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I posted about 1800-pet-meds and I said you need to have a vet. I forgot to put in the word NOT. you do NOT need a vet script for their meds they have all types of handy things i buy the shed terminator for my cats through them it works great. flea medicine,, just call them up and see what they have it is all prescribed by a dr. over the phone. it is a free call.

Ron please do not shoot dear cat . try calling 1-800-pet-med. it is a valid company that deals with all types of meds for such issues . they can send you a catalog, or you can order what you need over the phone. you do need a VET , or a prescription to get any needed medicines at a reduced price. honestly it is a valid number with a good company, we all use it here. good luck .

I believe TWI taught peole to NOT go to church after vpw died. In the early eighties , many of us did go to church, while involved with twi. believe it or not we would hold twigs and go together or alone to a service or a community thing and no one shunned the idea. I spoke to a friend in about this the other day and he freaks and says it never happened but yes we did, he didnt maybe because he closed his mind the minute he joined twi and wanted to go that path exclusively. many of us didnt tho back in the day, we went to church we attended family stuff went to parties given by unblelievers we lived a good life, how do you THINK so many got involed? What happened was so many got stuck with the stuff twi was teaching and if it was brought up as a d8iscussion in many of the churches twi people would be asked to leave the church, it happened alot and that is why the group got so darn exclusive in its thinking and being together . I know in the ninties it would have been thought of as a sin, and absolutely unheard of. STF encourges church participation .

That is a good idea Oak. Have you tried to actualy do that? easier said than done . for me it is like an echo , that does not disappear . years and years of trying and it is still very difficult for me to shake it. good luck with that, I hope it works for you.

I have yet to meet a "Literalist". Some claim to be . Untill they run into problems with the chapters and verse then they turn into "someting eles" . many will say just take it on faith, when they do not understand . other will go into this deep profound word searching mind bending "research" that no one eles can understand, claiming a superiour enlightenment. and on and on it goes, till each person finds their own peace in what they believe is good for them. I think that is how it should be and is met to be . I believe God is love. Jesus christ commands we love one another , not debate what doctrine we may or may not believe in . It is very painful for me to believe that some can worship a God that would even remotely hurt anyone. but again to each his own. people change we all have changed and wil continue to change how we think and/or believe till it is over. I do not think agreeing on what the bible says is needed for friendships to form or to share prayer, but it would be very difficult for me to share a prayer with somone who thinks the God im praying to could kill me or anyone. It would not help me in any manner and I would probably decline the offer altogether. Jesus Christ will and does honor people where ever we are at. Because He loves us that much, while we yet sin . WE can honor His caring comfort and gift of eternal life by doing the same towards one another, we can if the issues of doctrine take a back seat to what we each are commanded by the LORD to do. A word study will be defined as each decide it can be. A small child is an example of what faith is to HIM, or a mustard seed.. pretty small effort is indicated for faith . Faith can grow... but bigger is not 'better" . The POWER of God is a gift . free no strings attached. I have personly found the learning of bible verses has helped me understand what life means to me, and I think that is a universal truth for everyone. But THE gift of eternal life and Holy Spirit is far removed from chapter and verse and/ or its knowledge . The relationship we each form with the LORD is an individual love affair, not a generic robotic formula. I think we lessen the very power of God when we get caught up in the academics unneccesarily .

The"faulty knowledge base" you do not like is Holy scriptures temple , Because you do not like the fact I quoted what Jesus christ says , it is faulty ??? DEATH IS AN ENEMY temple. Because of your ignorance and lack of ability to counter point with scripture you call me names and insult me. you make a statement then want every one to just worship what YOU siad as right and truth and when it is proved different from the Holy BIBLE you attack the poster. you are a christian ? have you considered your behaver and character in what you do here? God does.

STUDy to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed , rightly dividing the word of truth. But shun profane and vain babblings : for they shall increase unto more ungodliness. II Timothy 2:16 CK the same chapter vs 18 the bible goes on to warn what could happen it says this vain bablblings can "overthrow the faith of some". That is serious stuff CK to think our faith can be overthrown by what people can say the bible says... that is why I say we need to study to fully understand what God is communicating to His people . I would be ashamed of telling somone my God kills anyone , who would want a God like that? really it is a shame to even think such a way (God clearly does not want us to feel shame ) .. so we need to work at our studies to get our understanding to the point we can not lose our faith, by those willing to use profane and vain babblings and more ungodliness. God says it will spread like gangrene. serious word huh? to be approved by God this is His request. per the book of II Timothy.

hahahahahahha lololololl thought so . not so mighty when called for the shots are ya coolwaters? haha what a joke.

ok cool waters . the thread was about whether one can read the bible and understand it fully. and you said in a God kills (shall I quote that as well?) it is on the previous page. then YOU put in this little diddy above to prove your point. But it didnt work because it does not say God gave Herod worms or in any way harmed or had intent to harm him. Care to explain your own self? cant keep up? or just angry cause I can? it is very boring to read people who backtrack and make false accusations. quote me sweetie pie where I said God our Father gave Herolds worms the false accusations, are shameful , first God then me, people tend to that when they lie.

study the words of the bible. it cant get any easier to understand . did you go to college, high school, or ever write a paper with your own ideas? Study is study. but isnt a magic formula I believe prayer and faith is also needed . God esteems His words very high within his priorities, and it helps while living in a fallen world to understand what the issues are in life and how to solve. them with Gods instructions . ok show me coolwater where does it say God gave Herod the worms? Tthe reason you keep NOT telling me has nothing to do with me it is all about the fact it is not written there at all. call me all the names you want .. whatever you need to do to avoid putting it down yourself ... it does NOT say that God gave Herod the worms at all . You just wish it did to avoid admiting your wrong, about your reference on how God kills people. simple english . and that is why God asks us to study our own self so we know what it says for our self, to stand approved before God. otherwise every idiot who thinks they know what it means or what they think it should mean, will confuse you . or out right try to trick you into believing it says something that is not in the bible at all!!!! imagine that happening??? hmmm.

STUDY is not just reading. Study is study reading is reading. a reading of a bible verse here and there will confuse you sometimes because it does have figures of speech and employs idioms and many other language usages. figures of speech are a BIG deal in the bible. huge ! and without understanding them and what they mean confusion can easily happen on some subjects. do not ask me why God didnt make it simple for us He is the one who says we need to STUDY and then another factor is FAITH... an unbeliever can read the bible and it means nothing to him/her. Just a story like any other story. so styill avoiding my question on where does it say in your bible reference that God gave him the worms? it doesnt so keep it going or just admit it.

Then why do you leave out my next sentence ? it says to study to show yourself approved before God. to just try to guess and insult and maybe this or that , causes confusion and divsion in the church. many do not want to know the truth . they like confusion for whatever reason , and divsion. others who chose to "show themselves approved before God ", study the scripture to understand its many facets and all knowing truth. So by insulting me you can AVOID the TRUTH that:NO WHERE in your reference does it say GOD GAVE HEROD the worms. So your God is a killer but he isnt my God, that is for sure. how do you play coolwaters if you lose you just start insulting me? and claim you do not have time or energy? go get your buddys? and change the topic all kind of games are played it still doesn not change the scripture that God is LOVE always without question. Im never bequiled.

that is why one can NOT just read the bible and get the understanding of Jesus heart and purpose or God love for His creation. that is why it says study, not just take a look and guess. People opposed to God will suffer coolwaters, all will suffer today we have sin , no where does it say in your reference that God almighty gave Herod Agrippa I worms or Elymas the sorcerer , it was an ACT of God to DEFEND His people from people who where trying to hurt them. (Herod gave up the ghost) no where does it say God harmed them, he can turn them over to Satan to keep evil men out of HIS church. to protect His Children. God is a serious LOVER of His people . no doubt. He hurts no one .

Not apples and oranges, God has killed no one. He did tell them evil will happen, and the bible sounds as if to say it would be Him. It is a figure of speech. It was not Him who killed anyone because the OT believer did not have a Savior; they had no means to fight Gods enemy, Satan. God always saves His people and those who loved Him to the utter most as in the case of Sodom and Noah. The bible says the people had nothing but evil thoughts NOTHING but evil thoughts, God allowed no harm to those who believed in HIM. God did all He could to save the bloodline of Jesus Christ. God is Love. God will never harm you in any way and has sent His son to save you. Death is not part of life it is an enemy. How awful your day most be thinking at any whim or mood swing God your father can change His mind and murder you or allow you to be killed. I just can not imagine such a life, how could one possibly pray to such a God? 1corinthins 15:24-26 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God and the Father after he has destroyed all Dominion, authority and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. THE LAST ENEMY TO BE DESTROYED IS DEATH. Hebrews 10:12,13 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God. SINCE THAT TIME he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool. Now before you ACCUSE Jesus Christ of being a KILLER lets look at ACTS 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy spirit and power and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.

Temple lady says: "God CAUSES you to die as a RESULT of your continuing to commit deeds that you know your going to die if you continue doing". so your God kills peopletakes pleasure in hurting His own creation because they are not good enough for HIM . the bible states SATAN the arch enemy of Our Father is the one capable of KILLING . it state God is LOVE, in no way shape or form is murder loving anyone. What deed did that little child do to be the one that got run over by a car? Why would a good man or woman who loves God die of cancer and not the raper inside the prison? I do not like your God Temple not one bit. The wages of sin is certainly death , on that I agree , who does the killing is the god of this world SATAN, not our heavenly father who is kind and very very patient and wish all men be saved from death unto everlasting glory and life. it is not a big surprise many religous people believe that.. it is a big fat lie. In the OT. God need to preserve the line of christ 's Blood in the old tesitment or their woud have been no redeemer , of sodom God saved His line of blood.. the bible states every person left had nothing but evil , in the case of Moses and leaving town how many times did God warn pharoah??? many many many times and the people still l could have saved their child if they would have put the blood on the door. they did not, they CHOSE to follow a man instead. these acts where done by God to save christ who saved us from death, with His obedience once and for all when God Raised HIM to be KING of KIngs. Jesus Christ is alive today , saving us to the very very uttermost. God kills no one . God does not work in partnership with Satan to have His people killed like some mafiia hit man . are you kidding me ? man this is why I do not do doctrinal discussions.

YES CK PLEASE READ WHAT i HAVE WRITTEN , Jesus brought the truth of the situation , concerning Gods heart and thoughts and deeds towards His people all are His creation CK. my only point is about your idea of just reading the bible and understanding it , it isnt that easy or you will get cnfused on whois who who can and does what. lots of contradiction in the bible. lots. I can speak of noah but the isssue is that is a doctrinal discussion really and should be put in the forum for it. God did and does not kill anyone nor does He allow anyone to be hurt in any way. As oak pointed out you yourself are saying it is the devil and then it is God who kills. cant have it both ways can you? so which is it? see? why I say it will and does get confusing? a good chunk of the bible does stand alone and you can read it and it will jive with all the rest of the story, but their are inconsistencys and what would appear as errors if a further study is not done .

Afghan Christian Convert Facing Execution BERLIN (AP) - A top Afghan official rejected criticism in Germany of the trial of a man accused of converting from Islam to Christianity, according to an interview published Wednesday, and said a death sentence in the case is unlikely. Abdul Rahman, 41, went on trial last week in Kabul. He was arrested last month after his family accused him of becoming a Christian. The conversion is a crime under Afghanistan's Islamic laws, and a death sentence is possible. German Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier has said he views the case with ``great concern.'' A senior opposition politician, Rainer Bruederle, told the Bild daily Wednesday that ``if Afghanistan does not quickly modernize its legal system, Germany must think over its help for Afghanistan.'' Afghan Economy Minister Amin Farhang was quoted as telling the Neue Osnabruecker Zeitung daily that the ``heated and emotional reaction of German politicians is exaggerated and has caused annoyance among Afghans.'' Farhang also said that although ``fanatics demand the death penalty in such cases,'' it is unlikely the sentence will be imposed on Rahman, according to the newspaper. The Bush administration issued a subdued appeal Tuesday to Afghanistan to permit Rahman to practice his faith in the predominantly Muslim country. The State Department, however, did not urge the U.S. ally in the war against terrorism to terminate the trial. Officials said the Bush administration did not want to interfere with Afghanistan's sovereignty. The trial is believed to be the first of its kind in Afghanistan and highlights a struggle between religious conservatives and reformists over what shape Islam should take there four years after the ouster of the fundamentalist Taliban regime. Germany has some 2,000 troops in the NATO security force in Afghanistan and also has helped rebuild the country's police. The United States has more than 18,000 troops in the country. 03/22/06 03:16 © Copyright The Associated Press. All rights reserved. The information contained In this news report may not be published, broadcast or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press. This may be moved to the political forum if needed . Some facts are Afghanistans sovereignty, so Bush says he doesnt want to interfere. hello??? WE have 18,000 troops in the country. the guys family is asking for the trial. In america we only think we are persecuted imo...

When I took the pfal class , it was sold to me. I cant explain it but it truly was like if you want to hang around with the ONLY people God really loves then you need to take the class. Pfal was the end all of christain being. without it you were not ok. then the intermendiate then the advanced and then wow and the corps.. it never ended . I think many did comply because of the pressure people gave people about "the class" , and I think it was about money and who could perform or run the most classes in the shortest amount of time . and then as a grad you were suppose to do it again and again you know in the other room , watching the new clss graduate and applaud like it was a education or something that will change their life. I believed it. I cant sell anything today. maybe a nice flower , but nothing like in those days were I fell for the sales and the pressure of it all. it would be interesting to me to see the class without the hoopla . how much does it cost?

IIm not sure if you would be interested , but soon Spirit and Truth will be releasing a bible written by John S John Lynn and Mark G. I am waiting to see what that looks like myself. I have hundreds of bibles each are differnt, I have one new testiment book with 19 differnt transalations in the text! it is huge. not always a good read haha . the NIV is popular for study and the "message is used to attract the cursory reader alot. all are good. I use the criswald bible. do not ask me I picked it up at a church sale when the pastor had died and they got rid of all his books. im used to it .

Ck one more point . do you believe in a God that ALLOWS anything eles to murder KILL and destroy his children? your post indicates you do. I do not. MY God is love , always and he does not give permission to anyone to hurt his children in any way shape or manner. God is a just God . Jesus Christ is our testimony of Gods love , he is sitting on the right hand of the Father.

ck please do not quote me out of context! everyone can reread my post and see the rest of the sentence in which I say the "bible is a horrid book". My post also testifies to the fact I have been reading it and studying it for decades. You have not even been alive for decades yet. it is well and good for you to defend the book of life, i love it as well , I was referring to you previous point in which you wanted to " help me." your reply was "just read the bible and believe what it has to say". it isnt that easy . As my post tries to demostrate to pick up the Holy Bible and I do not care which version you use you will find contradictions and errrors and different ideals, Yet God says He does not lie. I do not believe god lies I believ it is in our study of the book . I think that is why pfal is so helpful and attractive to people.. it gives answers were just reading the book is sketchy and leaves a person wondering just what it all means. Oak has a great point . if a person wants to understand (not just read) what the bible is saying it takes a life time. and study God uses the word STUDY for a reason he knows it will take a reader on a journey that will last a life time and then another. then people get stuck on defending their one point of research and forget it isnt even about the study as much as it is worship and loving. the ot testiment believers did not know about the devil they had no way to fight against him so God took the heat and allowed them to believe it was HIM doing all the blood guts in gore in the book. Job once refers to Satan but again satan is not the devil , they thought it was spirits , it is very complex and not one Im willing to teach here. Jesus Christ brought the truth to mankind, about what was up with suffering and such. correct. my point is if a reader just picked up the bible and read it they may get a very very skewed idea of who is and what God our creator wants for His people , so just reading the bible and believing it will not work.

since I made you cry in chat I will try to explain. If you want to me to read the bible and just believe everything it says. It says God almighty the very one who created mankind kills and tortures for fun . many do believe that as a matter of fact. do you? I do not, because I understand it to be a figure of speech Metonomy and hundreds if not thousand of figures of speech are employed in the scriptures. to tell a person to read the bible and get what god wants us to understand without a study of the many many facets it is about is just palin stupid and in the very least would discourage anyone from ever believing our Father is the loving precious God He really is. God is protrayed in the old testiment as a heathen mass murderer. shocked well then just read it but do not study it and you will see why I can claim such . figures of speech in thebible is amassive subject and without the knowledge of them no sane person would want a God as described in the old testiment . many issues will come up if yu really want the bible to make sense to you like the new books being written in greek yet referring to many many hebrew idioms . the list is long and without a consistent further study of language time, administration and most of all deep prayer the bible is a horrid book full of storys of mass murder and heartbreak. it isnt that easy CK. ( I honestly wish it was) after 45 years of the life the book has given me as far as knowledge and know how and peace and hope for a better future , it takes a heck of alot more than just read it and understand what God means. it takes study and research and a want to spirit willing to listen to His heart and Spirit. If your suggestion worked every person would be born again of Holy Spirit and God precious child , clearly you understand that is not the case right? It was written for His people , for those who chose to follow Jesus Christ as Lord. long enough.

Oak your right I didnt understand it. In the 80's here anywqys we had such a huge influx of people and classes and people going to corps out wow and parties and coffee shops , I did not see it as much and frankly I do not believe it was going on as much. Im not kidding when I say some very troubled people got involved , and went into the corps, to many people to really check to see if serious problems were happening and remember most were young and free for the first time in life from mom and dad etc. I do believe many went as far as they did because they had no where eles to go . maybe a mental hospital or welfare or drugs. and that is why they stuck to it to become the leader who terroized the people that got involved in the ninties. most people had left who knew how it could be and should be in a loving group. the rest just kissed their way into compliance and with the numbers getting smaller and smaller .. weel it was a recipe for abuse it really was. I saw it I believed it cause I saw it but I never understand why. honestly I do not think the 90 had the growth the 80's did,it just did not , and with a smaller number of people you could get hurt easier and pressured more. the internet the off shoot and people like me who laughed in many faces while watching them be so unhappy and miserable for Gods ministry put a real damper on who joined in the 90's. many weere those same troubled youth who had no where eles to go. so they took others into the hell they had made for a life in the way. honestly , it did get worse , now the 80 were not a picnic of glory to god inn the highest either.. but this is the 90's thread.

well I have reading the bible for 45 years. and every since pfal and twi and then the off shoots I do not know if I am able to leave " it" out of it. cant figure out how anymore. like a mad angry echo in my brain seered in the skin and membrane. I have tried . not very successful . every single time.. o never mind , good luck to you to late for me.