skyrider

As more and more twi-followers reach the mid-60s age bracket, will they stay faithful to twi? .....will they continue to go out witnessing at the nearest malls? .....will these senior folk give 10-15% of their monthly income to twi? .....will these long-standing followers go to fellowship 3X a week? Twi has always been fixated on groupthink....and moving as a group. Will rosie and co. be willing to cut them some slack in their golden years? Or.....will local corps leaders continue to be hard-hearted and drive them away? Yes, many churches are having the same challenges. But....I tend to think that twi doesn't mind driving old folks away. Perhaps.....I'm wrong on this.

Depending on how one views this "product" [pfal].....I believe, you are going to hear a number of quote-end-of-quote *successes* of the promised green card sales pitch. What were some of those promised results? .....how to pray effectually .....how to separate truth from error .....how to live without fear .....more harmony in the home .....etc. When I step back and look at these.....I can't really say that my prayer life was all that more effectual during my twi-years. Countless times, when I prayed for situations to change......NOTHING HAPPENED. Was I able to separate truth from error? That, too, comes with plenty of disqualifiers. How many times did I, and others, succumb to SCRIPTURAL ERROR based on wierwille's teachings? Too often, I swallowed the party line and didn't expand my research or critical thought to connect the dots of what wierwille was spouting. I must say.....that, even early on, I strongly doubted "the law of believing" as wierwille taught it. Only what God promised, was the essence of sound scriptural believing. All that foolhardy stuff about "believing equals receiving" was crap. Even in Philippians it noted "believing AND receiving." Wierwille and co. had changed the scriptures to kowtow to the twi-doctrine. Then, twi even taught that "giving EQUALS receiving" as it veered further off course. And, for me, having grown up on a farm......you don't plant one wheat kernel and get back one. :doh:/>/>/>/> So.....in response to your question, did anyone actually live the "abundant life?" Gee, I highly doubt it......most that I saw thru the years who were "successful" had already achieved success BEFORE coming to twi. And, quite frankly........is the "abundant life" spiritual? If so......then I saw NO ONE IN TWI who I'd classify as successful. If "abundant life" is economical, then.....even then, hardly anyone had anything of significance compared to other high-flyers. But, there again....it all depends on WHO one is compared to and what ABUNDANT LIFE means to you. ****** I will say.....that after exiting twi, I've enjoyed MORE of an abundant life, than anything that resembled my former indentured servitude in twi. Life is SO MUCH BETTER NOW. :)/>/>/>/> .

Wierwille was a master manipulator. As a child, even his own family KNEW that he hid in the woods to avoid work. Already, we was testing the boundaries of his father's patience and goodwill.....and seeing how much work he could sidestep without punishment. He was manipulating the situation. Wierwille was a showman. In studying homiletics, he did his best to alter outcome by "listen to me." Words and fair speeches was vpee's playground. He loved the spotlight, but not the accountability. EVERYTHING about twi......its class-structure, headquarters, targeting the youth, buzz-words, skewing family values and holiday traditions, isolation of corps program, keeping WOWs separate from Limb activity, etc. was to build a following dependent on direction/management. Incremental Indoctrination 101

Wierwille claimed to teach da verd......but really, it was nothing more than "enticing words of man's wisdom" wrapped with scriptural bows. Where was the DEMONSTRATION OF GOD'S POWER? Heck, wierwille became so spiritually bankrupt of soul that he wouldn't be seen publically ministering healing to anyone. He stood on stage and directed the advanced class grads to minister. In all my years on staff and in-residence, I NEVER SAW wierwille, cummins, geer, martindale, lynn, etc. DO what I'd describe as an unequivocal spiritual display of the power of God. .

:biglaugh: Twi's corps program was an absolute devil-spirits-everywhere-cluster-fest. HAS ANYONE NOTICED......that every corps coordinator [except moneyhands] has headed for the hills, far away from twi !!!! Yet...the doctrines of devils remains. Suspicion, manipulation, abuse, seduction, exploitation, isolation, containment, slander, demagogue, etc. In spiritualizing EVERYTHING, twi has mocked the essence of "walking by the spirit." If mowing grass is spiritual, lining chairs is spiritual, etc......how come leaders never seemed to discern any "possessed" people and CAST OUT DEVIL SPIRITS? Heck, these were the leaders who, supposedly, walked with all-nine-all-the-time and yet everyone of them got bamboozled by wierwille and the poop-master, geer. Yeah....corps coordinators scattered to the four winds. Teaching sound doctrine in the corps program? Ppppppffffftt.

Yeah......quite simple really, wasn't it? Wierwille was little more than Message Man. He stalked other reverends' sermons, conferences, and retreats......and then, added a word or changed a phrase to arrive at "the real meaning" of things. Of course, thru the years.....some things became so patently absurd [like The Way Tree terminology] that even twi had to ditch it for better messaging. And besides......how many in Corporate USA used similar references to their marketing ie Branch Offices? Wierwille just wasn't all that original. BUT.....imo, the biggest failures of messaging/marketing/maneuvering are found in the corps program. EVERYTHING....from beginning [sign-ups] to end [graduation] are blatant lies. The program is NOT about training up LEADERS. Nor is the corps program about serving God. Anywho....it looks like most everyone who's paying attention has gotten the memo: The corps program is twi-servitude for life. If you ever want to leave, then they slander you. In the end......WHEN WORDS REALLY DO MATTER, one realizes that wierwille and company was a contrived canyon of control. Once herded in, the hustlers had the advantage.

.....then I have a few questions. :) 1) Are twi-innies STILL called "Followers of The Way?" Back in the '70s and early-'80s, I remember hearing this a lot. At one time, it was the public relation definition in their promotions....ie "A follower of The Way is filled with, and manifests, power from on high and freely avails himself (blah, blah, blah)...." Of course, the double-reference meaning.....a follower of the way incorporated [FIRST] and, oh yeah, a follower of The Way, the Lord Jesus. But then.....if sort of evolved into this GROUP IDENTITY THING, where in unison they all were "the true household" and needed to cross over the bridge together. The individual component dropped.....and the groupthink wording took its place. 2) If the corps program is a LEADERSHIP program, then why did twi drop the terminology of Trunk leaders Region leaders, Branch leaders and Twig leaders? So...let me get this straight: corps get trained as LEADERS, but then after graduation and all...they revert back to coordinators or something? By definition, isn't coordinator someone in a structural position to "arrange and adjust things in harmony" as ordered? Doesn't a wedding coordinator simply follow thru with the instructions given by the wedding couple, those who are paying for the services? So, really.......the corps program is a COORDINATOR PROGRAM whereby if twi were honest, the trainee [once graduating from program] is submitting to a lifetime of taking orders from hierarchy. 3) If Words Matter......and they do......then twi is telling you EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT THEIR SELF-SERVING MISSION. The Way Ministry, The Way Household, The Way Corps, The Way Magazine, Way Disciples, .....etc. etc. Even the sanctity of "The Way Tree" teachings/class/logo was allowed to die on the vine because twi could no longer justify its biblical essence. It was given the "we don't talk about that anymore." Also.....No inspiring pictures of Jesus Christ, no pictures of crucifixion or resurrection, or apostles, or the Lord's supper, or the Sea of Galilee, etc. Twi is void of inspiration artwork. Thereby, the nebulous and evolving nature of "words" are like sand shifting under one's feet. Even the "Corps Chalet" has devolved into a generic, non-descript cabin in the woods. Today's twi has become about as non-descript in their abundant living brochures as their single-wide, dilapidated trailer units hidden at the back of the property.

IF......wierwille and company had been laboring in the Word [the words/works of Jesus Christ], then there would have been NO NEED for petty lists of "spiritual protocol." That's what Pharisees do. Nothing brought the throngs of people like the DEMONSTRATION OF GOD'S POWER. Check out Luke 8.....in verse 30, Jesus confronts and casts out the spirit Legion and shortly thereafter, the throngs of people were swelling the streets. Only Pharisees dictate a 10-minute deadline ultimatum to get your butt in that seat...!!!

Spiritual Protocol was one of those terms that *seemed* to have a scriptural basis, at first. One of the main verses that was stuffed into those retemory packs was I Timothy 5:17 Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine. Not just any ruler, but those that ruled WELL. ....And, they who labored in the WORD and DOCTRINE. Therefore, the question needs to be asked....Did wierwille and his selective leaders rule well? Was wierwille's ministry rooted in scripture? in integrity? in uprightness? Could vpee stand before the Lord and proclaim his actions to be true, honest, lovely, just? [Phil 4:8] And, really.....did vpee LABOR in the Word/Doctrine to uphold its standards of salvation & deliverance? OR.....did he work to justify his lusts, and sins, and repeat his self-serving "doctrine" a lifetime? The Scriptures detail, time and time again, men like Simon the Sorcerer and others who attempt to seduce the masses. Verses in I John exhort true believers to "try the spirits, to see if they are of God or not." So, did twi HEED these? NO. We were too busy placing the water glass under the podium properly, breaking breath mints in half, checking on the flower arrangements, making sure the chairs were stringed, the back room host was ready to serve the teacher and emcee, etc. etc. etc. In essence, spiritual protocol had run amuck and was a leaven that reached to the furthermost twig fellowship. Nice Trojan Horse there twi. Thanks. Spiritual Protocol at hdqts. Spiritual Protocol at the head table. Spiritual Protocol before the mog arrives. Spiritual Protocol before meetings. Spiritual Protocol to be in seat 10-minutes early. Spiritual Protocol to not question authority. Spiritual Protocol to not think evil of leaders. Spiritual Protocol was an indoctrination tool. Maybe the "spiritual expert" wasn't such an expert after all. Hiding behind the curtain was a wizard working levers of power. Lalala....."We heard he was a wiz of a wiz if ever a wiz there was...."

George.....was this when martindale was on that "crossing over the bridge to the promised land" shtick and committed believers needed to rally behind their local corps leadership? Yeah.....ain't it amazing how many ways they demand you to forsake your goals, your pursuits in life, your personal decisions.......to force you into servitude? So, what if the local leader moved again? Were you supposed to be a little puppy dog and follow him around the state wherever he/she moved? Sheeeesh. The insanity of it all.

Twi: The Gap in Time 1979-1981 There was a small gap in time when twi, almost, began to soften its cult-like grip and allow their followers to make their own decisions. 1) The Corps Vet T-shirt Like the WOW Vet concept, once you finished the WOW program.....you were a veteran. So, too.....once you graduated from the corps program, you were a "vet" and these t-shirts were sold in twi's bookstore. A couple of years later.....twi realized that this was NOT the attitude or mindset that they wanted to promote. Individual choices and thinking led to life-changing decisions that were not putting twi first. Many corps grads were going back to higher education and/or moving into careers. 2) Word in Business and Profession Conferences These conferences enhances the promotion of business/profession. Plus, many who'd been a part of twi since 1972 or so......were nearing their thirties and starting families, so a career move was another step forward. 3) Word in Culture Remember the tent at roa where you could bring your wares and sell them? For a year or two, twi was promoting Word in Culture and the whole ministry was busting at the seams with arts, crafts, music, cd's, cartoon mags, business models, opportunities, to network. By 1982....twi saw that they'd given to much liberty away and lots of folks were exiting their doors. 4) The Way Credit Union The opening of The Way Credit Union meant that twi was putting their stamp of approval on purchasing of homes. Note: Twi had to BACKTRACK from all of these endeavors. My, oh my, how twi reverted deeper into a clenched-fist cult disorder.

The short answer is yes. But......to understand twi and its methods, one has to understand their caste system. According to twi's system, the corps grads are the "spiritual elite." [Note: twi-clergy was/is rarily addressed as a body in whole. There were a few years when wierwille had clergy meetings or wrote specific letters addressed to twi-clergy ONLY.] The weekly corps meetings are where corps grads get their marching orders. In 1994, martindale mandated the no-debt policy to the way corps and staff. This policy [like leaven] was for corps only.....until it grew to consume the whole loaf of twi. In mid-1995, the advanced class grads were issued this no-debt mandate "to keep them sanctified in the true household of God." Soon thereafter, if you had debt [car loan, mortgage, credit card debt].....you were NOT allowed to be a fellowship coordinator. Twi would rather the twig met in a crappy rental place rather than a home with a mortgage. And, as leaven grows......even applicants for the advanced class NEEDED to have no debt or they were disqualified from taking the advanced class. Think about this for a minute. ALL OF THIS MEANS that corps grads were/are instructed by martindale/rivenbark and the beady-eyed directors to pry into everyone's finances. They peer over your shoulder to see if you purchased a new car, then confront you on HOW DID YOU PURCHASE THAT? They've railroaded good people OUT of twi who would not sell their home and give up their mortgage. MANY good, people who had mortgage payments LESS than rent payments were told that this was not sound judgement!! So, those years of working hard and building equity were scoffed at.....so martindale's "sanctification" could blossom and bear putrid fruit. Rosalie has kept to the same doctrine. It maintains control. But really......time marches on. And, many corps grads do own homes without mortgages now. Besides, no matter how twi tries to spin things......LOTS of corps HAVE NOT MOVED FOR 18 YEARS. Yet....the no-debt doctrine remains in place. And....the corps sign-ups are in single dismal digits.

Mark.....imo, there were many factors to this *debt policy* besides "pure greed and nothing more." Chief among these factors is CONTROL. In 1981, '82.....twi established The Way Credit Union and, for a few short years, sanctioned loans for which many were utilizing these services to finance car purchases and mortgages. Many staffers at hqs jumped on the bandwagon and acquired mortgages for homes in St. Marys, New Knoxville, Minster and Wapakoneta areas. People like John Linder (8th Corps) were some of the first to mortgage a home.....er, go in debt. Well....it didn't take long before MANY corps grads were "locked into mortgage payments and all" which, ultimately, meant that THEY DIDN'T WANT TO UPROOT AND TAKE A DIFFERENT CORPS ASSIGNMENT. See, there were corps grads [staffers] who, like Linder, bought a home in 1981 or shortly thereafter and didn't want TO GO ON THE FIELD. This was a big problem.......because of corps placements and twi's annual meeting. How do you tell a corps grad, and family to uproot, sell their home and move 800 miles away? What if the home doesn't sell for two years? What then? What about the closing costs? Does twi pay for these costs and extra moving expenses? Who is given special favor to NOT move? I believe twi had to twist this "no-debt doctrine" ALL FOR THE PURPOSE of controlling wierwille's corps program. Since twi ALLOWED for the creation of The Way Credit Union and the subsequent loans for mortgages......twi, then, had to find a way to correct their blunders!!! Voila......the "no-debt doctrine." Of course, many staffers and favored insiders were allowed to fly below the radar and KEEP THEIR MORTGAGES......while other field corps grads were chastised for their "debt" and told to sell their homes. The mortgage-era scenario was a BIG OOPS FOR TWI'S MICROMANAGERS.......and the corps grads were planning their own lives. Along with other factors, this is ONE of the reasons why many of the 3,200 corps grads exited.

In pfal, wierwille notes the trick of mislabeling......and then, DOES IT. In pfal, wierwille highlights NO private interpretation....and then, DOES IT. In pfal, wierwille states you can't fake speaking in tongues....and yet, he tells when he DID IT. What made him the *mog of the universe?* ....1) Who witnessed this divine calling and/or undisputable evidence of confirmation? ....2) The audible voice story was too weak and contrived to be believed. ....3) The "God talked to me" incident only highlights wierwille's dark deception. ....4) No one was ever around when wierwille climbed up the mountain of mogville. ....5) Why was "The Word" associated with only wierwille classes and books? ....6) Every year, the circle of "having da verd" got smaller and smaller. ....7) Those who dissented were immediately labeled with possession. ....8) No one, NO ONE....EVER...had a devil spirit cast out. ....9) Vpee died of cancer....and the cancer-spirit teaching in adv class was shelved. Yet, today's twi STILL propagates their "living in the true household" slogan. The grey-haired staffers plug along and smile appropriately....to keep their jobs. The sunday services are dead zones of going thru the motions as part of their duty. And STILL, twi demands this servitude TO THE HOUSEHOLD. What a bizarre, perverted trap wierwille set for the unsuspecting.

Yeah, outie.....it is perplexing how we were deceived and seduced. But then....it could have been worse. The youthful mind just doesn't process all that well. Click Here ......"The teenage girls who abandoned their families in Austria to become jihadis for ISIS feel they’ve made a terrible mistake by joining the barbaric lifestyle and they want to come home. Samra Kesinovic, 17, and Sabina Selimovic, 15, are believed to be married, pregnant and living in the Islamic State-controlled city of Raqqa in northern Syria, Central European News reports. Dubbed by Austrian media as the poster girls for jihad, the young friends now believe their lives have been turned upside down by their new lifestyles."

Labeling the honey jar...... Power = Indentured for = to Abundant = Substandard Living = Servitude Who sets out in life to......1)attend obscure meetings in a home 3X a week? 2) Repeat a foundational class over and over and recruit others? 3) Repeat contrived "manifestations" that have been heard 100's of times? 4) Shun family, lifetime friends and be grafted into pseudo-spiritual ties? 5) Follow orders, mandates and restrictions that "superiors" often ignore? 6) See mog die of cancer.....and STILL refused to discount his greatness? 7) Later, learn of all the plagiarism and predators roaming in midst? 8) Crash and burn of all its "pillars"....and still STAY? I will grant wierwille with a brazen deception. Right there in pfal, he notes the trick of mislabeling.....and then, DOES IT. .

Okay.....I admit it. In my youth, I was not paying attention to behind-the-scenes labeling. Taking a *Power for Abundant Living* class had all the window-dressing of appeal. Why would I, or anyone, doubt what twi was offering......marketing its product? The label DID NOT MATCH the outcome. Where was the POWER? Where was the ABUNDANCE? Where was the LIVING? Oh, I suppose some would point to speaking in tongues as "power in manifestation?" Really? After 40 years, and some of the SAME folk are sitting in their rocking chairs and retelling ALL THE YEARS OF TWIG FELLOWSHIPS THAT THEY ATTENDED. /sarc That's rich! Some stayed to get those 30-year attendance certificates. LOL Could we, now, just call it what it WAS ??? **Indentured to Substandard Servitude And, who were the beneficiaries of our serving?.........mogs, trustees, insiders, staffers While we moved every few years and knocked on doors, witnessed at malls, drove all over creation, picked up people for class, sat thru thousands of meetings and classes, and sent our tithes to hqs.......THEY smugly touted their spirituality over us. And, what did we see? The whole shimola was layered in deception and exploitation. The "power players" vanished and splintered to the 100th degree to start their own fiefdoms and run their own gravy trains. All that twi-household spin and apostles, prophets, evangelists, etc was bovine excrement..... NOT ONE PERSON arose in the midst to rebuke the money-changers and their evil. The Pharisees remain in obscure, rural-esque power......of sorts. In subculture slavish servitude, twi is a home-grown brand of spiritual moonshine. Those who subscribe to its trappings are bound to overstate its incestuous impact.

Hi Catcup. Yeah.....the "waybrother" conscience needs a vast, course correction. Sadly, his conscience has been molded by twi for decades via perverted scripture and distorted truth. He's an ideologue to deceptive doctrine. I remember when wierwille started that "be especially good to the household of faith" doctrine. And, as he'd wrap a whole teaching around it......it skewed the aspects of its context. One could easily discern this verse and TEACH IT PROPERLY, but twi has a dark agenda. Hopefully, "waybrother" will get a heavy dose of stern confrontation from the siblings. AND....maybe your good husband can instruct him as to the true nature of that verse. The guy (waybrother) has surely taken leave of a proper, Christian conscience and is adjoined to the baser sort. All the best to you Catcup. .

Yeah.....that "build a cabin on twi's Gunnison property" was from wierwille. It was at the time when vpee was marketing the sunset corps and all. Oh, wierwille.....the narcissist sell-out thought he could pull a fast one on long-timers. And, EVEN THEN....they saw thru the sticky-fingers of vpw & company. And......all the (cough, cough) "revelation" about a twi-owned restaurant on the Gunnison River where believers would come and dine. All just hot air.

When a cult is headquartered far, far away.... ....and there is NO accountability of the leadership ....and they systematically run stale, rigid classes ....and they pervert the truth with private interpretation ....and they mandate legalist practices that they themselves ignore ....and DEMAND WEEKLY TITHES AND OFFERINGS to secure their strongholds its.....A Redistribution of Wealth You innies owe them NOTHING. They are scamming you of your hard-earned dollars. You would think that $57 Million would be enough for twi.... And.......you'd be wrong. Twi WANTS more. It would be one thing, if twi was on a mission to help others. Or feed the homeless. Or help the abused spouse. Or the destitute. Nope. They prey on young, vulnerable, wandering souls. Ever notice the LACK OF PROPERITY TESTIMONIES in twi? You give and give and give......twi's "ministry" takes. Sure they spout a few verses......yet, hypocrisy reigns. The dawning of a new day arrived WHEN I LEFT. And, today I can say.....Thank the Lord for leading me OUT.

"Miller’s climb through the preaching ranks started in 1970..." Hmmm......1970. Now, why does that "climb the preaching ranks" sound SO FAMILIAR??? Around 1970.....preaching, exploitation, servitude, working at a substandard "college." Yep.....this Miller...er, wierwille was one of a kind. NOT. Gawd, these guys are popping up all over the place.

No....it took, almost, the whole time to DENOUNCE and SLANDER who screwed up and then, PONTIFICATE the twi-doctrines of following leadership first, foremost and always. You see.....without them, you corps can do nothing right. You NEED them. You NEED their counsel. You NEED to report back, often and always. You NEED to have the micro-managers hovering over your shoulders. See......ALL THAT TRAINING prepared you for this ineptness. Now, as a corps grad.......the leash should seem part of your daily walk around the block.

Groucho....thanks for the info, although I seriously doubt that I will check it out. Time and time again, I've shared the good, the bad and the ugly of the corps. Lots of good people. Lots of talented people. Lots of young people (back then) just trying to love God and find their way in life. Then....there were the bad and ugly stemming from twi-doctrine. The hardness of heart and rigid conformity. The indoctrination to all things spoken by mog. The bullying. And, the predators at upper levels. Bad, rotten fruit from a poisoned tree. Whatever they had over there at Richeson's website, I don't know. Never had a desire to look at it. Some corps STILL like to maintain their clichés and fiefdoms of elitism. The "research" geeks. The arrogant souls of days long ago. They have their reward. And, they can showcase their wierwille-brand edsel. It failed in every road test on God's highways, the HIGHways of LIFE. But, for me.....I've said my say. After 15 years of posting on Waydale and GS, I'm pretty much done here and am sure not going to join in that Facebook account to rehash it again. Good for RalphD to confront their warped nostalgia and the REAL MOTIVES OF THE CORPS TRAINING. The dawn of another day is here.

With ONGOING corps meetings....year after year.....its like the corps NEVER graduate from the program. Twi can, at any time, publically rebuke and slander any individual that "steps out of line." Think about it.....corps grad status can be revoked!?!? You're a corps grad. No, actually......you aren't. It's totally asinine and bizarre. You may have a corps grad certificate hanging on your wall, but it has NO VALUE whatsoever. You can get knocked down a notch by one slip-shod mistake. Are corps grads in their 70s STILL REQUIRED TO ATTEND WEEKLY PHONE-INS? Who sets the rules? Who grants the special favors? Who gets punished? Has twi updated their corps brochures to these mandated meetings for decades AFTER you "graduate?"

A long, long time ago.....the corps program was a four-year program. The first year was a semi-structured apprentice year which had broad parameters. The second and fourth year were in-residence training, while the third year was an interim year entailing an on-the-field year or staff location. Yeah, there were exceptions to this.....but, for the most part, this has been the staple "training" for decades. Then.....corps graduation, and on in life you went. Around 1990, after the so-called "fog years"......lcm needed to rally the corps grads back to the twi-mindset so he set in motion CORPS NIGHT PHONE DIAL-INS. Initially, some resisted this intrusion and exited from the corps ranks, but the weekly corps night hook-up became standard practice. To NOT attend these weekly corps phone-ins was NOT PERMITTED. To refuse attending, no matter the reason, was to succumb to their 'Corps Alumni' designation or DFAC-status (dropped from active corps). Is it still this way in September 2014? The corps night dial-ins became the Corps Choke Collar and Leash from which twi can restrain at will. So much for that "freely avail" stuff. :biglaugh:/>/> .