T-Bone

huh...uhm...errrr...oh yeah - that's it - yes that's definitely it - they belong in a museum funny you should say cult symbols ... I actually posted this staged picture on Grease Spot a few years ago...but recently was inspired to re-post the picture here along with a text explaining what the objects represented to me after reading Penworks' paper on cult symbols on her Undertow thread - see here and here ...and actually in the sequence of events I kinda jumped around in the process: 1. first I read Penworks' paper on the power of cult symbols 2. thought about it - did some internet searches on symbolism...got excited from what I learned from Penworks' paper and online - a lot of how I think is visually based anyway - I often have to doodle out a problem when I'm thinking about it - even if it's "philosophical" in nature 3. started drafting a reply to Penworks 4. while drafting a reply, my old picture of Inside the Corps Mind kept popping up in my head. 5. saved a draft of my reply. 6. switched gears to elaborating on the rich symbolism of my picture. Gave that a lot of thought...I really had fun with it! 7. posted picture and explanatory notes here. 8. then went back to proofing my draft for Penworks' thread and 9. posted my reply there. ...now you know the rest of the story.

You can tell Max there's a thread that talks about places like this

What I find amusing is that wierwille used to go on and on about “the word” having a mathematical exactness and scientific precision - and he was probably inspired to think that from plagiarizing a lot of Bullinger - a flat-earther !!!! I mean come on - The spherical earth was mentioned as far back as the ancient Greeks!

Guess I never got it through my thick skull all that stuff is passé

Thanks for the link, Penworks that is a very engrossing paper you wrote; I think you still have an overstuffed quiver of arrows to arm folks against harmful cults – if we were talking a superhero franchise your Undertow book is like an origin story, only the beginning – so hopefully more books are in the works . Here’s a few of the things your paper got me thinking about...You wrote: “…cult leaders use symbols to control followers and how we can break the power of those symbols. As an example, I’ll use The Way International,™ the fundamentalist cult I escaped in 1987. High-control groups like The Way use insignias, catch-phrases, and other imagery to recruit, manipulate, and retain believers. These emotionally charged symbols contribute to how hard it is for followers to leave the cults that captured them. Understanding what a cult’s symbols mean, and the ways they affect followers, can contribute to cult recovery.” I’ve never really given much thought to the power of symbolism – so your paper inspired me to look further into it. One thing I found was an article titled “Symbols are short cuts for our brain” which starts off “We are surrounded by symbols, they are woven into society so inextricably that we don’t even notice them. And yet everyday we see them, understand them and they guide our behaviour. Tricky little devils. The Changing Minds Organisation explains, “Symbols are communications that have specific meaning. Usually visual, symbols act as communication short-cuts that convey one or more messages that have been previously learned by both the sender and the recipient.” (from Thoughts drawn out website – symbols are short cuts for our brains ) You talked about traditional religions use of symbols compared to what cults use – like the cross, reminding Christians of Jesus’ sacrificial death. I remember one TWI leader explaining why the ministry doesn’t have any crucifixes around – he said the cross focused on the means of Jesus’ death and went on to ridicule that notion by saying what if he was killed by a machine gun – would everyone wear a little golden machine gun around their neck? Thinking back on that now is a real mindblower of how cults can treacherously subvert traditional symbols – because it ignores and minimizes the meaning of his death. Another point you made resonated profoundly with me. You wrote: “Emotions and creativity were abused. Emotions were constricted and creativity was enlisted for propaganda. Emotional and sexual abuse often proliferated because we were told our feelings did not matter and could not be trusted; only The Word mattered.” I’ve shared this on Grease Spot elsewhere - before I went into the way corps I was fairly involved with a band made up of way believers – we wrote most of our own songs, made cassette tapes and played at ministry coffee houses. Fast forward to when I was in residence at Rome City and allowed to pick up my instruments again. I submitted for approval a song to the assistant way corps coordinator that I hoped our in-residence band could perform in the chapel. Admittedly my song was already chock-full of TWI-propaganda – but the assistant corps coordinator with a knack for moving the goalpost critiqued my song in front of the rest of the band all the verses that needed revising – I guess it wasn’t propaganda-enough for him... I was so flabbergasted and never did comply and so I dropped the whole thing...Oh well… but ultimately this incident led to their loss and my gain. I never attempted to write another song promoting TWI’s ideology. I think the incident caused one of the biggest rifts in my TWI-belief system…perhaps the beginning of the end to cult tyranny in my life. If it was made into a cheesy music video – it would be like one of those stories about a musician who refused to sellout to commercialism.

This picture is titled Inside the Corps Mind Admittedly this is one atrocious way-over-the-top pictorial of my way corps experience. If I may elaborate on a few points of interest: I put a label on the PFAL book - it's kinda hard to read in the picture - but it says “VP said it, I believe it, that settles it” – wierwille had made reference to a Christian cliché “God said it, I believe it, that settles it for me” but he switched it around from being a matter of one’s personal faith to wierwille’s absolutism, he rephrased it to “God said it, that settles it, by God’s mercy and grace may I believe it”. Since wierwille had the self-appointed unique position of being the best interpreter of the Bible, this was another sublime way he practiced the unlimited centralized authority and absolute sovereignty of a dictator. My label “VP said it, I believe it, that settles it” represents how what wierwille said became almost like an a priori assumption to my personal faith. …Inside the skull is the orange Power For Abundant Living book, The Way Living in Love book promoting the myth of wierwille and the green PFAL sign-up card - these three items representing the core curriculum of the way corps training program – stuff considered essential to work in the field – a thorough knowledge of the PFAL material, a belief in the greatness of wierwille and good sales skills to promote TWI’s products and services…In the lower right corner the text “the mind is a terrible thing” is a parody from a 1977 ad slogan "a mind is a terrible thing to waste" - my parody is a way of criticizing the mindless absorption of information that cults encourage. You see that the skull has impeccable teeth – one of the good things from way corps training was the stress on good oral hygiene like brushing thoroughly after each meal… and don’t forget flossing! …Also notice the way corps coffee mug – is it half full or half empty? It doesn’t matter…There you have it ladies and gentlemen another post encapsulating TWI memories – good, bad and indifferent.

With you mentioning that you and your wife were considering going back and then later getting the boot in 2001 – for some reason that made me think of a quote from the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey HAL 9000: I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.

Thanks for your help - from your first quote - I new it was a silly movie but couldn't fine tune it until you jogged my memory of Brian always being mistaken for the Messiah. You are correct on High Anxiety - it's your turn...the still shot is of Nurse Diesel (love that name) kneeling so she can get a straight shot at spanking Harvey Korman.

In 1675, in a letter to his rival Robert Hooke, Isaac Newton wrote “If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants”…in 2021 a verbose post tried to reference that by gravitating towards the optics of what the sum of TWI-offshoots might add up to: If they have seen further into the darkness, it is by standing on the shoulders of sycophants who have had their heads up wierwille’s a$$.

yeah - I knew that - I was trying to be funny, my "first thought" was "blessed are the grease spotters" - but figured I was pushing the envelope of my comedic license (which was suspended in 2016)... anyway - here's what's next...how about something a little kinky

No Ben-There Dunn-That... it’s Monty Python’s Life of Brian did he say blessed are the cheese makers or was it blessed are the grease makers?

Thanks Penworks – that’s a great article by Langone. Funny you should post that today (maybe it’s got something to do with synchronicity - I don’t know ) last night Tonto and I started watching a six-part documentary on HBO called Q: Into the Storm

well...you're close it's Long Distance Guy just kidding You got it George ! that's probably the most uncomfortable scene to watch

alllllllrighty then... now relax and say "ah"

must be a thread of a tangled web "Oh, what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive”

cool stuff Rocky - thanks for the links...the Sunlight Foundation page looked very interesting

Yeah Grace, sometimes I wonder if the top leadership of The Way International like being “under the radar” (not very well known) to avoid unnecessary attention – I know they’re probably considered small potatoes compared to bigger destructive cults like Scientology - but maybe they like it that way…being more in the public eye would leave them open to public scrutiny, criticism…and who knows, maybe even widespread demands for accountability… I wonder how many TWI-followers would still trust TWI-leadership if they found out even just a smidgen of the sexual abuse that’s been going on – and covered up for a very long time… How would the general TWI-public react to finding out that wierwille, Craig and other TWI-leadership were/are sexual predators? Would there be a public outrage over the fact that all this has been covered up for YEARS ? What would be left of TWI’s supposed reputation as a biblical research, teaching and fellowship ministry? And who knows how much would even change if the dark underbelly of the beast was exposed to daylight…I read about another more recent issue with the leader of the Catholic church in England and Wales in a November 2020 article of The Guardian (the link is below...when I read stuff like this I’m just appalled at any church’s efforts toward “customer retention” and cash inflow taking precedence over altruistic concerns for the well-being of their own followers…did Jesus Christ mean for leaders of the faith to conquer and exploit the flock? I believe he said something along the lines of he came not to be served but to serve Mark 10:39-45 )…the following are just a few excerpts from The Guardian article : “Pope Francis asked Cardinal Vincent Nichols, the leader of the Catholic church in England and Wales, to stay in his post, despite a damning report that criticised his leadership and concluded that the church repeatedly prioritised its reputation over the welfare of child sex abuse victims… …The 162-page report said “the church’s neglect of the physical, emotional and spiritual wellbeing of children and young people in favour of protecting its reputation was in conflict with its mission of love and care for the innocent and vulnerable.”… …Between 1970 and 2015, the church in England and Wales received more than 900 complaints involving more than 3,000 instances of child sexual abuse, made against more than 900 individuals, including priests, monks and volunteers… …When complaints were made, the church invariably failed to support victims and survivors but took action to protect alleged perpetrators by moving them to a different parish. “Child sexual abuse,” the report says, “was swept under the carpet.”… …Prof Alexis Jay, the chair of the inquiry, said: “For decades, the Catholic church’s failure to tackle child sexual abuse consigned many more children to the same fate. It is clear that the church’s reputation was valued above the welfare of victims, with allegations ignored and perpetrators protected. Even today, the responses of the Holy See appear at odds with the pope’s promise to take action on this hugely important problem.” end of excerpts Guardian article – Catholic Church sweeps sex abuse under carpet and related to above article that mentions a 162 page report done by the IICSA the following link gives some info about them about the report by the Inquiry Into Child Sexual Abuse that is referenced in the article

Yes !!!! A case in point is the riveting film Spotlight - IMDB's brief description of it - "The true story of how the Boston Globe uncovered the massive scandal of child molestation and cover-up within the local Catholic Archdiocese, shaking the entire Catholic Church to its core."

Rocky, that is such a heart-wrenching article – and after reading it, I thought of a whole other aspect on the sexual culture and abuse in The Way. I realized my previous post over double standards and hypocrisy just scratched the surface. While reading that article – a thought occurred to me a couple of times. How could some TWI-leaders get that fvcked up? I think it comes down to systemic problems inherent in TWI. I believe one of the biggest systemic problems is the consequence of having an authoritarian pyramid structure with absolute power and influence being at the top – a position occupied by a sexual predator. The next step down the pyramid hierarchy of status and authority is comprised of the way corps. Now the way corps program was wierwille’s baby – he created it and was responsible for it. And one of the most subliminal methods of “teaching” the way corps was in the way he modeled what the ideal spiritual man or woman should be like in attitudes, behavior, etc. I’ve mentioned the pajama party my first year of in-residence way corps training several times on Grease Spot – so I won’t reiterate all the disgusting and offensive details again (I’ve left a few links below of a thread where I’ve discussed it at length). One detail has always stuck with me - the far-reaching ramifications of some of the crazy things wierwille said in trying to alleviate the shock and horror that was palpable in the room after he showed the porn video: “I’ve so renewed my mind that stuff like this doesn’t bother me…Unto the pure all things are pure…Anything done in the love of God is okay…If you’re going to help people in counseling and to get healed you can’t be shocked by anything.” For me, being raised a good Catholic boy with a sensitive conscience – I simply repressed the memory of that night – maybe figuring that it all was way beyond my current level of spiritual growth – I don’t know. Anyway, I wasn’t that impressed or concerned with how wierwille suggested we handle counseling situations. Even before I went in the corps, a TWI-clergy guy introduced me to the work of a Christian counselor Jay Adams and I got into some other non-Way counselors like Larry Crabb. These authors seemed to know what they were talking about and it was straight-forward stuff right out of the Bible without twisting words, concepts and no salacious applications - stuff I could wrap my mind around - not like wierwille's approach - his was too...too...too...out there ...after we were out of in-residence training – I’d occasionally have some vague dissenting thought like “maybe wierwille had no business teaching about counseling”. Later that same year, still brooding over “passing of the patriarch” – I was having even more unsettling thoughts – like "maybe we were all just playing church." Our moral conscience is such a valuable and sometimes precarious thing. I think of I Corinthians 15: 33 Do not be misled: Bad company corrupts good character. I’m glad I left when I did – I probably dodged a huge bullet by getting out of The Way. Circling back to a question I asked earlier - how could some TWI-leaders get that fvcked up? Maybe some guys were already predisposed toward licentiousness. And being in the way corps – wierwille’s baby - was that a way to validate throwing off sexual restraints? Don't know...just wondering. I’m not saying all TWI-leaders are fvcked up in that way. But on the other hand, if way corps have stuck around for a really long time and are well aware of the bad $hi+ perpetrated by the dark underbelly of the beast (TWI) and they still just look the other way, while they put together another teaching on Christians should be prosperous – that’s also kinda fvcked up in my book too. == == == == = Family Corps in my early 30s the conscience can be cauterized Hoe TWI-leaders model "The Word"

A long time ago on a calendar far, far away… A False Hope It is a period of civil unrest. An unscrupulous pastor striking it rich from plagiarism has won some converts by hijacking many of them from organized religion and the Jesus Movement. During battles to control his own followers certain brave souls had managed to break open the lock-box of dirty secrets as well as reveal the cult leader’s ultimate weapon, delusions of grandeur with enough power to destroy one’s grip on reality. Pursued by ridiculous threats of oblivion and devil possession, rebel ex-followers established cyber-bases where others could download the nefarious plans from the lock-box and shred them with the light-of-day-saber. Stay tuned for the next exciting episode The Farce Awakens: The Rise of Offshoots. also some propaganda messages were retrieved by the rebels... …pay attention for an important message to nurses and housewives in this first episode: PFAL 1967 documentary PFAL segment 03 1977 the Changed video

from what I'm reading online it sounds like it will be a novel . comicbook website: Avengers films reimagined as Shakespeare plays

I think your right...I was trying to be cute...guess I couldn't see the justifieth for the avengeth...(sorry - still trying to be funny) The Star Wars adaptation sounds interesting too...I never heard of it before.

Has anyone else seen this ? “The Avengers will be visiting Olde England in a new adaptation that will see the films turned into Shakespearean plays using the Bard's famous format…” This sounds like something right up WordWolf’s alee. Here’s a few more excerpts from the Screen Rant article (link is below): “Author Ian Doescher is adapting all four of the Avengers films into Shakespearean plays for Quirk Books. The adaptations will include the authentic meter, verse, and rhyme of the plays and incorporate stage directions and Marvel easter eggs. The publisher promises that the adaptations will be "fully faithful" to the films and feature all the of the fans' "favorite scenes, characters, and lines" with an Olde English twist. William Shakespeare's The Avengers: The Complete Works will be available this September… …At first glance, these adaptations sound absolutely bonkers, but author Doescher has done this kind of thing before. He famously published William Shakespeare's Star Wars, initially adapting the original three films. Doescher has also adapted other films into Shakespeare plays, including Mean Girls and Back to the Future, titled Much Ado About Mean Girls and Get Thee...Back to the Future! respectively. The Star Wars adaptation, for which he eventually adapted all nine films, was even performed live over Zoom in honor of Star Wars Day on May 4…” I enjoy remakes and adaptations as almost an art form all its own. So I’m looking forward to those who avengeth the fans of the Avengers and Shakespeare. (hmmm... don’t know if I’ve got that right...if “avengeth” is to inflict harm in return for an injury or wrong done to oneself or another then maybe I should have said “those who avengeth the critics of the Avengers and Shakespeare.”…oh I don’t know... maybe WordWolf can resolve the issue ) Screen Rant – Avengers getting a Shakespeare adaptation Posting is such sweet sorrow exeunt Thelonious Hyphen Bone

I saw that! Is it "Midnight Run" ?

Engine, that's a great post! My favorite lines: "Another mutiny inside a mutiny like the little Russian dolls." That is so funny! Great mind pictures…Not exactly Ezekiel’s wheel within a wheel…but more like wierwille’s spiel within a spiel…each mutineer tries to use some form of wierwille’s bull$hit to out-wierwille the other mutineer. "He's spoken of in the banned books section of the Twit archives: Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John." I love that! I can almost imagine a Mad Magazine ad “Tired of the same old forbidden books of the four Gospels? Try the new and improved apocryphal book of “The Way Living in Love”.