GrouchoMarxJr

"First thought"...a term used by members of the way international, which is descriptive of the method used by the Allmighty to communicate directly to the way international follower. This form of communication (also referred to as "revelation")...is confined exclusively to those who have successfully completed the way international's classes and training programs. This is indicated by the nametag worn by the follower in question.

I planned my departure... 1987...Mr martindale had just delivered an edict to the clueless flock. He decided that it was important, for all the twig coordinators, to communicate to him on a weekly basis, stating who was faithful and who was not faithful in the respective fellowships. The factors in deciding who was faithful and who wasn't, could easily be determined by looking at their attendance record and the amount of money that they gave...simple enough. A week after this announcement was made in my area, I had a scheduled leaders meeting to attend...and it was my turn to teach. I made my final teaching as colorful as I could. I let it be known that under no circumstance would I take part in such an ungodly rating system. I told the group of leaders that from hence forth, I could no longer follow the corrupted martindale...I turned and walked out the door. The next day, my entire branch was told to avoid me because I was crawling with demons from the underbelly of hell...or something like that. Two years later, those same leaders who had announced my reprobate condition, became infested with those same demons...go figure. I left on my terms and feel good about that. ;)-->

I left twi 17 years ago, after being involved for 13 years. For me, the twi experience is far removed from my life. It has been for a long time. Is there a residual effect after all this time? Probably so...24-37 are important years in a persons life and I was deeply involved. The con that I swallowed has cost me... With that said, I agree 100% with Oakspear. This IS the opprotunity for people to hear the OTHER side of the story. I feel a certain obligation ( remember that old poem, "The bridge builder"?)...to reach back for those who follow: Why, old ex-cult member, are you building a bridge here...your journey's almost over and never again will you pass this chasm...why? The old ex-cult member raised his graying head and smiled and said...It's true that I am passed this chasm of corruption, this insideous little cornfield cult, this deceitful snake pit full of sexual predators and destroyers of lives...never again will I pass this way. Then, with a wink in his eye and a skip in his step, he said... Getting out of this mind control cult was no problem for me, but for the fair haired youth who follows this path...it may, a pitfall be...No, I'm not here at Greasespot for my benefit, my friend, but to call bull.... on the fakers and abusers, to sound the alarm that the shepherd is screwing his own sheep...perhaps that fairhaired youth will wander into the GS cafe and perhaps he'll feed...old friend,..... I'm posting at Greasespot for him to read.

...oh yeah, and the only part of ole Hairy that ever made that rag was about 1/4 of my head...I could see my ear and some of my hair...I was soooooooooo blessed.

That miserable excuse for a magazine was nothing more than another tool, used for promoting and selling their zombie class. It was fishwrap...

C'mon Mary, don't be shy...tell us what you really think. ;)--> Yep...I think Tom Strange summed it up quite nicely. Mr. Wierwille was definitely a maverick who loved being the top banana, answerable only to himself. He certainly hit paydirt when he tapped into the Jesus hippies. A lot of folks don't realize that just before the "youth explosion" and putting the class on film...A whole bunch of older folks all walked out on Veepee because he started teaching tithing when previously he had taught against it. I guess he was already laying the groundwork to appropriate funds for his empire.

According to Veepee, he made his trip to India independant of his denomination and financed it himself. In fact, his denomination was unhappy with him going there like he did. Supposedly, Veepee was "checking out" what they were doing with the foriegn missionary money. At least this was Veepee spin on what happened as he told a small group of us once. I suspect that his going to India was a "political move" on his part, with his denomination. He was going to be the whistle blower and expose all this fraud that he saw...his reward for all this? Who knows what Veepee was thinking at the time. He still had delusions that his "man of God" persona would operate within his beloved denomination. Perhaps he saw himself as chairman of some board that controlled large amounts of denominational funds...who knows? I think it's safe to say that his trip to India was calculated in his own mind for some self serving purpose. I think that his whole plan blew up in his face. He got into so much trouble over there that whatever he originally had in mind, backfired in his face. I had always heard that wierwille was defrocked because of sexual indiscretions. I'm not sure of the order of events, but all this ties together in his denomination running him off. Unfortunately, this was the springboard for his starting his own cult.

I know all about lymes...I put a slice on top of my corona...it's great that way. ;)-->

Mr. Wierwille seemed to have an extraordinary capacity to rationalize his sexual cravings. There's no doubt that he understood the relationship between authority and sexual license. He actually did convince himself that all the women in the kingdom belong to the king. It's no stretch at all to assume that his time in India served to reinforce his predatory sexual nature.

I couldn't help but notice that in one of Mike's posts, he implied that my original post was lacking in substance... Mike...I assure you that the truck DID need to be unloaded.

Tom was a good friend and I am very sad at this news. He was warm, friendly and honest. He had a great heart and I thank God for his life.

You might be in a cult if... 1-You burned your record collection in a fire. 2-You find yourself saying the same words over and over...just like everybody else around you. 3-You have an associates degree in practical theology, but wash windows for a living. 4-You become adept at glancing at nametags without anyone noticing. 5-All your old friends avoid you like the plague 6-You wonder why you're one of the chosen one's to "really" know the truth 7-You find yourself standing up at meetings shouting out a prayer at the top of your voice

Whatever "mark and avoid" really means...twi got it wrong, I'm sure. They used it deceitfully, as a tool, to get rid of folks that were a threat to them...or just to be punitive if you didn't kiss the right a$$.

I believe that one of the most valuble things that a person can ever have, in this life, is a true friend. I am happy to say that I have some. I can count them on one hand, and I cherish each and every one of them. I'm not talking about friendly aquaintances but meat and potato friends, that you can trust with your life. None of my true friendships were made through twi. Most of the folks that I knew in twi have totally drifted out of my life. The friendships that I have now are unconditional in nature. Nothing is expected except trust and respect. There is no "maintanence" required with my true friends. We may not see each other for awhile but when the chips are down, we are standing in each other's corner. I guess I was lucky to have connected with these people. When a person reaches the end of their life and they reflect upon all that is of value to them, things like money, houses, cars, social position, etc. pale in comparison to personal integrity and having true friends. My friends are a true joy to my heart.

Yeah...wuz up? I remember Steven Roberts. We were at Emporia at the same time...I believe he was 8th corps. Doesn't he have a twin sister or something?

Prayer list? I put him on a different kind of list. ;)-->

I agree wholeheartedly with the Invisible Dan...Mr. Wierwille was more patterned after Hitler than anyone else I can think of. Remember how he pushed "The myth of the six million" and other fascist writings? I heard him say that Hitler had some "pretty good ideas" and "people didn't appreciate his leadership qualities from a historical perspective". Veepee loved the military analogies...that's one of the reasons that he was so upset at lcm's AOS. teachings. Martindale replaced the military comparisons with athletic terms. Old Vic never passed up an opprotunity to have military wafers dress up in full uniform for him and even salute him!!! He loved all the flag waving pomp...I'm surprised he didn't make the corps goosestep.

Let's see now, how would his resume read? Former head of cult, defrocked clergyman, accused rapist, and second string college football player seeks any top position that would pay a triple figure salary with full benefits?

Hey numbnuts, if you're not busy, I got a truck that needs unloading.

During my wow year, our family coordinator bought some band-aids on one of her shopping trips. About 4 months later, I cut my finger and needed a band-aid. Another time, when I was driving a new student to one of the sessions, a car almost hit us...but didn't. ...And how could I ever forget the miracle of Thanksgiving, 1983...I had forgotten to buy the pumpkin pie for dessert but when one of our guests arrived, guess what they had with them? I never cease to marvel at the signs, miracles and wonders that constantly followed me around during my twi years.

Joe C is still with twi??? Holy moley, I thought that boy had more brains than that! Another possibility is Bob M...he's been near the top forever. He was a region leader before lcm even was involved with twi. Besides he's plenty arrogant and full of himself...prerequisites for the job.

Insurgent...you could be right about that,,, Actually bobby boy is talented. Talented at being arrogant, snobish, self-absorbed, and boorish. I always figured that he stuck it out when everybody else was splitting because he figured he would end up near the top when the dust settled...squatters rights or something like that. When I was in residence at Emporia, I got a surprise during the noon meal...they announced my name for going to Rome City. After being there for about two weeks, bobby sent me a note, asking "what are you doing here?"...I sent him a note back saying "I was hoping you could tell me"...He never liked me after that and the feeling was mutual.

Speaking of doctrine... When a "clergyman" teaches, in private, that having sex with him is God's will...it's not that surprising that he would also teach publicly, that abortion is "ok" with God. I know of intelligent women who were taught that it was their godly duty to have sex with the mog. When the woman believes the doctrine that is taught her, the rest is easy. Even if the woman "willingly" complies, she is still a victim...even as Jim Jones victimized his followers with koolaid, teaching them it was God's will. Compare the motives...the woman is sincerly trying to do God's will as it was taught her, the mog is lying to the woman in order to get into her pants. The woman is giving of herself in order to please God (or so SHE believes), the twi leader is taking for himself in order to please himself...AND lying in God's name in the process! How can any reasonable person possibly include the woman in culpability? It seems to me that the twi apologists here, can rationalize about anything as long as they end up paying homage to what they perceive as their valuable experience with that little cornfield cult.

I guess I use the word "brainwashed" loosely at times. It's a "push button" word for a lot of folks and often times, they'll get up on their high horse and object to it's useage. Ok by me. I realize that while I was in residence, I had freedom of will...I could have left anytime I wanted...almost did a couple of times. Being a part of twi for 13 years and then leaving, I wanted to know what exactly had happened to me during my "cult years". Make no mistake about it, twi is a cult by every measure. They employ mind control techniques to induce a group think mentality. It's not unique, ask anyone who has endured military basic training. We were not literally puppets on a string, but we were certainly under tremendous pressure to comply. I disagree with Oldies when it comes to assigning blame for sexual indiscretions. A "high ranking" clergy who directs himself sexually at one of his own flock, takes the full blame for what he has done. He should be taken out and horsewhipped for his crime. In no way is the woman to share in that blame. How dare anyone try to depict the woman as anything other than a victim. I stand by my comparison of prison guards and twi leaders. Although there are certainly differences between the two, The ingredients of authority and secrecy working together to cause sadistic sexual behavior is evident in both. Several years ago there was an experiment with college students. Half were made guards and half were made prisoners. The idea was to swap roles after several days. The experiment had to be aborted because the first group had become so sadistical that they were afraid someone would get hurt. Under certain conditions, people respond in certain ways...pure and simple. In my experience, I always felt the arrogance and uncaring attitude when I was around top twi leaders. The degree of their evil behind closed doors is astounding.

If lcm hadn't run off all the talented people in twi, that cast of charecters you list would be cutting the grass on the back forty. I've heard that of all the old timers that Bob M. is still around. I'm surprised that twi didn't "tap him" for one of the top jobs.