GrouchoMarxJr

Allright Mr. Lingo, we will not have any division, multiplication or any other such heretical statements at this fellowship... You are now in danger of being put on double secret spirtual probation...which is only a hop, skip and a jump from having your nametag ripped from your shirt...It would seem that the camel you are riding will not fit through the eye of the needle... ...or to put it another way...Hank is getting ready to spit on your shoes...

...I always thought that it was ironic that members of twi (oops, there were no members), er, I mean followers of twi were referred to as "believers". Many times these folks were destitute and depressed. I knew far more "believers" who failed to "manifest the more than abundant life" than "believers" who did... So why call them "believers"...what were they believing?...I think many of them were believing that I would let them into my home twice a week and let them cry on my shoulder...and then they would drink my coffee and eat my oreos. ...Of course my own believing was that these believers would leave my house at a certain time and I could then pop open a beer and turn on the TV... Perhaps the word "believe" was diminished and dumbed down by turning it into a noun in the first place. Is the word "believer" even in the bible? Today everthing goes right, tomorrow I hit the wall like Mr MaGoo playing rugby...One day I believe and the next day I don't...what I call the revolving door syndrome...but of course, it clarified things...when things went badly, we knew that we should assign blame to ourselves...that way, we not only had the opprotunity to deal with the negative problem but we also got to feel guilty about it. Maybe it was the idea that if you give a dog a name, he will live up to it...or maybe people simply felt that by paying the $100 to take the class, they were entitled to be called believers.

An additional announcement... ...All adulterous activities and sexual perversions must be confined to those of the same gender unless your name happens to be Rosie or Donna. Did someone mention crabs?...

Ok everybody, open your song books to "What a friend we have in Victor"...but first, who would like to open up with a word of memorized cliches and ritualistic phrases? Tonight's teaching is entitled "Bend over and give us your money"... ...but first we need to have mana-infestations...Larry, would speak with your tongue and then lie to us?...ok, how about a word of propensity?...someone?...C'mon oldyman, spit it out...edify us and encourage us to a more worthy cadaver. and tonight's announcements: 1-There will be a room search at midnight to see who's been signing checks to a mortage company 2-This Friday evening we will be going to the mall to recruit more people into the more abounding life 3-There will be a sign up sheet to see who can use the restroom 4-Anyone caught with a pet will be marked and deleted 5-and finally...We will be passing around the loyalty oath letter that you must sign in order to enter the back of the motorcoach... ...and don't forget, this weeks blue form must include your whereabouts for the last 10 days, and if you did not attend the monthly seminar, "how to stop thinking and start believing what we say", you must immediately give us 15% of all that is in your billfold or Hank will not spit on your shoes. Thank you all for coming...Hank bless you all, you are truly the best of who's in this room tonight. Will someone please close with a word of memorized drivel and then we will sing "yes it is Victor"

day jobs?...what's a day job? Actually, my hours vary from week to week (I work 50 hours a week)...this week, Wed and Thurs are my 2 days off... but it's good to see you back in the saddle again Ducky...

Good point Raf... ...As far as it goes, I try to keep my life simple and my faith simple...something about "the simplicity that's in Christ" God is the one who makes things happen, not my believing. I feel an obligation to place my faith in Him and am convinced that what He promised He is also able to perform...why do some people get healed and others don't?...I don't know. I do believe that He lives within us and that He inspires us and works within us...and that this life is temporal...which mean that we all will eventually die...The promise of eternal life is God's solution for his children...it's all up to Him. I don't believe for red drapes or for money or for miracles...I work hard and try to get the things that I need...and I thank God for "making things happen" in my life...The heavens are His throne and the earth is His footstool...I thank Him for all that I have and all that I am...because afterall is said and done...I'm just a sinner saved by grace. I don't believe in magic formulas or so called "laws" that we can operate like a mathimatical equation...that's not how life works...All nine all the time?...How about I get out of bed in the morning and put my pants on?...

Vick will probably be back to play in the NFL eventually...and when he does, I hope he plays against the Browns, I think the nickname for their defense is called the "dog pound"... If I were a middle linebacker, I would call him "dog killer" as I drove his head into the turf...

newlife...I also have been out for 20 years and during that time, I checked out a lot of different churches and "Christian" organizations... My conclusion that I am happy and content with?... ...I have decided that my "affiliation" is with God and His son...I am learning not to think in terms of churches or organizations but in terms of relationships. Relationships with God, His son, other people...I have learned how to recognize the spirit of God within people that I meet in my daily life and have decided that church isn't something that I attend but it's something that I am...it's something that I am a member in particular of...I don't hand out pamphlets, recruit people for classes, invite them to church or fellowships...I get involved in people's lives and I love them with the Christ that is within my heart... ...many times people misunderstand me because I am not religious...sometimes I drink too much beer and use cuss words...but in my heart, I know who my Father is and I walk through this life with that confidence. It's not the group we affiliate with but what's in our hearts and how we live...if we love people and if we care and give, our lives become richer. But don't we need fellowship with likeminded believers?...I don't know, do we? I like to listen to quality Christian music and discuss God's love and grace with people, and often do...sometimes I even visit churches and enjoy what's going on...I don't like hypocracy...too many folks go to church and then live Godless lives the other 6 days...I find rituals to be somewhat unChristian and too many "ministers" approach their calling like a job rather than a lifestyle... Jesus never formed an organization nor did he belong to one...he simply lived his life and hung out with a bunch of guys that followed him around...Jesus never told us to join a church, he told us to love one another...that's what I try to do.

You were there?...Funny, I didn't mention the year of the roa that I was referring to or the context of when he said and to whom... ...but you were there! Now isn't that special. Maybe I was referring to 1977 or maybe I was referring to 1980...or...maybe I was referring to a conversation when he was talking to a handful of folks or maybe I was talking about him addressing everyone on the main stage at the rock...I didn't say... ...but you were there! Now isn't that special.

Sometimes things turn out the way we plan them to, sometimes they don't. If I am "believing" to drive to Texas in my car, I step on the gas and follow the map...if I get there, it's because I decided to drive there and followed through on the plan...BUT... if my car breaks down and I get stuck in Arkansas, or if a semi truck plows into me and kills me, or the police stop me in Louisanna and mistakingly arrest me and throw me into prison...what is it?...The way twi explained it was to say that if you didn't get to Texas, it's because you didn't really "believe"...you only "mentally ascended"...The way I explain it is that believing does not effect external forces and that you're believing something does not mean it is going to happen. We may "believe" that something is going to happen and we can take action to facilitate it happening...but external forces may stop it from happening no matter what we "believe"....Our "believing" DOES NOT effect external forces. "It was the fear in the heart of that mother that killed her child"...What about the believing of the guy who drove the car? What happens when people believe opposite things? A soldier believes that he will survive the battlefield, while his enemy sitting in the tree with a sniper's rifle believes he is going to kill the guy...they both cannot happen! Twi explained it by saying some "believing" is "bigger" than other believing... Twi had to invent explanations for the obvious illogic of their doctrine...and why it didn't work. I recall once at the roa...it was raining like crazy and Wierwille proclaimed that his believing to stop the rain was not strong enough to counter all the negative believing from the thousands in attendance. In other words, it was not Wierwille's fault that it rained...it was the fault of everyone else! I say it was all bullsh *t...

The simple truth of the matter is that there is no such thing as the law of believing. It was a tool used by twi to control people. If something turned out right, twi took the bows for teaching the person "the law of believing" but if it turned out wrong, it was the person's fault for not believing...it was a catch 22...no matter what happened, twi was off the hook. The "faith" that is mentioned in the bible is far removed from anything that twi taught. It's threads like this that expose those who still suffer from "waybrain"...(oldiesman and Larry M) Folks...there is no power in your mind that effects things externally. To believe that is a form of witchcraft.

So happy that your bird returned...A lost pet who finally returns home is one of the great feelings in life...glad you found Rascal... :)

Something concrete and practical that I got out of pfal???... Hmmm...I'm really trying to come up with something here... ...nope, sorry...there's nothing of benefit that I can think of...nothing at all....the whole thing was a waste of time.

The GreaseSpot Cafe is an interesting place in the sense that so many people who once were very "likeminded" (cult groupthink), are now very diverse in their opinions and perspectives...I think that is healthy in and of itself. I understand what tonto is saying...there are many folks here (many of them newcomers), who still retain a significant amount of "waybrain"...some of them seem to be on a "mission" to "help" those of us who do not see things their way... I think that one of the milestones of cult recovery is when a person realizes that it is arrogant and presumptious to attempt to do that. personal attacks and rudeness towards another poster is inappropriate...however, exposing the evils of twi in a "colorful" way is not...at least not on this website. If I were to refer to VP Wierwille as the "cornfield preacher" who conned people, drugged young girls, raped them and lied through his cornfield teeth...no doubt, someone will invariably inform me that I am "off the word", bitter, not walking with a "renewed mind" and am being unChristian......even though I am speaking the truth. I have no desire or agenda to get people to believe the things that I believe regarding God...For me to do that, I must first assume that I am right and they are wrong...I make no such assumptions. My goal is to inform people as to what twi was/is all about...to let people know that Wierwille lied, stole and deceived people...what they believe AFTER they recover from waybrain is up to them. I will say this...I believe that what many folks believe is "proper Christian posting", in my opinion, is sugar coated religion.

Try this one, you'll love it... Take a whole chicken, pop open a can of beer and shove it up the chicken's arse... Place chicken on charcoal grill with the beer can standing up(a good bed of coals set low), season chicken (I like black pepper and garlic salt) and close lid (or put cover on) and let it cook for about 3-4 hours...occasionally brush it with creamy Italian dressing. When it's done, the beer can is empty as all the beer steamed throughout the entire chicken making it moist, tender and scrumptious. :)

I buy most of my cookware at garage sales and the Salvation army store...they're a little bit scuffed up but work just fine...I try to avoid the ones with too many teflon peelings...but what the hell, they're only .50 each. Last week I found a toaster for a quarter...it worked just fine after I shook the old bread crumbs and the mouse turds out of it...and of course, spliced and taped on a new plug. My favorite is my stir fry pan...I found it at the city dump. It took awhile to scrape all that brown stuff out of it but boy oh boy, it really works good for my fried baloney and onion sandwiches. why spend a lot of money for something that you can get for free or next to nothing...yeah, that's the ticket.

Those who were in the 10th corps will remember this...It was some time after Veepee had required the corps to write and hand in a paper entitled "from birth to the corps"...(later on it was revealed that twi leaders used this info for sinister purposes)...it was supposed to be a detailed account of your life and what God delivered you from. We (10th corps at Emporia), were all sitting there with Martindale and Wierwille on stage in chairs...suddenly Wierwille explodes about how nobody has turned the paper in yet (even though it was not yet due)...he screams at everyone and then turns to Martindale (who had not turned one in yet either)...really melted his face... He went on for about 10 minutes...screaming about how he expected more from him, etc etc etc. ...this was about 1979

I think that twi was a cult built on the charismatic personality of Cornfield Vic....without Vic, there is no twi...end of story. Had there been no twi, the sincere Christians who got involved would have found Christian groups or churches to get involved with...As far as Doop and Heefner...Wierwille was a thief, he stole their "followers" just like he stole his class and his books...A lot of lives missed out on "what coulda been" because of twi.

I had the pleasure once of seeing Veepee give Martindale a public face melting... ...It was a bit surreal...almost like the Coen brothers meet Quintin Tarentino...it was quite entertaining.

Sure...let him find Jesus... ...maybe he'd be good at correctional outreach...

Isn't that the truth... ...Hmmm, and how was it the apostle Paul got the info to write those epistles? A lot of people spend their time reading the owner's manuel and never driving the car...

I think what Michael Vick did was deplorable and disgusting... I usually am somewhat lenient towards people when they make certain mistakes...not this time. Animal cruelty goes beyond the pail of making a "mistake"...it's a serious charactor flaw...if an entire culture accepts it as normal, then the entire culture has a "cultural charactor flaw"...in MY opinion. I do not participate in killing for sport...or in seeing an animal injured...and certainly what Vick was doing was evil, heartless and cruel. I say cut him no slack...none. I hope the NFL bans him for life. ...and a side note about deer hunting: I live in a rural area that is chock full of deer and deer hunting season is very popular here. I have no objection to thinning out an overpopulated herd and providing meat for your family...what I DO object to is guys who go out hunting with a case of beer, and end up wounding the animal that runs for miles through the woods in excruciating pain and terror...meanwhile, the "hunters" make a quick stop at the convienient store for more beer before they start tracking it down...and even though they have licenses and eat the meat...they still enjoy the sport of killing..it's fun for them to watch it's head explode...for the life of this magnificent animal to be extinguished for their amusement...with no respect for what they kill. I know this is true...I see it all the time.

Well...at least as screwed up as they are, they no longer push lcm as the"great mog of the present truth"...what a joke THAT was...I understand that he's now a psychological basketcase.

Nor should you...our superficial culture with their minute rice minds have locked into whatever is trendy...for the moment. Of course, satisfaction can be gained simply by recognizing the obvious and taking a different personal path...the lemings are plentiful and I try not to watch this stuff too close because it's painful, if not funny...

I think George hit the nail on the head...the size of their properties and holdings is far greater than their need. Maybe they could simply pull a double wide up on a vacant lot and run the whole operation. A secretary to answer the phone and send out the brochures... I'll bet that rosie spends half her time trying to figure out how to get at all that money without the IRS asking her questions. talk about an organization hitting the skids...twi is like Flint, Michigan after the plants all closed down...