T-Bone

What did one cannibal say to another when he saw that he got sick from eating a Clown? That's how I feel when you mention this stuff.

Good thread, Bliss!...In my humble opinion I think TWI [whether intentional or not] just formulated these laws and rules in order to anoint themselves as an invisible priesthood. Their office of priesthood is invisible to followers – in that followers are not aware that these rites and ceremonies – rules and laws – separate them and God – like the curtain in the Temple. The TWI-priests declare and interpret the laws of their god, judge followers’ responses to these laws and grant access into a fictitious throne room for the obedient ones. …Funny – thinking about the chapter Are you limiting God in the VPW’s Blue Book. I think TWI has that down pat – limiting God that is…God can’t talk to human brain cells, huh? Guess He had no problem with Balaam’s donkey brain cells :blink: .

Someone who thought it went with their hair and eye color - your average brunette hippie.

Excellent point, Bliss! Your post hits home for me personally. After leaving TWI it was a matter of me re-aligning the object of my faith from being what I want to what does God want. I look at any disappointments as perhaps an indication of my not liking the way God worked things out…maybe a similar experience to the struggle Paul had with his thorn in the flesh. Paul prayed for God to get rid of it – God dealt with it another way by providing grace and strength to Paul so he could handle it.

Garth, I agree with your line of reasoning – I didn't think the article defined religious fanaticism in such extreme terms as bomb toting terrorists. The reason I referred to TWI in my post about the article was showing a case in point of a group where critical thinking is discouraged and so they're easily influenced by the religious fanatical leadership.

It either needs a fungicide or some TP.

Hilarious story, BowTwi …Obviously the parents didn’t see the National Geographic magazine next to the lizard – opened to the spread of the Galapagos Islands: Reptiles gone Wild.

I thought a few excerpts out of an article in a local paper might interest some folks on this thread. The part I formatted in bold red [the idea of students combining reasoned reflection with their faith] wouldn’t have fared very well on TWI-campuses. The article is Religion and Reason 101 by John I. Jenkins and Thomas Burish: http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/news/opinion/15959425.htm “What should a properly educated college graduate of the early 21st century know? A Harvard curriculum committee proposed an answer to that question recently, stating that, among other things, such a graduate should know "the role of religion in contemporary, historical, or future events -- personal, cultural, national, or international." To that end, the committee recommended that every Harvard student be required, as part of his or her general education, to take one course in an area that the committee styled "Reason and Faith."… …But universities can do more than just familiarize students with the world's religions in survey-course fashion. The rise of religious fanaticism stems in part from a failure of intellectuals within various religious traditions to engage the faithful of their traditions in serious and reasoned reflection, inquiry and dialogue. The marginalization of faith within universities contributes to this failure… …A recent survey by UCLA's Higher Education Research Institute found that 79 percent of college freshmen believe in God, and 69 percent pray and find strength, support and guidance in their religious beliefs. Religion will remain a powerful force in the personal lives of these students long after they graduate. If faith is shunned by the institutions whose role it is to foster reason and the life of the mind, if universities do not equip students to integrate their faith with the knowledge and reasoning skills they acquire, we shouldn't be surprised if unreasonable or fanatical forces gain influence in communities of faith…”

Groucho, can you remember any of your favorite BBQ joints when you lived in Texas? Little did I know in marrying Tonto that I would become a Texas-style BBQ fan! She knows her way around the BBQ-Belt! Matter of fact we got to be judges several years at an annual Central Texas BBQ Cook-Off. …As far as Texas BBQ recipes go – I can't help you there - the briskets consumed Saturday night Tonto and I purchased from Hammer's BBQ [you'll have to talk to them about the recipe ]. Since we brought two briskets - Ex10 told Tonto the briskets Mr. Ex10 purchased were going to be used for a future family gathering.

I was in the same meeting…I was standing right behind you. or Hey was that during the homo-purge?

At the Texas BBQ Bagpipes gave us some neat little M & M dudes – and while they have provided fun for hours on end, Tonto and I felt surely that they were destined for a greater purpose. The more we kept looking at them the more familiar they looked – and then it hit us! They are the manifestation of GSC Emoticons in ectoplastic form! They seem to carry such import we thought with a little help from the T & T Prop Department they pretty much speak for themselves. You may find it unnecessary to even post any text of your own since a picture can be worth a thousand words. Being how their message is visually based can lend themselves to a wide variety of interpretations. This will of course always leave you a gracious way out of an argument when using them. If another poster is offended by what they think you meant by it – you can respond, "Oh no – I meant it in a nice way." Here are some of the new emoticons with suggested applications: There’s some deep stuff on this thread…let me chew on that awhile. or This thread is life-sucking…I’m driving a stake through its heart!

...I inhaled...but I didn't listen to the album...

Arrrrrgggghhh!!!! Had an epileptic fit - flashback - flashback - Dmiller, I thought you were showing a clip from Athletes of the Spirit.

Another cool thread, Bramble! It's sort of complementary to your Faith thread. Everybody has some great stuff here! Bramble – I'm with you on "Religions, Christian and other, seem to be all over the place on human control in life." I remember back in my TWI-daze reading a teaching by Oral Roberts on the passage in Luke 8: 22-25 where Jesus stills the sea. I use to like his slant on it so much I would use it sometimes when I taught on that "law of believing" nonsense. Roberts' clincher was typical of most health-and-wealth preachers TWI[/b] – after awhile they all sound alike to me – and it's been so long ago]. Where verse 25 has the disciples asking "Who then is this, that He commands even the winds and the water, and they obey Him?" – Roberts said the disciples should have asked "what kind of faith is this that it commands even the winds and the water, and they obey it?" Do you see the difference? The text shows the disciples were fascinated…awestruck…with this amazing person in the boat with them - attributing their miraculous rescue to Him. The "law of believing" fans take the focus off Jesus Christ and zero in on figuring out how He did it…thinking that He used a Star Wars-like-Force to control the environment… And that flows right into Pond's comments – we all want to think we have such total control over our lives and really don't – and for those who do think that - it's really just an illusion…I'm the same way – sometimes it scares me when things go awry and my head is spinning – "Uh oh – sound the alarm – there's chaos in my little kingdom – who or what dares to defy my power!?!? Ummm…That is in my jurisdiction isn't it?" TempleLady – Yup, the only thing I've got a bead on is the exact second - - hold on - - wait… wait - - here it comes – NOW! LOL – I crack myself up sometimes – in looking forward to that approaching second I missed experiencing the one I was in…and now it's gone. Holy quantum heaps – I'm stuck in a temporal conundrum of Delorian/McFly proportions! But seriously – I think that's a good point you bring up – when my "control freak" breaks out of solitary confinement it seems like my goal is either to change the past or guarantee the future. Kit Sober – really enjoyed your post, "We choose our response." And "The preparation of our lives determine our ability to evaluate the situation we are in, and that we can control."… When trouble comes my way or I'm worrying about something – I'm aware of a this inner struggle sometimes. Can't pin it down – but it's conflicting thoughts like: "I've been praying and trying my best to rectify this all week – so why ain't it working out?!?!" I see that I'm initially choosing my response [prayer and appropriate action] but as the situation goes on – my "closet control freak" starts wondering why my superpowers are waning – is there kryptonite nearby? I believe God answers prayer – but sometimes get frustrated because it's not the answer I wanted. Like Paul praying to God three times about his thorn in the flesh. God answered his prayer – He didn't take it away – instead He provided grace, strength. Waysider - "The harder I work, the luckier I get." Believe it or not - I sort of see a correlation with that and Kit's thing on choosing our response and preparation. I have this dumb Forrest Gump-ish view of reality sometimes – we're all in our boats afloat this ocean. I do have some control – the speed and direction of my boat – but still there is the tides, waves, currents upon which I ride. I may even be influenced by the wake of another boat – or they from mine. [Now be forewarned - I'm going turn on my Televangelist Machine] "So if you want to have greater influence on people and more power in your life – then as Richard Dryfus once said, 'I think you're gonna need a bigger boat.'" …Speaking of boats and control – that reminds me of James 3 about taming the tongue – verse 4 likens the tongue to a small rudder that controls a big ship – the tongue is small, yes – but has a big influence in your life. I just think about the good or bad things I've said to people, times I should have kept my mouth shut, times I should have spoken up, times that I've gone overboard in a gripe session…Uh oh – another TWI flashback – I remember someone getting our whole branch into the "power of the tongue nonsense" – making all kinds of positive confessions to alter reality, to get what you want…Again – there's religion for yah – "let's see what I can do with this trade secret." Oakspear – "What we control and what we don't changes constantly. Sometimes we make decisions that down the road result in unpleasant consequences: we don't always see the connection." Ain't that the truth! I tell yah – do you know what a revelation it was to me leaving behind TWI's law-of-believing-crap and starting to see there was some kind of relationship between what I actually DO with reality and what happens in reality! Amazing. DrtDzn - "Now it may be wise to plan and set objectives and all that, but it will never eliminate the unexpected because we are only finite." …I wonder about God creating us in His own image and likeness. Back in Genesis He told them everything in the world was theirs and to rule over it [Genesis 1:28]. Maybe it's in our nature - this desire to control. Abigail – "…just when you think you have your goals and plan all laid out and things are running smoothly, life has a way of pulling the rug out from underneath you. I have to believe there is a bigger plan with a better goal and that the "rug pulling" is a part of that."…Great thought – I need to remind myself of that more often! Dancing – "I think there is a great fear of lost control. Rather then fear it, investigate it."…Wow – that's a great key! There's a lot to that. I remember the fears my wife and I had when our son went touring about Europe with a friend. What will he do about this or that? What if this or that happens? As we'd talk about it we'd realize some of that was the old thing of parents sensing a loss of control, of being there to help in a pinch.

...Or your dog is thinking, "Where did you learn to sweep, Sushi? Would you just give me that broom - I'll show you how it's done!"....I know - that's a little ridiculous - your dog might not even know your GSC name is Sushi.

He inspired a lot of people to take dance lessons.

The modern world marveled at edible underwear – yet the Egyptians came up with edible buildings centuries ago! Still not impressed? Well think about it – many of the food pyramids they built are still standing – man, they had that embalming stuff down pat!... Of course the Sphinx’s face is sort of eaten away…which is to be expected from the occasional roaming nomad who forgets to pack a lunch.

Thanks for the invite, Ala… Gosh – it's been so long since I jammed with anybody…well – if you count the jammin' my son and I do once and awhile – that may count for some extra credit…At least qualify me to be a band roadie…Bet I can still string a neat line of chairs – or amps… That's a beautiful rendition of the Beatles' tune, Socks. Thanks – ya'll sound great! Chas – that is a gorgeous guitar – love that color!

Funny, Tom !! Interesting to note the opponents are equally matched - the Hunter has a double barrel shotgun - the Duck has a double barrel shotgun - the Decoy has a double barrel chest.

Great idea for a thread, Oakspear! And I agree with you on the main point of GSC is to turn a critical eye on TWI – for the very simple reason you stated – relevancy. In my opinion, there is something many of us who left TWI had in common while we were in TWI – a weakness of critical thinking skills. When some people hear "critical thinking" they may assume that's all about looking for what's wrong with something. They way I understand it - critical thinking is about analyzing something, trying to identify all the parts – what's good and bad [even defining what our standard is to determine those aspects], what's indefinite, what's logical/illogical, whether or not it's consistent with the whole framework of thought. It's trying to find out assumptions behind an idea or trying to articulate the originating viewpoint of a belief or considering implications or associated ideas. And really to be honest - it's even turning a critical eye on our own viewpoint - how we're looking at all the information - what are our assumptions, our framework of thought, what "filters" are on our mind's eye. No one can do all of that perfectly or consistently of course – but critical thinking is giving it your best shot. For me - critical thinking is more about discovery than debate. More a matter of wanting to understand something rather than wanting to prove I'm right - that's what it is ideally - but I know on occasion we all retreat into our comfortable viewpoint zone - then it becomes more of an argument than a discussion. Whenever we get into TWI doctrines and practices on GSC I like it for the exercise of everyone's critical thinking skills. Sort of like what people have to do with physical therapy to regain their strength back – or what healthy people do to maintain strength. Back in my TWI-daze it was all about absorbing their stuff – never about analyzing it. Any "thinking" I did on my part usually re-enforced what they taught. One of VPW's greatest sedatives to student's brains was his old one liner, "You can't go beyond what you're taught" or as WordWolf defined it "intellectual hobbling." After leaving TWI I'm very reluctant to buy into any pet phrase or the-secret-of-the-universe-formula. Maybe all I've figured out since coming to GSC is that you can't go beyond your viewpoint – LOL . But in saying that I realize the quantum leaps I've made in some areas of my belief system – since I left TWI. I'm not saying I've grown in knowledge – like TWI's typical know-it-all-Bible-jock. Maybe it's more like expanding my viewpoint – perhaps being intellectually humble enough to realize I ain't figured it all out and it's okay to really consider the ideas of someone else's viewpoint.

Rhino came up with these two gems after hearing us talk about the great fellowship we had at the Texas BBQ. "TWIG without TWI ....G that sounds great or TWIGS without TWI = GS"

Holy guacamole, Rhino !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I love it!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't know which one I like more. Thanks – they're both GSC gems in my book! Yes, Excathedra – truly the man has a gift! And I am truly humbled in all this. Remember – the Lord will always tell you first – but if you can't hear Him over the roar of everyone smacking their lips on some good BBQ – you're gonna be hearing from heaven another way . You all have no idea how apprehensive I was of attending this BBQ. But lo and behold from the moment my feet crossed the threshold of Mr. & Mrs. Ex10's lovely home – my socially inept heart was put at ease - what incredible hosts! I kept trying to figure out exactly what I was experiencing. I've had these feelings before – couldn't place it – yet kept running it through this massive filing system of memories – and finally just accepted it as some kind of wonderful composite of every great fellowship I ever experienced. Like some Director's Cut – and my Lord was the director and He cut out all the bad stuff of TWI! No one had an agenda. No one was on an ego trip. No one had enough napkins. …Geez – it was like being at some Hollywood gala – and celebrities kept calling in – sending their love and best wishes. And Krysilis, we were all just floored over the gourmet caramel apples you sent! Thanks! Dooj - your minestrone was exquisite - and my vote goes to the Lemon Cheesecake. Tom Strange - I wish I knew you way back when, brother! I think I would have learned a thing or two about walking by the Spirit - and probably would have left TWI a whole lot sooner!!!!!!!!!!!! Bagpipes, I've always enjoyed your posts - meeting you in person was like meeting an old friend. Pawtucket, what have you done?!?! I'll tell yah my take on it - you've got some kind of amazing/healing/ministry thing happening with Grease Spot Café. I think it is one of the least restrictive environments for the Spirit of God to work in people's lives - and in such intricate, subtle ways. ...Holy cow! I wrote all the above last night right after we got home [my last edit time was about 11:08 PM] - I was wired and tired and grinning like a fool [ooops - gonna break into a Joan Osborn tune]. I wish the BBQ would have lasted longer. And I don't mean so I could have eaten more - but to get to visit more with TempleLady, Lori, George St. George and the Countess, Rich and Crispy, Mr. & Mrs. Rush7.

Monkey see... monkey doo.

I experienced a lot of kindness during TWI-years with the many wonderful people that would cross my path. However it did seem like it became more of a fleeting virtue as time went on…Or maybe it was because The Way had a way of getting in the way of kindness. I was thinking about WordWolf's describing the governing factor behind our kindness: It's a sad thing isn't it – when an organization grows on you…literally…like an infection…to stifle any sympathetic expression…Maybe getting into TWI it was mostly about what I can do to help people – but slowly - however an organization worked its mojo on my service ethic – it mutated into what can I do to help TWI…But tell yah what – maybe that's why anytime I experienced kindness from another TWIt – it was SUCH A BREATH of FRESH AIR!

RumRunner - - that is a cool name and where you got it from is interesting too – I looked up Robert Hunter – what impressed me was finding out he was into bluegrass music in the early 60s playing the mandolin and upright bass. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Hunter_(lyricist) And on a personal note my grandpa [upon who's steps I'm standing in my avatar] was a fisherman by trade and during prohibition would ship mash from Canada. Waysider, thanks for bringing in a taste of Firesign Theater! I remember discussions with my high school buddies about this comedy troupe – along with other heady discussions like - if you could only have five albums on a deserted island what would they be? And interesting to read in the Wikipedia link below that some admirers referred to them as the Beatles of comedy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firesign_Theatre and here's an interesting write-up of them by Leonard Pierce http://www.thehighhat.com/PopsClicks/004/f...gn_theatre.html