me wrong, I was an a**hole in my own right but the hardassed screaming and yelling at people was not my cup of tea... ...of course, my lack of "aggressiveness" was one of the reasons that I never fit in with my corps brethren...and one of the reasons that they "wrote me off" as being too nice a guy and not fitting in with the twi youth for Hitler movement...I was never considered for anything more than an area coordinator...there were just too many people who were mean spirited that were given the top jobs. I'm proud of the fact that every person that I talked into the class and the "work of the ministry"...is now OUT!

OH....THAT horn of plenty!...I thought this thread was gonna be about the sex scandals!!!

T-Bone...if you slip into the back room you will find a complete liquor cabinet here at the cafe. I would suggest something strong to wash down the taste of what these degenerates were doing... It was rampant and it was disgusting...a lot of wonderful folks were hurt very badly. The vast majority of the rank and file were innocent and sincere but most of the "elite" leaders were in on it....those who were not and spoke up were shown the door. My knowledge of what went on goes beyond these various posts...I have talked personally to many folks with first hand experiences. It's mind boggling to say the least...