GrouchoMarxJr

I know a female who was in the family corps way back when...she told me this story: She was summoned one evening and was told to report to John Townsend's trailor...when she knocked on the door, Johhny greeted her at the door wearing a bathrobe and nothing underneath...the bathrobe was open and he was "ready for action", so to speak...he announced that his wife was out of town and invited her in...she turned around and ran as fast as she could! She told me that after that incident, she was singled out and given all the crappy jobs.....

Child molestors should be castrated and ...then they should be dropped into an empty well full of rattlesnakes.

It's actually pretty funny when you consider how Rosie sees her role as president of twi. Veepee used to swagger around on stage, seeing himself as the mog for the entire world! He was responsible for teaching the entire world the "truth"!!! Now Rosie, in her "redefined" role sees herself as the keeper of the books. A silent administrator who plans and plots in the backrooms on how to control the few followers that they still have. No vision of reaching out to the world...hell, no vision of reaching out past hiway 29 and wierwille road! The only reason this cult still exists is that they cannot get to the cash without maintaining their cult. They legally cannot just dissolve the organization and grab the assets...or they would. I'm not an attorney but it's my understanding that twi must continue to put on the appearance of a "ministry" in order to keep their indulgent lifestyles on track.

My new year's resolution is to try to overcome my shyness and hesitancy is posting my opinions on the political forum.

To all current members of TWI: Remember when you were a kid and Christmas was special? When families (blood that is), gathered together and broke bread and exchanged gifts and drank eggnog and rum? Remember the warm feelings and the bonding that took place? Well, you can forget all that now...Your "Christmas" is now called by a different name and your "earthly" family has been eliminated. Eggnog is ok but forget the rum and no gifts dammitt!...Unless they are being sent to your twi leadership...and THOSE gifts are required! If you think of doing anything to celebrate your "new holiday" without the permission of twi leadership, there will be hell to pay!...and if you dare to go into debt buying gifts for your children or spouse, you will probably spend your next "holiday" as a greasespot...but cheer up, there's always your birthday to look forward to...isn't that when you're told that the "Household" thing to do is to buy gifts for your twi leadership instead of receiving any for yourself?...I forgot a lot of this stuff...I'm afraid I'm a little foggy.

The "higher up" in an organization like this, that a person goes, usually means that the further "away" from actually being involved with the actual product or service that is provided by the organization. In other words, Rosie doesn't do anything.

...And who says that Cathoilc priests have a monopoly on child abuse.

I got sucked into the "accuracy of the word" myth. I really didn't like the people that I had to deal with and I really didn't care much for the "activities" that twi pushed on me...I stuck around in spite of all that. As soon as the "spell" was broke, I skeedaddled.

Geeeeeze! I just clicked on the pic of Rosie and got a close up look...I swear, it looks like she has Martindale's balls in her throat and is ready to swallow.

...finger in someone's ear the same as sex? I never heard that one...sheeesch! I suppose safe sex would involve a Q tip?

Yeah...I wrote it at 3:30 in the morning...I saw Vic as being upset at Craiggers for changing his doctrine, trashing his classes, ending his wow program and roa, running off all his former followers and pretty much destroying the ministry...That would be Vic's perspective, I would guess... Dated?...right again satori...maybe somebody should write one more current...You know: ...Twas the night before HoHo and all through the house... ...Rosie had Donna take off her blouse...

Twas the night before the happy household holiday, and all through the chalet... Not a creature was stirring, except Craig practicing his ballet... His lesbian wife was asleep, and that's just as well... When he boffs the young corps girl no one will tell... He leaps in his leotards with the greatest of ease... When he hears a strange sound, perhaps just a breeze?... But there in the moonlight a figure appears... It must be an angel to dispel all my fears!... But as it draws closer, he measures it's stride... It's staggering forward, from side to side... A familiar smell he cannot deny, He starts to panic, he starts to cry... When in through the door bursts a creature so vile... With death in his eyes, on his lips a cursed smile... As the creature draws closer, his legs turn to stone... He cannot escape, he is truly alone... The creature grabs Craig by the throat and the leg... Craig starts to whimper, Craig starts to beg... But the creature throws Craig to the floor with a thud and a throttle... He pulls from his jacket an old dusty bottle... He tips his head back and pours down the swill... He wipes off his chin and he shakes off the chill... He then stares in anger with blood in his eyes... Craig tries to crawl, Craig tells some lies... But the creature strikes down with the bottle in hand... and says that's what you get in your "promised land"... The creature goes back to the place whence he came... The stuff in the bottle is Drambuie by name... Before he lays down in his grave by the fountain... He screams out these words, like Moses on the mountain... "I got rid of the bastard, he put up no fight... so have a happy ho ho, and to all a good night"

...As for Martindale...I was present at the ceremony when Veepee put the mantle around his neck... The guy had a look on his face of total arrogance. A little smirk around the corners of his mouth indicated that he was no longer Wierwille's chief a$$kisser, but was now HE who's a$$ must be kissed...It poured out of him...You could almost hear him thinking how all the currying for favor was worth it, because he was now the top Kahoona! The decay of this rancid little cult was always there...Martindale simply brought it to the surface for all to see.

After I left twi in 1987, I took a "hiatus" for several years...One day I decided to check out JAL's group. The thing that bothered me most was their insistance that I be counted as "one of them". Simply because I attended a couple of their meetings, they assumed that I was ready to become a "member". They tried to network me into their "system" but I wouldn't give up my "autonomy" and refused to play their "organization game". It seems imperative to all these "splinter guys", that they recruit others into their organization...which of course, is their attempt to elevate themselves as so called leaders...afterall, if you want to be a "leader", you must find those willing to follow and the more followers you have, the greater the success of the "leader"...and that IS what it's all about...feeding their own distorted egos.

Newcomer..."Is it true that Rev. Martindale likes to have sex with other men's wives?" Twi..."Of course he does. He learned it from Dr. Wierwille who was constantly having sex with any woman that he could coerce into the back of his motorcoach" Newcomer..."But isn't that wrong?" Twi..."Not really. You see, when Gawd annoints a man to rule over other people, He includes a provision that allows the annointed one to have sex with anyone he wants." Newcomer..."But what if the husband doesn't like his wife having sex with Rev Martindale?" Twi..."The man would be asked to renew his mind and if that didn't work, we would subliminally encourage him to commit suicide" Newcomer..."Gosh, that doesn't sound very Christian to me" Twi..."Well, actually Newcomer, you sound like a trouble maker and that means that you are full of demons and we don't like you anymore" Newcomer..."Are you for real? How does anybody in their right mind support your filthy little cult?" Twi..."Listen up reprobate, I want you off this property right now! Get thee hence, and don't ever come back!" Newcomer..."One small problem numbnuts, this is MY house!" ...Ensuing fistfight leaves cult leader with broken nose, two cracked ribs, and his front teeth kicked out.

The "word" has cost me nothing...the bible has always been there to read. Wierwille's version of the bible cost me $85. My involvement with twi cost me dearly

...A choice of heaven or hell...eternal bliss with God or eternal torment...nothing in between? Let's think about that for a minute...There's what? 6 billion people on earth, not to mention all the ones that have lived and died in the past...but only one of two places to go when you die...it seems that the "line of demarcation" might get a little "gray" when you consider all the variables. I mean, there must be some close calls, wouldn't you say? I would imagine that there's probably not a lot of difference between the guy who just made it into heaven and the guy who just missed heaven...but yet, one gets eternal bliss and the other eternal torment...hardly seems fair...but anyway, back to the question...I'm trying to think of something that one could do in a temporary world that would deserve eternal torment...but I can't. I mean, say we're all in heaven for 250 million years or so and one day someday sighs and says "Have they suffered enough yet?"...The question is too ludicrous to properly answer.

It's one thing to "know" somebody just from seeing them so often on stage, teaching. That's how most wayfers knew Martindale. It's like "knowing" a movie star or famous athlete...in other words, you don't REALLY know them. You only see their public image and persona. It's quite another thing to "know" somebody on a personal basis, one on one. To spend some time with them and see how they are when they are away from the crowds. I had the opprotunity to get to know Martindale, one on one. It was at that time that I decided, immediately, that I did not like the man and did not trust him. The main feeling that I got from Martindale was that he didn't really give a rat's a$$ about anybody but himself. He was condescending, patronizing, and insincere. He also knew how to kiss Wierwille's a$$ better than anybody else and that was instrumental in his becoming prez...and one thing I've learned about a$$kissers...Anybody who kissed a$$ to get to the top, always surrounds himself with other a$$kissers...I think that about sums up Martindale's leadership.

No doubt Wierwille believed in his "law of believing"...He took it to the point where he actually lost his mind...He figured if he could simply believe that he was the great apostle, he would be! Wierwille annointed himself as an apostle (without any help from the good Lord)...simply because he decided to believe such a thing...and as we all know, believing equals receiving...viola! A self made apostle! I think Wierwille got to the point in his own head, that if he thought something...it was revelation! He convinced himself that if HE thought of it...it was God speaking to the world!...A decent psychologist would have a field day with old Veepee on the couch...

Actually, if you take the numerical value of "LoyCraigMartindale" and determine the alignment of the stars at the time of his birth, and then reduce the variable of "X" into the time frame of his presidency at twi...add all these factors together, total out the equation, and his name clearly is deciphored as........Moe Howard.

I agree with what you guys are all saying but here's what I don't get...Martindale was totally full of himself...He took the criticism of all the top guys there and shook it off...he ran off the likes of JAL and RD and VF and BR and all the other "heavies". He wouldn't listen to anybody...afterall, he was the annointed one, the new mog! All of a sudden Geer shows up in town and Martindale wilts like a 90 pound weakling on the beach. It seems to me that Geer pulled off what nobody else could and IMHO, Geer was nobody special. How is it that LCM cowtowed to Geer in the first place?

Strange times, they were...I joined twi in 1975 and left in 1987. I left at the same time as JAL, Dubofsky, and others. After Veepee died in 1985, it was almost as if some kind of hypnotic spell was broken. I started to think for myself again. I didn't like Martindale and I didn't trust him. I kept a critical eye on him and expressed my reservations about him to others. Of course I was branded as a troublemaker. When Martindale demanded that every twig coordinator report weekly as to who was faithful and who wasn't...that was the final straw for me. He was dead wrong and it was easy to show it in the bible...The only problem was that all the clergy and corps around me didn't seem to care that Martindale was "off the word"...I'll never forget the looks on their faces when I stood up at a leaders meeting and told them all what I thought...and then walked out...never looked back...never felt bad about it...a very short time after my departure, it fell apart at the seams.

You know it Oakster...Martindale really screwed up a good thing for himself...all he had to do to be successful was to maintain what Wierwille built...keep the trains running on time and be a gracious mog...nope, he couldn't do it. He decided to go looneytunes instead...by dismantling virtually every successful program that twi had built upon (wow, roa, pfal), Martindale proved beyond a shadow of a doubt, that no matter how stupid of a thing you may have done in your life...he was able to top it. Martindale not only trashed the "infallibility" of the mog...but he also demonstrated that the man that Wierwille had so carefully selected to replace him...the man in whom he placed the mantle around his neck and ordained as our next mog...also had .... for brains.

Considering Martindale's background in wayworld, which includes an extremely patriarchal hierarchy and disparaging views of the role of women as subserviant...and when you consider his very passionate views against homosexuality...how in the world did he ever, ever, ever, ever, ever...pick Rosie??? I mean, seriously...this choice flies in the face of everything I ever knew about the guy...Wierwille never would have selected a woman as president of twi. The only explanation I can come up with is that it was kind of a "Gerald Ford" selection...by that I mean, if you pick somebody who is incompetant to replace you, then the chances of you being replaced lessens...of course it didn't work for Nixon either. What are your thoughts?

I think that JustThinking hit the nail on the head concerning the "cult of personality". By definition, every cult has a cult leader...the cult is usually built on the charisma and personality of the cult leader...this was certainly true with twi. They can juggle the material around and present it anyway they like, but without a charismatic leader, they ain't going nowhere. Every town in America has plenty of churches and Christian organizations...twi has NOTHING to offer. Their doctrines can be found elsewhere and without the charismatic front man, they are just another local church at best...and at worst, they are a cult without a cult leader, trying to live down a bad reputation. I remember the first time I saw old Veepee teach live...say what you will about the old bastard, he really knew how to put on a dog and pony show. Never saw a preacher anywhere who taught the way he did...the fire...he could hold a crowd...Now Rosie is a different story entirely. I think listening to Martha Stewart talk about flower arrangements is more inspiring and exciting than listening to Rosie Riverrat spew bland platitudes from her lesbian piehole. I mean, the only reason a lot of us stuck it out with twi was because Veepee could really lather ya up and sell the snakeoil...what I don't understand is how ANYBODY could POSSIBLY follow this woman's "leadership". I mean, Rosie? Gimmee a break! The least they coulda done was got somebody with a little pizzazz.