T-Bone

Alright - who makes up these darn tests!?!? The first time I scored a 0 %. Yikes! Second time, 100 %. Man oh man what a struggle?

RonG and Kevlar - thanks - both are hilarious - good laugh to start my day!!!

RumRunner - you're in our thoughts and prayers, Tonto & T-Bone.

So true, Rascal – so true! As I was reading this thread, I was reminded of a quote by Allan Bloom: "The most successful tyranny is not the one that uses force to assure uniformity but the one that removes the awareness of other possibilities, that makes it seem inconceivable that other ways are viable, that removes the sense that there is an outside." (Closing of the American Mind)

Bagpipes, you had me at "Rambler" - so I guess it's okay if I ramble too. When you mentioned those threads as proof of the web – I thought of this quote: "Oh what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive!" Sir Walter Scott Four of the words stuck out to me: "tangled web we weave." Tangled – knit together in intricate confusion [was one of the dictionary definitions]. Web – an intricate pattern or structure suggestive of something woven; a network [two of the definitions listed]. We – we were all a part of this complicated snare – whether or not we had deliberate intentions to deceive – we were trained to do so through error prone TWI doctrine, policies, practices, leadership's example. It's like a twisted Soylent Green movie line, "TWI's web of deception is made of people!" We – as followers of TWI were the web – we were not the spider that makes the web! So, lest you think I forgot the real architects of this stupefying maze I leave you with a quote from the chief architect VPW, "Nothing happens without leadership." Weave – to form by interlacing strands; to make by intertwining; to produce by elaborately combining elements; to move in a devious, winding, or zigzag course esp. to avoid obstacles. It was not one single thing – one single person – that pulled this off. All the definitions above suggest a complexity of many elements. The snare is challenging to unravel – typically, we don't see the forest for the trees. Or to put it another way – after I left TWI, I spent a number of years looking inward – analyzing this one measly little strand of the web [me], feeling guilty and ashamed for being so dumb as to have believed their hogwash. I have cut myself some slack since then. Especially since I discovered TWI has a knack for disabling people's thinking – like VPW's classic line, "You can't go beyond what you're taught." Now there is a potent little pill that can knock you back to the Stone Age if you swallow it – in my opinion…It does get extremely complicated as you try to figure out what went on, what happened to you, why you got involved, why you left, why you did certain things, thought a certain way…Don't want to end on such a downbeat…I have such freedom and enjoyment of life now – I'm really doing okay – just every once and awhile – for therapeutic reasons I gotta rant!

Have a Great Birthday, BikerBabe !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for the tune, Bluzeman! That sounds like B.B. King with Travis.That's a great sounding combo ...[speaking of combos - I've got a great CD of B.B. with Eric Clapton - title "Riding with the King"]

ChattyKathy - that reminds me of a cartoon I saw [if I'm remembering it right]: It's an office scene - someone is picking up a fax from the fax machine and says to a co-worker "It's a fax from your dog - it's your cat." And you can see a squished-looking cat on the fax sheet...Ok - cruel I know - but it's only a cartoon.

Congrats Eagle and the Mrs. and the parents - happy birthday Ethan !!!!

Thanks, Abigail for another interesting article – I went to the Chabad website and read the whole article "The Secret of the Void: The Kabbalah of Self-Discovery" by Shifra Hendrie. When I say "interesting" I'm not saying I understand every point Hendrie makes – I guess what I mean is there's things in the article that touch on things I'm interested in – things that relate to my Christian faith and personal viewpoint – so for what it's worth here's my two cents on this thread. Some things in Shifra Hendrie's article caught my eye: I believe God made us social creatures – as beings to commune with God and each other. I think one of the things from the fall of man in Genesis is alienation – we became estranged from God, each other and even ourselves. I see alienation as one of the themes in the Bible – Adam and Eve getting the boot out of the Garden of Eden, Israel as strangers serving in Egypt, wandering in the wilderness, exiled in Babylon, references to this world not being our home, that we are strangers and aliens in this world. I think the work of Christ addresses this need of mankind in the blessings of atonement – even though we don't fully realize them in this life. I like Hendrie's phrase "this sensation of something missing is actually the glimmer of something too vast and amazing to be perceived by our ordinary senses." That reminds me of Ecclesiastes 3: 10, 11 "I have seen the task God has given humanity to keep us occupied. He has made everything suited to its time; also, he has given human beings an awareness of eternity; but in such a way that they can't fully comprehend, from beginning to end, the things God does." [The Complete Jewish Bible translated by David H. Stern] And along those lines of sensing "something else out there" I think of James 3: 9 where it mentions how with the same tongue we bless our Lord and Father and yet curse men who have been made in the likeness of God. In my TWI days I use to think it was only referring to born again believers – wrong – I now believe it refers to everyone – doesn't matter what their beliefs are. It is how God made us – part of what it is to be human. It is that likeness of God in us – that picks up on these things eternal. Maybe in this life it's a feeling we're not quite home yet, sensing our relationships fall short of a connectedness we long for. But I don't think it has to be a downbeat philosophy – Hendrie's article mentions self-discovery – I think life is a journey of sorts – from my Christian perspective it's an unfolding discovery – learning more about God, others and myself.

What if the call is about the cat. Perhaps a call from the Vet. Or the call is from Rent-A-Center - they want the couch back...Sorry, I couldn't resist a good set up....I do like the idea - the suspense of waiting - of who is going to call - and about what.

Happy Birthday, TopoftheWorld !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks everyone for sharing your appreciation...Tom, I read the alternate version of "All in the Family" theme on the ninth corps thread - very funny!... My - we are a cultured bunch.

I kinda see a concept that could be developed between ChattyKathy’s mention of memories, the man turning in place [turning in his mind] and Socks’ word “waiting”, cars moving somewhere and back again, and the cat that thinks the couch is his…Overall, it’s the circular nature of memories – how we experience something in real time – and then farther down the road we bring that experience back again and again through a memory. And “waiting” as you would for the passage of time – the hands on the clock go around the face. The man waiting is playing those memories over repeatedly – and maybe like sappy music video – or a CSI episode – he paces his thinking, his remembering – paced with the clock his watching – as each minute rolls by – he’s looking at some clock behind the lady he’s thinking about. He’s even trying to manipulate the memories – playing them back a little differently to see if that would have changed things for the better…Okay – I know this is pretty dorky – but it’s late and I’m punch-drunk from a long day of working in the heat…Anyway – the cat – sort of like when we lounge around on a memory – its ours – we own it – we like to hang out with it. I don’t know CK – the song could go either way happy or unhappy ending – I guess it all depends on if Socks is gonna kick that cat off the couch or not...Nuff said – I better get to bed – gotta do it again tomorrow.

What you said caught my eye. I found this in Evangelical Dictionary of Theology, Walter Elwell, Editor; Woman, Biblical Concept of. Page 1176 [Abigail, I put the part of this text in bold red that compliments your statement], "…In the punishment meted out to Eve is the statement, "Your desire will be for your husband and he will rule over you" [Gen.3:16]. This was a divine description of what would occur, not a mandate which obedient servants of God should attempt to carry out. Subordination is not enjoined here any more than it is mandated that women should suffer a maximum of pain in childbearing, or men a maximum of discomfort and toil in earning their living. God has graciously provided means whereby even the curse of evil may be alleviated, and those who wish to carry out his will can and should as much as possible counteract the painful effects of evil. It is to be noted also that the promise of the redeemer through a descendant of Eve precedes the statement of the curse incurred by women at the fall [Gen. 3:15]."

I didn’t know if I should put this in Silly or Open. Another weird poem I wrote inspired from a couple of threads like Way Corps Scum, All Nine all the Time and basically thinking about the pressure to be a super-believer. Clark Kent Returns Yes – it’s true… I was a Superman for twelve years. twelve glorious years of flying after daydreams at breakneck speeds. …Strangers would enter my superfluous presence – yes, in very close proximity to my area of concern, interest and need – point at the little pin on my lapel and ask, “Is it a bird…Is it a plane?” No – I am Superman! I’ve got power – really fantastic superpowers – Nine to be exact – I operate them all the time – And stand for this present truth, and justice by The International Way. I’ve got super-peepers – keen X-Ray vision eyeballs– I can look through almost any kind of glass [except smoked, mirrored, and of course leaded, you dummy]! If I concentrated hard enough – I had insight that could blind you – I saw stuff in the Bible that even God didn’t know was there! Can I fly? Why, yes I was able to believe I could leap tall buildings in a single bound. But I need to explain why so often these powers would wane Lex Lucifer had that dreaded kryptonite hidden just about everywhere. …Now I’ve superimposed a superhuman hiatus - on this manifest of quixotic powers – I’m holding them in abeyance – I’m even moving out of my Fortress of Similitude. So what if I’ve joined the ranks of the other mere mortals. I never looked good in those blue tights anyway. Weep not for idols gone idle, I’m working full time at the Daily Planet now. Some may say “How can you not believe you can bend steel in your bare hands or not imagine changing the course of mighty rivers?” Hmmmm….that’s true some old habits never die. My wife will tell you [with a chuckle in her voice] I’m still faster than a speeding bullet in bed!

That's a good one! When I'd hear someone say, "It doesn't matter if you win or lose - it's how you play the game" - I would say to myself, "so what if I cheat - that's how I play the game."

Thanks for your ramblings, Bagpipes - as usual, you've articulated the way I feel...It's been 20 years since we left TWI - miss the friends - but the freedom and rich experiences of real life do make up for so much!

Cool tune, Socks! Is that yours? I like the jazzy sound of it - if I knew how to play the bass I'd be walking all over that thing. And thanks for the Fretprints website.

Very thoughtful post, Skyrider - I think you nailed it - carjacking!

Excathedra, I think you are an exceptionally strong, courageous and resilient woman!

Welcome to Grease Spot, Sportsfan !!!!!!! And I think most of us go through the same thing! Like The Highway said - give yourself time, healing and recovery are a process...Something that may be of interest to you is a thread on critical thinking http://www.greasespotcafe.com/ipb/index.ph...st&p=238498 It feels odd at first - but the more we start thinking for ourselves - like in assessing what's right and wrong doctrine - it starts feeling more natural - like an atrophied muscle coming back to life...Anyway, have fun at GSC - a great place to think out loud.

Thanks for those websites, Cynic - I'll have to check them out sometime soon. I'll save that MP3 of a reading of Jonathan Edwards' "Sinners in the Hand of an Angry God" and listen to it later this week. He's one of my favorites - I have the 2 volume set of The Works of Jonathan Edwards.

Good point – I think a lot of people struggle with the idea of what's important to God. A lawyer asked Jesus "which is the great commandment in the law?" [Matthew 22:36]. Jesus said the intent for everything in the Law and the Prophets is love for God and your neighbor [Matthew 22: 37-40]. In my opinion, that's a fairly simple standard to strive for. I think there's some truth in your saying scorekeeping is a human preoccupation – especially how we deal with fellow humans. In another instance, a lawyer asked Jesus "what shall I do to inherit eternal life?" [Luke 10:25]. Jesus responded back by asking the lawyer "what is written in the Law?" [Luke 10:26]. The lawyer gives the same answer as Jesus did in Matthew 22, saying love God and your neighbor. Jesus said he answered correctly – but the lawyer wanting to justify himself asked, "Who is my neighbor?" Then Jesus tells the parable of a certain man during his travels being stripped and beaten by robbers. Three people saw this man: a priest, a Levite and a Samaritan – but only the Samaritan stopped and helped him out [Luke 10: 30-35]. I think it's interesting that Jesus turned the lawyer's question around by asking him, "Which of these three do you think proved to be a neighbor to the man who fell into the robbers' hands?" [Luke 10:36]. Sometimes I think we decide who is our neighbor in need based on our assessment of their belief system. Instead of me trying to figure out if someone is worthy of being my neighbor, I'm to ask if I'm proving myself to be a good neighbor. Jesus' question re-focuses our attention back to a simple standard – love FOR your neighbor – and I might add – regardless of anyone's creed, seeing how Jesus picked a Samaritan to be the hero. Knowing how little the Jews thought of the Samaritans he might as well have made the hero an unbeliever! I think you're confusing the issue. In a family setting the dynamics of the family relationships should be based on love. However, in the same family – I think there should be some type of merit system for rewards and punishment [or perhaps "discipline" might be a better word]. The parents should love all the kids equally – no matter what they do. Parents usually give kids an allowance for chores done around the house – perhaps withholding the money if the job was not done right – and then giving it to them when it's corrected. Would a parent just let it slide if they found out their child shoplifted from a store? Both scenarios revolve around a merit system – in a family based on love. Thinking about your argument, that God either works on a merit basis or a love basis – I personally believe it's both – depending on what you're talking about. If you're talking about one's eternal state [where they end up for all eternity] I believe we're dealing with God's love. "God is love" as it says in I John 4:16 – love does not over step freedom of will. Jesus lamenting over Jerusalem's stubbornness in Matthew 23:37 said, "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling." [NASV] God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son – but it is up to each person to accept or reject His love. No one can coerce another into loving them. Hell may seem an odd thing to bring up in the same context as love but it appears to me that God shows His love for His creation by honoring their choice. Would He make someone go to heaven if they didn't want to? Since God is love I think He has to allow a way for those who do not wish to spend eternity with Him have a "place of their own" separated from God – from a biblical perspective that would be hell. In my opinion our eternal state [where we end up for all eternity] is not based on works - however, the quality of our eternal state is! Now we're dealing with the merit system. Ecclesiastes 3:17 says God will judge both the righteous and the wicked concerning every matter and every deed. I Corinthians 3:8 indicates those who work for God will receive their own reward according to their own labor. There are degrees of punishment in hell – also based on the merit system. Jesus speaking about deceptive, greedy, thieving religious leaders said their punishment would be more severe, Mark 12:38-40: "Beware of the scribes who like to walk around in long robes, and like respectful greetings in the market places, and chief seats in the synagogues, and places of honor at banquets, who devour widows' houses, and for appearance's sake offer long prayers; they will receive greater condemnation." [NASV]

Wow, Abigail - that's some heavy ideas!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I find that very intriguing to think about - most of my career has been in very technical type of things - and you know a lot of stuff is either not installed/assembled right or it breaks down...But I find it LOTS of FUN tapping into the critical/creative function of my brain! Yup - very intriguing quote you have there.