GrouchoMarxJr

casually elegant dress code?

Assignments....what a joke...I remember being in a room with veepee and a bunch of prospective limb leaders...veepee had a basket of apples...he picked them up one at a time and threw them really hard at each guy sitting in their chairs...the one guy that caught his apple was made a limb leader... We used to think that they made these assignments by revelation! If God ever talked to a twi leader it was only to tell him to get the hell out of twi!

Just wanted to backtrack for a moment concerning this "public castigation" that occurred in twi. I witnessed it numerous times but there was one in particular that I feel is worth mentioning: I was in the 10th corps at Emporia...it was our first year in residence...At about 3am., the entire corps was woken from their sleep and ordered to report to the "top of vierville library"...we all sat there (over 500 of us) for awhile until lcm entered the room. He called out a certain individual's name (10th corps guy) and made him stand...he then announced that this person had actually committed the grievious sin of sneaking into town and eating pizza, when he was supposed to be on campus watching some dumb twi film! Lcm waited until the middle of the night to do this... Lcm tore into this poor sob. like nothing I'd ever seen before...Vein popping, spittle flying, screaming! He tore this guy into pieces...I couldn't believe it, it was horrifying. He went on for about an hour straight! You'd have thought that the guy was caught having sex with a fellow corps members wife or something! After that occasion, everybody was extremely fearful that they would be next...

Wierwille was an extremely insecure man. He constantly craved the attention that was due a "great man of god"...to the end that he stole, what he considered, the best of what others had written and taught...and then called it his own. Concoct lies about snow on gas pumps and allow far fetched stories of his great spiritual escapades, to circulate far and wide. The spotlight was always to be on him...he was at his best when standing on a stage with all eyes upon him... His writings?...The very basic underpinnings of his belief system was destructive in nature. Believing equals receiving...my a$$ it does. That one opened the can of worms that led to self condemnation, guilt, feelings of inadequecy, misconceptions concerning God's role in your life, a belief that there was a power in your mind that could effect external forces, a total willingness to be manipulated...just to name a few. He went on from there...Veepee was to Christianity what Jeffery Dahmer was to gourmet dining. His contributions of a literary nature were a cruel joke.

Yeah...I like that..."built in expiration date", ain't that the truth! When one considers that veepee was the mog, and Christ was absent...it only stands to reason that when veepee finally cashed in his chips, the whole reality of wayworld went kittywompis. The head of the body was no longer alive...what a prediciment! "Veepee, my servant is DEAD, go now, etc. etc. etc." Joshua Martindumb snatched up the mantle and led us all to the promised land of sexual perversions...The expiration date was past...the product tainted...Veepee thought he was Paul and lcm was Timothy. Actually Veepee was P.T. Barnum and lcm was Moe Howard.

M&O...That's an excellant point about the privacy thing...For me music was always a personal thing...there was music that I would play when a bunch of folks were around and then there was the music that I played when I was alone...The intrusion by twi into my "music world", was indeed, an intrusion into my privacy. They dug into my root cellar, so to speak. Even after I left twi, I was always "spiritualizing" the music I listened to, out of habit...it took me awhile to recapture my own "center" and go back to the business of being an individual again. I guess the turning point for my recovery came when I returned to finally finish college...communications major with a keen interest in radio...I ended up working for several radio stations until it culminated when I became program director for an NPR, public radio station. I went through a complete "musical metamorhis" and emerged into a more honest appreciation of secular music, and to a much greater extent than even my pre-twi days...I have many to thank...amoung them are the likes of Thelonias Monk, Miles Davis, Frank Zappa, Bob Marley and of course...the great one, Ray Charles..."Life after twi is sweet as moms apple pie!"

Twi is both a religious organization and a multi level marketing scheme. These two entities are are not, either one or the other, but consistantly work hand in hand. They compliment each other...check out Benny Hinn's money making scam, or any of the other TV con artists. They all have ways of raking in money based upon the "God will bless you if you give me your money" scheme. This has been going on for centuries. Whether or not they are sincere about their particular form of mythology , can be determined by their adherence/ or not...to the actual doctrines and dogmas they espouse. I would suggest that the people at the "bottom" are probably the most sincere about their belief system, while the top dogs are least sincere...Afterall, it's the rank and file that finance the lush life styles of the leadership...you know, the "greatest servants"...look for the contridictions and follow the money.

I don't think so, it's happened to me before also...

I remember camp Gunnison when twi first aquired it...I was there in 1976,77,78... Thanks to all that abs money and the log home builders they lucked out getting into their cult, they developed the property quite nicely. It really was/is a beautiful location...twi certainly doesn't deserve to own such a place... I think that they should give it to ex-wayfers in compensation for all the damage they did. Perhaps Paw could coordinate a rotating vacation schedule from the GS...We could have bonfires, drink beer and even play the deebil's music real loud...

A big 10-4 on what George just said...there are plenty of hard luck cases everywhere. The example George used was extreme but it really made the point. The "trauma" of the cornfield cult pales in comparison to the hand that some folks have been dealt. A friend of mine was a POW (not to be confused with a WOW)...in Viet Nam for over a year and a half...after listening to some of his stories, I was too embarrassed to even mention my "horrible" experience at Emporia.

FontanaAna...If I understand your point of view, you are thankful to God that you don't share the opinions that some of us do concerning twi...Well, I thank God that my eyes have been opened to an insideous little cult that has been lying in God's name! As far as who my posts are for...I just write em'...they are for anybody who chooses to read them...apparently, you do not read posts that disagree with your point of view...that's fine...but just in case you are still reading this...a friendly reminder, The Grease spot Cafe is NOT a Christian website. It's an open discussion forum that welcomes divergent points of view. You are certainly welcome to yours, but if opposing points of view upset you, I would suggest checking out one of the many, many Christian site that are "available". As far as the CF&S class goes...it was a joke. They billed it as "the greatest teaching on this subject anywhere in the world"...far from it. I learned more from 8th grade biology and what my folks taught me growing up...Wierwille's views on sex were chauvinistic, perverse and cruel. Having wierwille teach about sex is like having a pedophile teaching a boyscout troop.

Oh yes...watch out for the debbils music! When I entered twi, I was taken "aside" and taught all about how the debbil had taken over the music industry...no more Grateful Dead, or Moody Blues, forget the Beatles, and you damn well better burn those Rolling Stone albums! Sympathy for the devil indeed! Of course, all this debbil music was to be replaced with the Nazi music of wierwille's wayproductions...the inferior sound systems, the inferior song writing, composing and performing...all tempered by wierwille's "expertise" in understanding the spirituality of it all...and then censoring the little bit of talent and originality that dared rear it's head...how plastic, how phoney. Yeah, it still pi$$es me off that I let those creeps talk me into their little cornfield reality...

At least the Hari Krishnas are no longer frolicking through the airports banging their tamborines... Actually, I try to be polite and even kind to all those who venture to my door...I always figure that they were pressured into doing it, in order to please some "leader" or gain favor in their organization...but I never let em in ;)-->

Danny hit the nail right on the head..."works for saint and sinner alike"...Wierwille taught that there is a power within the mind that effects things externally...God was not included in this dynamic. He was relegated to an inactive role on the sidelines, while this great "law of believing" appropriated the desired results as WE activated this internal power source... There are many folks who realize that the "law of believing" is as phoney as a three dollar bill, but I'm not sure how many realize how insideous and destructive this so called "law" really was. It was the basis for everything else that twi did...it was their "catch 22"...it was the false doctrine that laid the foundation for an idolatrous little cornfield cult to manipulate the lives of thousands...

Hooner...welcome to the Grease spot! Unlike twi, you'll find a diversity of opinions here...and that's healthy. I have been out now for 17 years (was in for 13)...I understand what you are going through, your "wounds" are still fresh...let me assure you that things will get MUCH better as time goes on. I must say that my opinion of twi is very close to George Aars. They were a bunch of con artists who took advantage of some very sincere and naive folks...Recognizing then for what they are/were is very therapeutic in recovering from your experience.

If memory serves me correctly, my first encounter with twi's current president was at pfal77...I had never heard of her before and suddenly, there she is, on stage being introduced as the "hostess with the mostest", or something like that. She was in charge of coordinating a major portion of that event...can't remember exactly what her title or function was...but I do remember thinking to myself at the time..."who the f***** is this"? Her "southern belle" syrupy drawl along with her interpretation of a "toned down" Tammy Faye Baker appearance, left me a little cold. I remember passing her in some hallway and getting an "up close" look at her...I recall thinking to myself, "who's she trying to kid"?...she came across to me as being very ambitious in her attempts to climb up that waytree. When I first heard of twi's selection of Rosie to replace lcm...I was shocked...I knew at that moment how shallow the pool was, in which to select a new leader. I agree that quotes from her will be somewhat scarce...not only does she lay low, but what she DOES say is so forgettable that I'm surprised anybody can even bear to listen to her.

During the 70's, there was no compulsion to report "get togethers"...that's insane. I would have walked away then and there. The leaders would run their meetings and there was not even any real pressure to attend those...they might "talk to you" and encourage you to get more involved, but there was nothing punitive...nobody ever got M&A for lack of involvement. They made it clear that if you wanted to become leadership (climb the waytree)...involvement was mandatory...but it was pretty freewheelin' in those days. Any event that twi scheduled, always had a view to the end of recruitment. Green cards flowed freely..."your pen or mine"...all that crap. I find it interesting to note, that IMHO, the most sincere witnessing took place during NON-twi events. When you were half in the bag with your "old-man" buddies...or when friends or relatives would inquire on their own, rather than being brow beat at some twi event, where most of the wayfers were only trying to look good for the leadership and generally came across as insincere amway salesmen. When I hear the stories about the evil regieme of lcm, I find it difficult to believe that so many bright folks, allowed such outragious intrusions into their personal lives to occur. Sorry, I'm not trying to make anybody angry or defensive...but, holy crow! I wonder how many actually WOULD have chugged down the koolaid, had lcm filled the cups.

The worst way song was any song that martindale was leading...I can still see that pompous a$$ swinging his arms around like he was doing a vaudeville act. The attention was always on him...he was always willing to demonstrate his arrogance.

Donna M- Georgina Splevin Bob M- Ronnie Howard Don W- Anthony Perkins Del D- Jon Voight Returning wows- Jerry's kids

When a "coordinator/leader" wanted to impress some newbies, he would point out some poor schmuck and declare that he has "no rooms for rent"...meaning of course, that the coordinator/leader was spiritually perceiving that the individual in question was devil possessed...in fact the guy was "loaded" with them and often times the coordinator/leader would actually start telling the newbies, the different names of said devil spirits...usually, the names of the spirits would match the list of names handed out at the advanced class.

I gave up 13 years of my life, about $25,000 in abs.,and so many opprotunities that I lost count...but I didn't give these things up for the word...they didn't have the word.

Maybe the original BOT should be played by the three stooges... Martindale...Michael Pollard

...And NEVER use the word "create"...only God creates doncha know! Today I go out of my way to use the word create..."I created some chile con carne that would burn the nametag off a limb coordinator"... ...And I recall at piffle 77...A guy I knew developed a serious problem...he was spitting blood...didn't know why...went to third aid...they told him to drink water and gave him gold seal tablets...true story!!! A week later, back at home, he was diagnosed with a bleeding ulcer. My alltime choice for most aggravating phrase..."JUST RENEW YOUR MIND!" If I ever hear someone say that to me again, I will stick my thumb in their eye...

If I'm not mistaken, the final season is 10 episodes long and doesn't begin until Jan. 06! I think with Johnny Sack and his boys all going to jail, Tony S. will definitely become more powerful and "pick up" some of the NY action... I can't see the show ending up with Tony S. still in power...he'll either get whacked or go to jail... I suspect that they will bring in some new faces like they did this year, featuring some top actors...maybe Feetch will return.

The reason that martindale wanted the bookstore closed to outsiders is because if any of martindales "research publications" fell into the hands of any serious bible scholars, they would have laughed until they wet themselves.