pond

This is a watershed case no doubt. Everyone who is anyone is crossing the t's and dotting the I's , for now anyways. This will force change, regardless of the outcome of the trial. very interesting indeed. In an interview I heard a guy who lost to the tune of over 138 thousand say he doesnt believe that he "didnt know" the financial situation because "Every hog knows all the piglets in the farmyard".. haha , I agree.

I went to my first ROA just a few weeks after taking the class. I was excited and happy to see some of the folks I had met in the class , I would ask "how are you?" and the reply was often "As HE is". I spent a few days wondering who "he" was then is got the concept, that many believed they where christ in the flesh , really. Have you looked at the life ,particulary the "ministry",of Jesus Christ? it was only about 3years before he was murdered and most of it was like the worst horror story you could think of, every kind of betrayal, hardship, temptations , work, all kind of horrid experiences a person could face in life and then He died. 3 years of living hell really, ok ok through in He accomplished some healing that He was seldom credited with and taught lessons no one really wanted to hear, not to metion problems with His own family and those He employed. really it reads like a horror story. "As He is " you say today I would say um no thanks. I do not think His life on earth was noble or full of honor . it was miserable, once He declared His mission. I think He did that so we do not have to be miserable anymore. But I often still am anyway. life is hard, and I have had to many lessons . I wish my lessons only lasted three years in life. and Jesus christ never sinned , I have paid a price for my sins and bad choices not like HIM at all. I do not live "As He is" and He may have promised to send a comfort , to help me. that tells me life is still going to have trouble. so we look to death( or the gathering) for the great HOPE of better days? till then ex is right.

A abortion or a D/C as it has been titled in the past would open up much thought about lawsuits and malpractice. Abortion if made illegal would still be performed it would indeed be classified as another procedure , today a Dr. is in much more jeopardy by insurance premiums if consenting to such practice. In times past patients did not sue as they do today , we have many more checks and balance on the medical community, the insurance on such a dr. who would take the chance would be outrageous, hence fewer being done by a professional who care about the wellness of his entire practice. hence the procedure would only be affordable by the very wealthy or done by others, less than professional people putting the safety of mother and fetus at risk of harm. these are huge considerations concerning abortion and the law.

my husband showed me how to do this.

Mark malpractice insurance premiums . Payment is not just in terms of who paid for what, the health crisis is what it is due to malpractice and the cost of "being a dr." in America. ob/gyn is one of the very highest in our nation. Without the cooperation of major medical few would be able to afford to stay in practice . your right tho a friend who is now 64 had an abortion over 40 years ago and it was considered a D/C on the paper work. that is what can happen if it is reversed.

Mark I think you may have to consider another fact in your research. payment. abortion is a legal procedure now and can and often is paid for by the Dept of Social Services(medicaid) , or private insurance. abortions are not cheap. without the endorsement of insurance, many providers will opt out. The horror storys of botched procedures and "back alley" abortionists are a direct result of this fact. A "good" Dr. will not take a chance on losing his license , without the support of the insurance he/she carrys. malpractice given what it is for ob/gyn (the highest rate ) is why many very good drs have left or will not carry the field of practice. Who would take cash payment today? this isnt the thirties when Drs could and did get away with God like performance with little or no accoutability.

I have children who are in their twenties and also some teens left. Evan is right about the "united front" of parents, in a perfect world all parents would be able to have communication that works best for everyone. BUT It isnt as easy when your divorced or the marriaged is stressed in some manner, and communication is strained within the marriage. I just went through this in my own life concerning TWI and other organizations I exposed my children to. IT is difficult to explain the past that I at times still do not always get the why or have a solid answer . My ex's (yes more than one ) just leave one another alone on choices we made good or bad. do not go to a place of personal attack or justification of your own personal choice. who knows someone you or her may change your mind radically some day and have to be sorry for the words said about another you and/or certainly they love. Teens will pit you against one another, as EVan implied. they run the world ya know and have all the answers on how it should be anyway lol! We frankly do not have conversations about the other at their expense. If they question what the other parents has done or is doing I say "Sounds like your really confused on why they would do or say such a thing (stay engaged) maybe you can ask (spouse) how they feel about it now. If you differ (and my ex's and I do differ , we did get divorced for reasons..) I say this is my thoughts on the subject: other people mom, dad may believe or feel differently about the subject . The child needs to work out the questions with them on the subject and reach their own thoughts concerning the subject. Respect the other parent as the childrens parent even if you feel they are WRONG . Of course not in the case of abuse, but as far as what religous choices you children are exposed to, both parents can and will have a say in the matter. The kids will reach their own choice as well. and all may be very different from the other! I know this is hard to believe when your used to having all the kids at home and the family life is encased in co-dependency but trust me they to grow up to be free thinking adults one day. Teens are amazing, they really do think and I admire their ability to sort through their own life with clarity and deep thoughtfulness , as much at it may seem they HAATE you , they really do not . They know better than you when they are not able to handle the decisions before them and spend YEARS putting out feelers of just how do I become a real adult in diguise of knowing it all . haha Then one day they do know and then they are gone ,grown up and wonderful people who love you forever. As far as your own feelings Shellon is RIGHT be honest. You can not get away with anything with young adults and teens they do stay up at night and think of ways to freak you out !!! please God the memories and still at times with my youngest the reality of just how testy this time can be for parents. So be honest, work on your own position to be strong enough to be sure and then you will know the answer to any question . children/teens do not need huge history they tend to live in the current drama of that day , oh God my hair is messed up type of panick is far more important than whether Jesus is God at this point! You said you want to look at this from their point of view... um how do I say this ? Are you their friend looking for companionship and support for your position or choice? or are you an adult making solid good choices for your own life? Parents need to remember their ROLE in their childrens life, and even if they are six foot tall and can drive and look and talk like a grown up they are NOT, and still need you to be the GROWN up who can help them, not just another searching person struggling with why and just what life is. they have enough peers, they need adults and grown up people to teach them how to make good choices for their own life by example. if you ever do want them to seek Jesus Christ as LORD, then take you own self off the throne God gave to only HIM in life. Mom or dad are not the answer to life and what it is all about is Jesus Christ . He is a personal Saviour, and God wants a relationship with EACH of His children. That means a parent must teach a teen/child they do not have all the answers, but God does.

wow what a ? what good did the way ministry do for me? twenty years after being marked and avoided it still is truth. the word of God is true. how I learned this as a fact of life was NOT through classes or sermons. although at the time I couldnt live without. them. it was by being truthful one day, and going on regardless of what a leader said. God stood by me. Still does I think. I learned and believe we are in a battle for life. does it do me any good? I do not know because it is so heavy in my life style now. I believe I live within a world full of evil and good and choices. God loves me. and I have no clue how to live without him anymore. What good does it do me? I cant even answer that question anymore. it felt good when I had my friends and peers to 'fellowship with , now few and far between share my spiritual side of inner thought. christians frighten me the most. I trust very little only God and day by day . I do say what if I never knew what I know or is it just I believe it and am in denial ? Is it a good thing I still pray God please help me ? I do not know but it is what twi did for me. I do wonder but here I sit twenty years after leaving and still trying to understand God and life. I have no idea how peo0ple without this influence live . I never could shake the idea that God first is a life style. so I do not know if it would be better without it or not. and no my life has not always been "good". I have had moments of being clear but for the most part I go back to what I learned as truth that God almighty will just have to save me once again. my son says I have a crutch. maybe so but today that crutch has been the only good thing in my life many many times.

she should have given the baby up for adoption. today at four,the state should take the baby away and find a home that is honest and loving. She thinks the dr. who messed up the abortion owes her ? she owes that kid the right to a life without this on her head and heart. What can she say "oh I was young and stupid and made a mistake? ok even if the kid can handle that with the death of her twin, mom has made it even worse by still not accepting responsibility for this child by asking the dr. to pay for her . so give the witch the money for the botched abortion and take the baby away and tell her live with her own dam self and leave those who survive her alone.

so all these holy spirits are with God/ isnt that what the churches teach? think about it if the holy spirit of us is all alive and somewhere In abeyance (what the heck is that?) couldnt they get goovy and somhow vist a person here on earth? not so much the familiar spirits saul saw remember that teaching about speaking to the dead they were evil spirits remember? familiar spirits vpw called them. and from satan . ok all these holy spirits are canned up till the return somwhere just binding time. at least it is an answer thanks for responding. I do not pretend to know but somhow god doesnt seem that stupid and wastefull of his works.

thanks ex. Iwould think all these years spent, bible scholors would have some answer for the question of just where does the holy spirit within stays till the Return of christ and he gathers us . all the information and knowledge we think we got in the classes I do not rememner any one saying where does that go hmm? think about it we turn to dust and the spirit within just what where does it go ? anyone? ok so no evil spirits hang out neccesarily ??? but how about the one we have that is losing its home (body)

When I was a kid I used to play hide and seek in the grave yard in my neighborhood. You know I may get into trouble with this but a relative moved in front of a grave yard, when you look out her kitchen window you see the headstones and the burials. I got to tell ya she is obessed with death. talks about dead people alot, I have shouted at her I could care less about the dead people she wants to know about . They go to alot of funerals. her husband is in a political position and it affords them to go to people they have never met furnerals. ALOT??? at least once or twice a week!! I do not get it : I do not want to go to funerals of people I knew and have not seen in years and barely make it to those I knew well.. me. eeek I hate the idea . she talks ALOT about people who have been dead for years or she or I have never met.. I am uncomofrtable with this . I do think it is spiritual. I have a question about spirits in grave yards tho.. if it is about going back to dust after death our body just turns into worms So where is this eternal spirit we have in us? The spirit we get as the "gift that affords us eternal life? the body I understand can be healed put back together etc by Jesus christ but the spirit within that we die with where does that go till Jesus christ calls the believers together at the end of the world? as we know it. the RC church teaches about a place that it stays I forgot the name of it well at least they have a place for the spirits to go till we get judged. Is it pergotory? does what we where taught about the christ in us story just hover above the dirt and worms till the return? anyone know? I honesty would like to know

yeah I know. I have a dictaor in my family. She decides for everyone and if somone disagree's or wants a different plan she plays a victim. One year she cursed how she has to do all the shopping and cooking and everything poor victim. I was so happy and said we should do it at my house! save her frail bitch. guess what it was at her house but she wanted everyone to bring a dish. calls up everyone and makes plans and then tells YOU how it will be. and I played and said um no cause you decide what where how so have at it. amI mean? oh families . no words can describe. just why. and yes I still cry and I still get hurt and it seems to just get worse every year. and we all live close by.

The thing that frightens me about the RC church is the praying to the saints . I wonder if it is a type of idol worship, and other "gods". As far as the trinity goes, I have never been instructed about what the trinity is so I can not say it is right or wrong. when I was in twi I said it was wrong to some strict catholic friends who are now clergy in twi. funny isnt it? Jesus isnt god but again I do not know what the RC teaches about who Jesus is enough to comment on how I think about what they teach. As far as what mark is calling works. well all groups have "woks" they encourage their followers to do. all of them.. think about it. give money, buy our tapes listen to our advise, get involed in some way or another to belong.. do what we do to worship the LORD... if I break it down it is all "works" of some sort. and the purpose is to help people find a life winthin a spirital, sense a sense of belonging and community and purpose. can it be wrong? I do not think all people enjoy what one group does... that is why it is many memebers of the body of christ. who is to say what is the wrong part? As far as christ like life well honestly the chronicle of the man Jesus christ is indeed quite miserable and deadly.. not one anyone with a any sense of happiness or peace.would lke to live. So we think He is what we should be like? God calls him the ONLY Saviour the ONLY Begotten... honestly no one can be HIm or "like" him. illusions of who somone is or isnt or looks like runs wild in our culture, the bible speaks of fools who believe them.

check out the revised rules for masturbation. lol if your over 65, and never until you ejeculate. you must ONLY think of jesus during masturbation , and it must be a natural event like a full bladder or "the morning sun erection". (??) haha ok BUT if you do accidently "spill your seed" you must have a tupperware bowl ready(approved and prayed for by the pastor) and give it to the secretary "within an hour of the accident" lol ok then she will put it in to a larger vat and it will be used in the parlor for skin cream.... lol violation is scary, the bible says you will die if your seed is spilled. then the dandy tampon rule because satan made them .. who are these people? lol

Mom says that if she had known the disabilities of her daughtershe would have aborted. blind deaf physicly and mentaly disabled many of these can not be forcast in ultra sounds . how is the doctor to know what and how many disabilities a child will or will not have? money might help the situation. It takes a long time to come to terms with these type of circumstances and a better life style may help. I think they have to prove the dr. knew what condition the child would be in. that is impossible. but then again the odds are they did malpractice in not telling them what could be happening to the fetus, due to the rubella. We have no garuntee's in children BUT I would also like to know what chances my baby would have when pregnate with a serious disease. The mom isnt suing the daughter is.. she is angry , ok. but enough to die? or think she should have? what if it was available to kill her in hindsight of a missed abortion? I bet she would sing a different song.

I agree whitedove, now that I am middle age and have some hard knock lessons of life behind me. It is simple, but the illusion of the cult was just that an illusion, a type of deception, that played on the niave the gullable , the lost, the young and the just plain stupid. although some maybe more than I can admit wanted to be a power player and play with the mog and such, I think many more just wanted to be a good person and do right for God. Twi asked a person to give up alot for "God". who or what was the god will always be the paradox. but I witnessed folks give up stable lifes and families to make that commintment thinking that life was going to be different and then once they got into it...........how do ya just quit? yes today it would be much easier with the lessons learned in a life of being used and often abused... but then the eyes where golden seeing only what they wanted to believe.

Any person can be "ordained" via the internet within fiften minutes. My nephew was ordained when he was a teen! As a hoot. yes he can perform weddings furnerals and file the proper papers within the state to make it official. I thought they would have to be linked to a denomination or at least a church to perform duties, but nope just an internet break and your a REV! A Rev. does not need to be linked to a denomination or church to perform. they can file the proper papers within the state, for death and marriage etc. It is about keeping records . As far as conseling ,lol, each indivual must seek what he needs in life and a title does not garuntee sucess or deliverence . Many clergy will refer to a professional if the issues are serious enough to merit need,most frankly are not educated in genuine helping skills at University. It is an adminstration and theory education mostly.

Chatty yes that is one avenue they can be used. When Mike pmed me he threatened me and insulted me it was not to share some private info. and I have zero doubt they are used to gain allegiance for a poster who is need of support and wants "friends" to bully another off the thread! safety in numbers is what counts here for sure! often times because they are asked to be accountable for what they said in some area. or they just do not like the other opinion . happens over and over on this forum. I think it is safe to assume nothing when writing on these types of forums.

thank you Rick, Im glad you enjoy my posts. Yes I would agree other than believing in a mission to rid the world of the evils of what maybe the ex leaders or current or who ever may be doing right now or then: this is not much more than a social scene of those who knew each other in twi,(or just knew twi or somone in it) and wish to continue in that alliance. I am assuming because you state you have never written about the way or its leaders you would fall in the latter "group". I say group in reference to the many constant posters who remain here that have (define as you will) relationships on board. who use their relationship to dictate whatever they will. yeah my real name is David Letterman . glad we can be so honest with one another and open and truthful. Im not saying everyone on greasespot lies. Im saying it is an open public forum with zero accoutability and anyone can say whatever they like when ever they like. like it or not, that is the truth.

a huge discliamer is printed on page one of Grease spot Cafe. It states that the moderators and owners of this forum do not agree neccesarily with what is written within or to that effect. HELLO. did ya read THAT? it is a public forum. if I said I have a personal account of creating the moon and the stars would ya believe me? of course not you have decided Im not in the group. But those who are and will be and do what it takes, can and DO say what they think with no more evidence or proof than my claim , yet their words are considered golden. it keeps the mision alive doesnt it? As I said earlier the documentations on page one can be verified, but for the most part most of what is said on greasespot within the forum or its pm's or e-mails can NEVER be verified and the posters with the most stories get the most attention . and they want to stay hidden as cyber names only. to save them from the cruel Waykbg who will ruin their life. haha what a joke most have not been involved in decades,(if at all) yet they walk in this invisable fear, knowing it is only their own lies and stories they are afraid as being revealed as lies. save me from the wrath of a small town bible study group they will get me for sure!! a little dramatic wouldnt you say? yet the same group wants to hear and breath every tidbit of any leader or members life and will write for days and often YEARS what they think it all may mean! that is what grease spot is. rest assured if your all up in a tizy and ready to report this post and rid the group of this awful poster who cant feel the love that is so needed and cherished and wanted here... your in the group ,you belong , they like you and that is all YOU NEED to carry on. The only thing YOU can NOT not ever do is ask someone to be accountable for what they write or think about anyone eles.

private means so no one eles will see or know what one may write in the pms about another. Secrets for only your ears to hear cause you will understand and not even consider holding the other accountable. it also defines a large part of the gossip you claim to abhorr. this entire forum is gossip other than the front page which can be documented. the pms add to the excitiemnet of those willing to use another as a topic of pain and hurt and accusation with the specialness of having a"inner circle" within the inner circle!! WOW what a difference your making in this world!!! After a few stroking posts that say what you want to hear or approves and confirms what you would like to believe (but are afraid to seek in real relationships with checks and balances) hell yeah I bet the loyalty can only get better and better!!!! good buddies , best friends a common cause. all is good till those pesky "others" come in that give you a WAKEUP call, oh yeah they are WayKGB lol. out to get ya! haha and those who left are not paranoid not at all... haha keep them away . use those pms.. get rid of the disenters!! we are family!!! haha . sound familiar to ya? of course ya love one another you know one another you trust one another you write posts and they believe in YOU! when the rest of the world is far to frightening to present yourself in ,this is good and safe and down right the best love you may have known!!!! at least since that cult thing. I do not think this is everyone, but alot of the posters here can define rabid as? I do not seek your approval, so do as you may and do what you must to belong and be loved. some things will never change.

If a person says they like you and your pretty whatever it takes I guess. Now they can be "trusted" and are your friend? Because they talk to you as the person you wish to be on the internet, without any revealing of who you are in real life and love they are to be respected? Maybe you are honest it sure as hell does not make everyone eles on these boards who they say they might be. The question is about whether a person should have integrity on these boards. that is an out right joke , one can write what EVER they want about who ever they chose with no checks whatso ever!!!! and they do. But God forbid you call them on it then heads will roll if the inner gossip and pettyness and slander is reported or everyone to to see. CRAP that would ruin the game all together wouldnt it now? who is foolin who really? it is only a PUBLIC internet forum about a cult, with those who will go rabid in defense of what it dearly means and how they live for it because somehow someway real relationships with such concepts as integrity and honesty and truth relationships are problems for them and this is as good as it gets in life.

Pms are not neccesarily "friends " or confidants. they are internet people that pm you. nothing eles. I see no problem with revealing what a private message says to you. they are sent to you. If the sender is concerned then they should watch what they write. As far as gossips and busy bodies HELLO that is what 98% of what this forum sight IS! lol The large thread on whether we should Reveal names testifys to the fact many here like to cower behind what they say they heard or knew or thought or heard someone say without any proof or names what so ever. integrity is not a word used much for the internet much less forums that breed hear say and gossip and spinning tales with no credit what so ever. if you do not want to repeat what some one told you and need to keep a inner circle of what say you outside the public forum that defines GOSSIP> it is cowardly and how this forum pretty much works with its own cult like mentality. bring the "do not tell them I told you but I think ...to the table and many here will just crawl away in the fear . trust who you chose as far as "heart" on the internet all I can say is give me a break. be real. and this is far from a real relationships with the normal constraints or respects or rules. one uses a nickname here for reasons: because in the honest real world of intregrity and respect for society you could be sued or worse for the tales and "gossip" this forum breeds. whether in the pms e-mails or the forums .

It isnt a joke. He sent me a pm, (do not ask me how it appeared when I came back to the forum). He said I have wasted my first post here , and he isnt trying to save himself , but the weak minds that read and hang out on grease spot cafe. a saviour indeed . I may be pond now mike but I used to be ? I had to change my name or something or other to post in new forum digs,long boring story. frustrating as well. if some will detail How I can copy a pm to this thread I will show you what he wrote. again why didnt you write in the forum MIke? why the secret insult and message?