skyrider

Yep.....wierwille's grandson-prophecy of Lu-ke Somerv!ille was a delusional hailmary, but then.....JP' son is "installed as corps director" in a Mississipi-CFFM-outpost and.....Walter Cumm!ns comes in to "lay hands on" and prophesy over this grandson, victor paul wierwille II. Now....there are two "dueling banjos" playing for the wierwille-bloodline-rights. 1) Twi has dismantled lcm's era and raised high the wierwille flag (again). 2) CFFM has two of the wierwille children as support pillars, and wierwille grandson running a corps-esque program in MS to resurrect his grandpappy's vision once more. Of course, none of this is out there in the open....it's subliminal. A wierwille bloodline that dates back to 1300 France and its spiritual reverberations. Add double-agent Doug, and research-rogue Walter....and their stripes in twi-hierarchy and you've got the makings of a secret-spiritual-bloodline-bestseller. lol How many vampires can gorge on the wierwille bloodline?

1982 Corps Week -- "A Day with the Wierwilles" THAT WAS THE DAY.....when ALL CORPS should have walked out en masse. We were following the heresy of a false teacher. The man had outed himself with his delusional bloodline prophecy. .

Gawd, back then.....it was blasphemous to even think such thoughts that wierwille was just speaking hooey. But it was more than that.....it was prophetical delusions that were incubated in grandeur greatness of the wierwille bloodline. Weeks before hoisting the "spiritual mantle" on martindale.....ole vic is PROPHESYING THE INSTALLMENT OF HIS GRANDSON as the 3rd president of twi!!! Forget about ALL those years of martindale's slaving away for wierwille's approval and all..... The Wierwille Bloodline is WHAT MATTERS. Keeping it in the family. Keep the spiritual dynasty alive. And, then......years later, J0hn Shr0yer promises this daughter Tonya that she, after his death, will be granted rights to CFF-rule. Now she is president....and WCl@pp is second/third fiddle. Blood Lines Matter.

The Wierwille family ancestry can be traced as far back as the 1300s to a small town in northern France called Vierville-sur-Mer, translated "Wierwille by the Sea." These Viervilles were Huguenots, a group of French Protestants who staunchly resisted Roman Catholic attempts to dominate the religious and social life of France. In the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries, many Huguenots left France to escape religious persecution, the Viervilles among them. [Opening paragraph of Mrs. Wierwille's book, 'Born Again to Serve'] At the bottom of this page, the wierwille genealogy details the ancestry back to great-grandfather Johann Heinrich Wierwille (1792-1889) and his immigrating to the United States in 1839. Blood lines Matter......and mattered immensely to victor paul wierwille. Sitting in those corps nightowls, year after year......many of us heard wierwille lauding his family heritage in swelling words. Sitting on the grass in the campfire area of the way woods, wierwille talked about his parents and siblings, his upbringing, his childhood adventures, his german-pastor dr. kunst and the greater new Knoxville community. And further......corps in-residence twigs were dutifully scheduled to each attend aunt sevilla's "twig" on subsequent Tuesdays so that all corps were "instructed fully on the wierwille heritage." Closing in on 1982 and wierwille's legacy....er, "40-year service to God" highlighted.....the bloodline thread was the strength that bound the fabric together. And, it was THIS bloodline that mattered.....The Victor Paul Wierwille Memorial Museum Everyone else's family line was completely irrelevant. The pathological agenda of this narcissist had come full-focus in 1982. "The job of the Corps was to take care of the Wierwille family." In ways that jolt the human mind back from the unthinkable....."What did this man (and his enablers) really think about the Christ line?" The Martindale era (and bloodline)......is not even a whisper any more. The Geer-man, the sycophant who slaved years at wierwille's side.....detested. The wife and mother of wierwille's five children.....buried in a distant cemetery. Yet, wierwille's elevated shrine is the focal point of The Garden of Living Waters. The Wierwille Heritage No matter how many ways twi spins their website and programs, there is no mistaking the wierwille adulation and symbolism that marks its headquarters. The Wierwille Homestead is the shrine of the wierwille bloodline. The DNA genetics of twi is wierwille. That is "The Code" they're protecting. Without it, everything unravels.

T-Bone......plenty of good points. Thanks. Yeah, the similarities of submission/manipulation in Scientology AND the 1971 hyper-submissive Sea Org seems to chronicle same era to wierwille's corps-spiritual crack troops training.....isolation, 24/7 drill training, compliance to all orders, no questioning, spiritual quest, no turning back, mark-avoid = disconnection, enablers, hierarchy of insiders, etc. Amazing to step back and recount how wierwille lauded the corps training as "a spiritual marine corps." Translation: Follow orders or we kick you out! The schtick was.....if you can't listen and obey us, then you'll NEVER learn to listen and follow God. And the question is WHEN? When is someone "instructed enough" to start LISTENING, OBEYING AND FOLLOWING GOD? Gawd, twi.....you might as well start your own "Farm Org" pppffffftttttt Sea Org "It was essentially a prison to which crew who were considered nonproducers, security risks, or just wanted to leave the Sea Org, were assigned. Hubbard's RPF policies established the conditions. RPF members were segregated and not allowed to communicate to anyone else. They had their own spaces and were not allowed in normal crew areas of the ship. They ate after normal crew had eaten, and only whatever was left over from the crew meal. Their berthing was the worst on board, in a roach-infested, filthy and unventilated cargo hold. They wore black boilersuits, even in the hottest weather. They were required to run everywhere. Discipline was harsh and bizarre, with running laps of the ship assigned for the slightest infraction like failing to address a senior with "Sir." Work was hard and the schedule rigid with seven hours' sleep time from lights out to lights on, short meal breaks, no liberties and no free time ...."

Yeah.....submission has its benefits in the right context (when boundaries are NOT crossed). Mastering tennis or a golf swing from coaches and mentors is time well spent....to better your game. BUT with twi....submission was ALL-IN, ALL-THINGS SUBMISSION of life, relationships, thought, study, attendance, finances, etc. to stand approved before twi-leadership. Imo....I wouldn't classify mastering an artist's skill as "submission." There is nothing quite like untangling all the stealth concepts of a cult. It would take a book to peel each layer off down to its core.

When wierwille claimed that "he studied nothing but the word for 12 years (gist)".... wierwille was on CHURCH PAYROLL. See.....he makes it look like he is a benevolent giver to help others, but really he was searching for ways to advance his power and control.

In twi......submission via the way tree was nothing short of blatant EXPLOITATION. Whereas, in life......subordination is a two-way street, beneficial BOTH WAYS. In business and career, you "pay your dues" in subordination towards advancement and bigger paychecks. In sports, the coach and front office help the team to win championships....and bonuses, for all. In a cult......the longer you stay, they purposely suck your life and livelihood dry. Wierwille, at age 51.....filmed pfal in 1967 to construct a class-based outreach ministry that was headquartered at his family homestead (1881..?). From this rural outpost, wierwille positioned himself as The Teacher. Did wierwille EVER give of his time, energy, or expense from his own pocket to help others? NO. Did wierwille EVER subordinate himself to others for years or decades? NOPE. I have said this before.....even after pfal, I was not all that impressed by wierwille. The "biblical research" model was what interested me and I thought that A TEAM OF RESEARCHERS would move beyond wierwille-persona. The way tree structure, wherein the roots were sustained by toxic riverbeds of lust, greed, and exploitation is ANOTHER ONE of wierwille's lasting legacies.......ppffffttt.

Yeah.....but twi has a spin-answer for that little factoid of non-submission: "If you don't see the devil coming at you, then maybe you're walking with him."

Well, it looks like I addressed wierwille's AA-construct (the way tree -- ie twig fellowship) and its "twelve step program" in a thread years ago. Twelve step program

Wierwille's "cooperation statement" makes NO MENTION of God or the mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. Nevertheless, it offers up a system of submission according to ranking within twi-hierarchy. The counterfeit and its construct......the way tree structure. Same construct in Scientology.....Youth Submission in Scientology

1974 -- what whacked-out contortions wierwille used to deceive the youth. Layered in "cooperation" with others.....the activities, the movement, the mission for a just cause ....and mind-numbing to the hypnotic rhythm of good intentions. Gawd, does anybody know what time it is? Does anybody really care? :B)

Translation: "Each twig is self-supporting, self-propagating and self-governing IN COOPERATION WITH IN SUBMISSION TO its respective Branch AS EACH BRANCH IS TO SUBMIT to its respective Limb, AS EACH LIMB IS TO SUBMIT to its respective Trunk, AS EACH TRUNK IS TO SUBMIT to the Root of The Way." .

WOW, just-freakin' WOW.......from Alcoholics Anonymous. :biglaugh:/>/>/>/> Did wierwille EVER get inspiration just from the scriptures? You know, the sola scriptura thing.....ie Martin Luther-style? So, we attended "twig" like a recovering alcoholic attended those meetings? Skyrider attended twig regularly My name is skyrider......and I am a way-believer. I come to these meetings to substantiate my faith in the way international. The support here sustains me week after week from relapsing into non-believerhood. I speak in tongues much to remind me that I am a recovering non-believer believer. These meetings are my lifeline that sustain me from a life of peril. Thank you. :anim-smile:/> .

Even though....."The Way Tree" was one of the prerequisite classes for the advanced class, and....wierwille's right-hand man, johnnie t0wnsend, taught it as gospel, and....way productions sang that "leaf on a mighty tree" song, and....tree-terminology was finally phased out around 1992 (?) Twi STILL uses the tree emblem on their LOGO....whatever year that started? Pretty "jacked up" = whacked out.....right? :B)

submission -- the act of submitting, yielding to another for decision, yielding to the action, control, power, etc. of another or others; allow to be subjected to treatment, analysis; to defer to another's judgment or decision Systematically and cunningly, twi had woven an intricate network of submission throughout its "way tree." From the git-go, one needed to be "tapped to the root" to receive nutrients. Gawd, it was right there.....staring me in the face!!! You (little leaf) MUST stay attached to the twig to get those "daily nutrients." You will die if you don't stay nourished (by twi). Submission was/is the operative function that powered the twi-functioning and growth. Submission was the whole of twi.....a betrayal of self, deceptively yielding oneself to the judgments or decisions of another. It was a pseudo-christian counterfeit devised by a false teacher and COUNTERFEIT CONSTRUCT, the twig fellowship. So, no matter that we were served sweet fellowship [love-bombing] in those "innocent" twig gatherings.....it paved the way of submission to a cult. No wonder wierwille side-stepped scriptural references of "member in particular in the body of Christ".....and went with the leaf-twig-branch-limb-trunk-roots analogy....to usurp the rightful allegiance, honor and worship due to God Almighty via His son, Jesus Christ. Red flags, red flags.....I questioned this stuff within the first few months of my involvement, and was given a blow-off answer. Crap....I saw it back then as off-kilter. The Way Tree, why? Yet, I deferred to their "spiritual judgment and discernment." No wonder that after pfal they didn't encourage grads to go buy concordances and lexicons.....but just take the damn classes. Submission: it has ALWAYS been the staple ingredient. Not righteousness, redemption, sanctification, salvation, etc......but SUBMISSION. Not once, EVER.....did anyone in twi ever ask/tell me, "Why don't you pray about it and see what the Father wants you to do?" When they called on you to speak in tongues and interpret (in mtg).....YOU submitted. When they told you all the classes needed before the advanced class....YOU submitted. On staff, when they told you that salary was on a "needs-basis"........We submitted. On staff, when they told us to sign that Social Security waiver........We submitted. Yeah, I know.....submission is everywhere. But with twi, it was life, livelihood and eternal rewards and judgment wrapped into one big chocolate sundae. I sure hope that wierwille receives his rewards. And, here's the cherry on top.......Manipulation of One's Consent

EXACTLY..... For the first 5 or 6 years, I had a zealous excitement for the rock of ages. I expected to see joy, healing, deliverance, walking and leaping and praising God. YET.....it didn't happen. And, especially that year when wierwille announced a healing service would be held that night in the big top. I had high expectations of the possibilities. So, when the time came....and wierwille called for those who sought deliverance to come forward, he stayed at the microphone and summoned the advanced class grads to come forward to minister. Wierwille and his top-tier leaders stood on stage and watched the proceedings. Religious hierarchy smug..... The cRock of Ages became a smugfest of trivial pursuits for the little people. The smug of golf cart drivers darting hither and yon....while the crowds walked in the rain and mud. With each passing year, more mothers with babies and toddlers attended......yet, twi was stuck on stupid. In the 1980s, the teenagers were bored out of their wits......still, the spiritual elite provided little except a teen stage in the west woods. Oh my God.....the clueless are in charge!?! Who organizes an event to do THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN? Answer: Wierwille and his cult. Gawd, I miss those days of suit, tie and bible while walking thru a muddy cornfield toward a hot, humid, hard seat in a big top oven.

The social need for belonging was an underpinning to twi's growth. The rock of ages could have been a fun, exciting, social gathering ALL DAY LONG with a 90 minute teaching series in the evening. But no......the "ruling lords" had to leverage their control of spirituality from the flag raising to family table teachings to corps promotional meetings. What a crock! By 1981, I loathed the roa-religiosity and brain-numbing gurus. Same ole, same ole,.....year after year. C'mon, people......how many of us went to the rock of ages to see friends, family, and loved ones? Did the fanfare, the twi-infomercials and the bloviating on main stage add to that experience? Not really. Do I remember ANY SPECIFIC TEACHING? Nope. Do I remember certain people and the social stuff? Yep, I sure do.

Yep....right you are. Layered into my listing above...9) Groups.....people are a social animal, desire to belong [clubs, movements, causes, secret societies, etc.] are the socio-psychological traits of human nature. Most people, when they stake their allegiance to a college, team, group, etc. tend to seek acceptance or approval of their peers. The longer one stays, the stronger the bonds of camaraderie and conformity. Add the complexities of a girlfriend, spouse, children, your friends, her friends, children's friends, in-laws, twi-employer, having cut ties with past, etc......NOW WHAT?? This is far bigger than a bad business decision or investment. This entails life's most valued "commodities"......love and relationships, to God and mankind. When one awakens and/or finds himself ensnared.....it is gut-wrenching and antagonizing on multiple levels. How many recover from the snare unscathed and intact? How many marriages end in divorce? The intricacies thru this maze are multi-faceted. And yes, that is one of the reasons why many people stayed LONGER THAN THEY WANTED TO. I am one of those people.

Good post, DWBH......thanks. In terms of wierwille, I tend to think that wierwille's pathological underpinnings and gravitational pull can be traced back to his childhood and upbringing. Being the youngest child (with some siblings 10-12 years older) and raised in the shadow of Dr. Kunst's German-backed congregation and community, young victor was struggling to grasp a profession, trade or pastorate that would bestow prominence in his life. Clearly, his school record card shows that as a young kid, victor was average [82%] at best.....an "intellectual prowess" than he maintained throughout life. Seemingly, young victor set his sights on second-rate academia to pursue ministerial studies and training. With his father's financial backing, vic left the farm and never looked back......until old man wierwille died and deeded the farm property to the wierwille brothers. Shortly thereafter, badda-bing, batta-boom.....vic maneuvers his way back to the homestead to set up shop. After two stints in pastoral work, Payne and Van Wert....(and now, with a CLASS-BASED system that could govern outside the four-walls of church denominational dogma).....wiewille could function, and control, his pathological deception and grievances via his "research." His world had come full circle. With plagiarism as his platform, he now was able to wield power by skewing and skewering biblical truths to advance his Simon-sorcerer adulation. Could it be that EVERYTHING was subordinate to wierwille's socio-pathological yearnings of himself? I think so. The class-based "vehicle" changed every dynamic in wierwille's relevance. The substance was secondary. "The teacher/student relationship was the basis of twi......NOT Christ as lord. And, therefore.....wierwille maintained authoritarian rule to his grave. It was a slick counterfeit in the modern-era.....but very similar to Simon the sorcerer. Wierwille continued to teach that it was about the abundance and power of God, but in practice he commanded his followers to affix their eyes upon him." Wierwille's Quest for Greatness .

Drip, Drip......just heard yesterday that another corps couple exited twi a year or so ago. Long-standing couple. What a 40-year detour! I shudder to think what that must be like....ugh! But then.....isn't John Rupp looking for a job? This guy Is Rosalie's revelation to lead the pseudo-ministry falling flat? Why are dissenters rising up thru the ranks and LEAVING......AGAIN? What? No future? No growth? No clothes on her highness? Hey, WayGB.....you still reporting this stuff to rosa-lie? Pppppfffftt. Gawd, what a pathetic outfit....egg-sucking weasels. Nope. I ain't going to give you any details....except the 40-year detour. So, do the math...Linder. Start trying to initiate damage control. Let's see....40 years, hmmmm.....they must be around 61-64 years old. Keep working at it, Linder. What else you guys got to do besides clean your glock handgun and do late-night pizza runs?

Just sent $200 (visa) Keep the doors open....love the people and the food :)

" All that was safe was the collaterals." Gawd, it is so amazingly pathetic that it creeps me out just thinking about it. When I read something like this [from a poster who exited twi 2 years ago...ie 2014] it only confirms how utterly bankrupt that sales pitch was/is. Reminds me of those little "pocket-readers" that twi sold in the early-70s that we took with us at work for lunch breaks or witnessing. See, you could take the word collateral-snippet with you at all times. And, 40 years later....its the collaterals, the collaterals, and nothing but the collaterals. lol Same deal, different decade.

DWBH.....yeah, that's what I've heard as well. What a bizarre ending enshrining the wierwille legacy: 1) Wierwille made provisions to plant those seven maple trees....but no provision for Dotsie to be buried there? 2) Why the shrine near a public road? Why not a private, secluded family burial garden tucked away from public view? 3) Shrine symbolism? Wierwille burial spot is elevated and center above others in this only-men-are-recognized club. 4) Unless Dotsie was buried in Kipp family area, it seems strange that she was buried in a non-descript area. 5) Naomi was a non-factor in terms of twi, but Dorothy O. was deeply involved......yet, not buried alongside Ermal. 6) Maybe, it all had to do with symmetry......but geez louise, for a "ministry" that prided itself on detail??? 7) And, if THAT is how the "top three ladies" were handled.....what does that say to the schlubs who row the boat?