skyrider

Yes.....Waydale and Greasespot gave voice to the prolonged, rampant abuse and systemic evil from wierwille inc. Account after account, folks were coming forward to detail their episodes and perceptions that helped to "connect the dots" of the mystical character, wierwille, and its mythical history. (((Belle)))......one of the finer folks at GSC.

Not me.......having found Waydale, and now GSC, all of the information only VERIFIED what I saw from wierwille and his inner circle. All the red flags, all the pondering of "why?"...........well, it never was God's ministry. Albeit, there were many good-hearted folks, and even some who endeavored to walk via holy spirit, in twi.......it was not what they purported it to be. Deception, manipulation and exploitation were pillars to its construction.

John Rupp was noted about 10 months ago to be linking up with job-search sites. Now, without question......we know why. Rosalie gave the big-chair assignment to Jean Yves [the new cult-leader-in-chief]. Jean-Yves has been groomed in the art of deception and spiritual perception (cough, cough) for the last 20+ years by Rosalie herself. He is the most qualified to be subservient to Rosalie's and Donna's wishes than any of the other men. Men like Pla-tig showed Rosalie to find someone that could be easily intimidated. And, if twi's modus operandi continues.....that means that Jean-Yves will be prez for the next 18-20 years. Imagine how sluggishly-indoctrinated the whole outfit will be by then? No wonder Rupp is looking elsewhere. Will there be another mini-mini exodus when Rosalie steps down?

I was the clergyman that officiated Jean-Yves's and Michelle's wedding. Kinda amazing that he never stepped back to connect the dots -- especially during the lcm-purges and promulgations of twi-doctrine throughout the '80s. The lies, the cover-ups, the damage control methods, and the character assassinations of any who dissented from mogville. I guess a man sees what he WANTS to see.....and disregards the rest. Someday......maybe I'll get around to posting more on GSC.

That wouldn't surprise me in the least.....a malleable, servant. Rosie will be close by to whisper in his ear. Heck, how many vice-presidents, board members and upper-tier did Rosie run off? 1) H@rve Pl@tig, 2) John Rey-nolds, 3) R0ger Mittl3r, 4) John Ru-pp (?) 5) Ed H0rney, 6) R!co M@gnelli. If one can STOMACH THE HYPOCRISY and turn aside from SEEING ITS EVIL AND MALICIOUS WAYS and bite one's tongue , then there's a chance to someday sit in a bigger chair.

So.......how has twi fared under rosie's leadership (cough, cough) these past 17 years? As twi's "chief executive officer"......she slipped into the big chair after craig martindale's ouster to Toledo in the witching hour. The damage control message was sent out over the air-waves and the corps sychophants kept the allegiance flowing to the newly-installed hierarchy. As ceo, did rosie EARN her keep (and severance package)? 1) What are the total number of faithful followers in twi as opposed to when she took the reins? 2) Has the new-and-improved foundational class added to one's spiritual walk with God (or was it just another allegiance-to-twi buy-in? 3) Way Disciples and Corps: How pathetic have these programs become during her watch? 4) Why are they having trouble staffing hq with quality and competent followers? 5) Are staffers, who become weak and feable, still discarded without proper respect and retirement? I suppose rosie can boast of the $64 MILLION in twi's coffers.......but how did she handle the burdened, the broken-hearted, the afflicted?

And.......the replacement will continue to "wear her stripes" of wierwille-induced idolatry. And.......nothing at twi headquarters will change.

EXACTLY.

How benevolent of twi.......to toss in some dollars from that $64 MILLION. Ppppfffttt

Brainstormer......Twi's founder, victor paul wierwille, made his justifications to only serve "the word" [classes, teachings, outreach] and let OTHERS do the soup kitchens, food banks, homeless shelters, flood victims, etc. by cherry-picking Acts 6:1-7. And, this continues to be their go-to doctrine whenever this subject is broached. In this context, twi assumes that it is the modern-day equivalent of spiritual elites to handle "the ministry of the word" [translation: twi classes & teachings] while other laymen should "serve tables" and labor for the afflicted. Of course, twi does not tell their followers that they've amassed some $64 MILLION by "laying away treasures for themselves" via this exploitation. Perhaps, when you are talking with Jessie......you might ask: 1) Why did twi experience a major exodus of followers [28,000 +/- ] after the founder died in 1985 if everything was so peachy? 2) Why have some 3,200 corps quit their involvement with twi? How many thousands of WOW Ambassadors have left? 3) Why have a central-command "headquarters" in Ohio and all monies funnel in to.....yet, no financial support to state-run events? 4) Where are all the Christian pictures and symbols at twi's headquarters? Why all the idolatry to wierwille and its trustees? 5) Why do people in St. Marys and New Knoxville, Ohio stay away from near-by twi? 6) Why does twi have its own armed security force patrolling up-and-down Wierwille Road day and night? 7) Why won't twi display its financial statements to its followers like mainstream churches do? 8) Etc. etc.

Yep......parasitic and exploits its followers. Lying in wait to deceive others. The upper-tier and long-time staffers live off the "blood, sweat and tears" of those on the field......those who got out witnessing, follow-up, knock on doors, run classes, encourage their family or co-workers to get involved and then, faithfully tithe or abs. Those who sit in the "upper seats" have their [temporary] reward of a life of ease and lording over others. Sure, there is some scripture that has merit.......BUT one has to weed thru all the tweaking, and cherry-picking, and error-ridden dispensationalism and idolatrous mog-doctrine to substantiate any worth in that outfit. The place is a mine field. And, where is the "charitable giving" of this NON-PROFIT (cough, cough) organization? What percentage goes out the door to help others? How much goes to the administrative/organizational/pleasure of the elites who sit and pontificate and lord over the unsuspecting? 40%? 50%? 60%? And, how much goes into twi's investments and savings accounts SO THAT THEY WILL ALWAYS SUSTAIN THEIR MANIPULATIVE WAYS? And, Camp Gunnison.......now, just an exclusive pleasure resort for the upper elite in twi to go and be waited on hand-n-foot. Probably Howard is way-too-old to try and go elk hunting anymore. The place should be sold........and the proceeds should be distributed to thousands that twi savaged in their quest for self-gain.

Brainstormer.........from what I've gathered from your posts, your child "Jessie" seems to be in a situation with nice, good-hearted leadership. This is very common and understandable. From my experience, one can easily remain in this euphoria situation for many years........disregarding questions, alarming red-flags, personal career choices, long-term goals, financial well-being, etc. Back in 2007, I started this thread.......Transition and Transference Those of us who got involved in twi back in the early to mid-70s......the classes, the fellowships, the programs, and the annual "rock of ages" were swarming with a tide of fun-loving, young people. And, no internet (to check twi). In my opinion, it was much easier and elusive to get caught up in the utopian climate. But now......40 years later, WHAT HAPPENED to all those people? Hopefully, at some point in the not-too-distant future Jessie will step back and consider your questions. Where are the hundreds of people who went out on the wow ambassador program? the corps program? Why have some 475 ordained clergy exited? I believe that twi has a culture of "untoward secrecy".......as noted in my earlier post. In their classes, twi immediately constructs a barrier between one's friends, family (parents) and associations......while anchoring the "spiritual" bond with twi and its followers. The deeper one remains involved, twi endeavors to control one's behavior, thoughts, associations, information and emotions. Soon, Jessie will see that to remain in good standing with twi......he/she "should" faithfully give 15% of income for the rest of his/her life, and attend fellowships at least twice per week. Against better judgment or personal gain, following leadership guidance must always be considered first. Oftentimes, to cycle thru all this takes 6-12 years (or longer) depending on multi-varied factors, situations and local leadership. I speak from personal experience. I was one of those twi-clergy that exited.

Yeah......the longer you stick around the more manipulative and vicious the confrontation(s) for those exiting. Most notably, corps and upper-tier leadership are savaged with verbal attacks and when they leave are slandered before the whole corps body. Twi quickly goes into DAMAGE CONTROL MODE and only one version, their side of things, is heard in their echo chamber of bobble-heads. Wierwille would NOT allow any of his top men leave without confrontation. He verbally assaulted them on corps night calling them "cop-outs, flipped-outs, or possessed." It was this tactic that caught my attention back in 1978 during my in-residence year at Emporia. Guilt, shaming, confrontations and the salt covenant......ALL are used to manipulate followers from exiting. Open questions and dialogue are not allowed in twi. Hence, breathing life into Waydale and GSC.

Yep......THAT is the question that got my critical thought processes churning back in 1978 while in-rez. It all adds up to more questions......namely, "When does a religion become a cult?" Check out this link for in-depth analysis ----- Untoward Secrecy

Quote from BlueCord: "Fast forward to right now. I got some news this weekend about some corp being dropped. One couple (the husband had recently been promoted to coordinate the IO department) had been fired shortly after I left HQ. He gets sent to another state. I'm not sure of the details, but this weekend I found out he was dropped from the Corp and has left the ministry. Another good friend of mine who was Corp also got dropped. The reason? He made some comments about feeling unproductive. Now here's the kicker. One of the Vice Presidents of the Way got canned also. We're talking a senior officer. So, I see all this stuff going on, and I've read all the stuff about the years under Martindale (which I didn't go through) and I think to myself "Oh my God. It's happening again". " If I extended my analogy of "death by a thousand cuts"....... I'd say that some of these exits are knife-slashing gashes, not cuts. WOW....someone to coordinate the IO department is Fired. One of the Vice Presidents of Twi is canned. Turbulent times in da vey, again. If corps and staff leadership are leaving, its a sure bet that the "little people" are exiting out the side doors as well. Where did that "kinder and gentler" twi go that rosa-lie was ushering in? Where did the prevailing go? How many states have only two or three home fellowships? What a mess.

"Death by a thousand exits" will continue to intensify as the ruse is exposed. It is quite evident that waydale and greasespot have, methodically and undeniably, exposed "the whited sepulcher" [twi]. The days of twi manipulating a majority of good-hearted people and families is over. The internet is here. And, finding out about "the way international" is but a google-search away. Deception is at the very heart of wierwille's twi. By using the sordid tools of seduction......manipulation, deception, isolation, exploitation, power and control......wierwille was ensconced on a spiritual throne of his own making. But even then, the exiting was happening during wierwille's tenure as well. Yet, at that time, the youngbloods were feverishly witnessing day after day, week after week.......and few seemed to notice those who were heading out the door. Those days are long gone. The mystique is over......and the classes are a bore. The teachings are regurgitated enough times throughout the month that there is no meat to chew anymore.......just mashed-up mush. Distasteful and unappealing. "Follow the leader" is just one big pain in the azz

D) the mystique of wierwille and the pedestal of "THE man of God" E) a cabal of yes-men insiders on twi-payroll and the in-house publications/machinery

If "death by a thousand cuts" has any truth to it, then "death by a thousand exits" will be the epitaph of twi. These past few months, more threads and posts signal the current state of affairs in twi: 1)dissenters are voicing their concerns, 2)staffers wanting to leave hq, 3)no incoming personnel to fill meager staff positions, 4)corps abruptly quitting, 5)home fellowships that are nearly dead, and 6)rfr is on another terror to purge the ranks. Lovely. For me, the sweet validation of leaving that cult grows stronger with each passing year. Reading thru that thread Where's the EXIT?.......gives a clear picture of today's twi and its demise. It portrays an ugly use-and-abuse cult that manipulates its followers from day one until they've finally had enough abuse to walk away. And, the poster BlueCord got involved in 2010.....a way disciple, a staffer and the stench was just too much. You know, Rosalie.....if the newbies can smell this stuff that quickly, then twi-death is nearing your doorstep. The youngbloods know that its rotten in cultville. Me thinks that many of the next generation......are having NONE of it. Few ever want to follow in their parents' old-time religion and FEWER want to stay in a cult. YET, here you are....standing at the threshold of another year [September-August] with a measly group of incoming-corps to indoctrinate. Give it up, Rosalie. After 16 years of failure, how much longer do you intend to press forward against the Lord? Rosalie, by every measurement except one [hoarding of $$$].......your head-strong stubbornness has failed. Will you never learn? Oh well, go ahead and plod into another year of failure...... Where is Balaam's arse when you need him?

Two things: 1) In reading thru Joey Longley's article, he mentions his love for his hometown, community and school ---[he must be referring to New Knoxville ??]. Clearly, twi wouldn't be considered "his hometown" nor does it have a school. He seems to be conflating two experiences......small-town, rural Ohio and an insulated cult community not far away. And quickly, he launches into the main thrust of his article...."Despite the admirable qualities of my childhood faith tradition, outright and unapologetic hatred of LGBTQ people was a core doctrine." With each passing year, hopefully Joey will be able to distance himself from this painful past and also discern what "admirable qualities of his childhood faith tradition" are worth keeping. 2) Joey's parents wouldn't be Steve and Meg L0ngley? The Steve L0ngley that is one of the key-principled teachers of twi's new foundational class after craig's wap-class went down in flames? One of the three main "teachers" of twi's foundational class 3.0 [the class from which all allegiance flows]? A strict adherent to the wierwille cult and ideology; esteemed in the halls of the OSC; and a father who has vehemently confronted his son's gay lifestyle?

Although Mrs. Wierwille's book moves along in a chronological timeline, it inserts certain background information by dropping names of "influential" men who prodded vpw on his journey. Also, it is obvious to see little of the key elements of wierwille's doctorate of theology [Pikes Peak] correspondence work, the curriculum, the workload, and the vague details of receiving his Doctor of Theology degree. And, even though its still vague, there are more names and detail provided of the Mission House College than of Princeton Theological Seminary or wierwille's doctorate work and/or correspondence with Pikes Peak Seminary. Clearly, the book attempts to "rush along the doctorate degree and ceremony" [two paragraphs] with very little detail.....and from then on, he is referenced as "Dr. Wierwille." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Under the subtitle Mission House College there is a clumsily accounting of victor's basketball aspirations, experiences and tenure before Mrs. W asserts the following: p.25 "During the early years in college, Vic became a prolific reader and gave much credit to his professors who had helped him form a system of study. In theology, the greatest impression was made on him by Mission House's Dr. Louis C. Hessert in systematic theology and ethics. Victor noted, 'Dr. Hessert was a man who loved and encouraged me, and I shall always respect his great ability in academics. He gave me a diligence for the systematic accuracy of the Word of God and a thirst for knowledge in ethics.' Later, in January 1951, Dr. Hessert was our guest teacher at St. Peter's Church in Van Wert for the Universal Week of Prayer conducted throughout the entire nation among all denominations." "Another man who influenced Victor in his college years was Dr. Ernst. Dr. Wierwille stated, 'Dr. Ernst introduced me to exegetical theology and Hebrew. Being a good friend of Dr. Karl Barth of Switzerland, Dr. Ernst presented Dr. Barth's theological positions in my classes, so I felt well acquainted with Dr. Barth when I finally met him many years later in Basel, Switzerland." "'Both Dr. Hessert and Dr. Ernst encouraged me to consider the possibility of doing postgraduate work and to someday become a professor at a theological seminary. They wanted me to go to Princeton Theological Seminary in hopes that I would pursue either exegetical theology or systematics. It must have been disappointing to them when I chose practical theology, then taught by Princeton's Dr. Andrew Blackwood. The latter inspired me in practical theology, religious education, and related subjects.'" "At Mission House, Victor especially loved his classes in philosophy with Dr. Joseph Bauer. Later, in choosing courses at the University of Chicago Divinity School, Dr. Weiman there told Victor that he couldn't teach him any more in philosophy than he already knew because his teacher at Mission House College, Dr. Bauer, was the ultimate in this field!" ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ These two paragraphs, on p.67, are the FULL extent of Mrs. Wierwille's accounting of vpw's doctorate study and degree.....with a picture at the bottom of the page of victor and three of the educators at Pikes Peak Seminary.

The following is from Mrs. Wierwille's book, Born Again to Serve: p.30 "On May 29, 1938, Victor received the Bachelor of Arts degree at the Mission House College, Plymouth, Wisconsin. The following summers of 1938, '39, and '40, Vic attended the University of Chicago Divinity School while continuing his seminary studies at Mission House Seminary during the regular fall, winter, and spring school terms." p.31 "Later that August of 1940, all three of us [Don was born August 11th] traveled on old U.S. 30 to New Jersey so that Vic could begin studying for his Master of Theology degree at Princeton Theological Seminary. He believed he could learn much at Princeton, especially from Dr. Blackwood in practical theology." p.32 "On May 13, 1941, Vic, along with twenty other Princeton seminarians, received that degree [Master of Theology degree]. We then returned to New Knoxville for a few days, en route once more to the Mission House College and Seminary, where Vic formally received his Bachelor of Theology degree, which he had actually completed the work for at the end of the summer of 1940. His diploma is dated September 1, 1940." p.33 "In June 1941 Victor was ordained into the Christian ministry in the Evangelical and Reformed Church in New Knoxville, Ohio, his home church since birth." p.67 "On July 5, 1948, our family of five began a trip in our new 1948 Chevrolet, given to us by the Wierwille family, to Manitou Springs, Colorado. Rev. Wierwille had been taking correspondence work with Pikes Peak Bible Seminary and Burton College and writing his doctoral dissertation on 'Peter the Preacher.' By being in attendance at the seminary in Colorado, he was completing his requirements for a Doctor of Theology degree. Students there came from India and China as well as various parts of the United States." p.67 "Along with taking course work, Rev. Wierwille also taught two classes: 'Radio Preaching Techniques' and 'Peter the Preacher.' On Wednesday, July 28, 1948, he was awarded the Doctor of Theology degree by Pikes Peak Seminary in a ceremony at the Community Congregational Church in Manitou Springs. Immediately after his graduation, the five of us left for Minnesota for the Camp Farthest Out at Lake Koronis. It was a most tremendous and exceptional summer to have our young family experience both occasions." [Pictured on same page is the Pikes Peak Bible Seminary and Burton College commencement brochure at the nearby Community Congregational Church.] .

THIS. Oh, and......didn't Don Wierwille succumb to this cancer spirit.....er, cancer as well? I mean, geez....if it really was spirit infiltration or possession, then what's up with the wierwilles? Might it be a good idea to distance yourself from the wierwilles who attract them? /sarc

Would climbing rocks be in this category? The whole "believing expedition" encompassed supplies, hitch-hiking, two-by-two communication, positive attitude/believing to press on thru challenging situations and rocky elements, sent out on your solo...er, duo.......and hitch-hike your butt back to campus without your partner getting raped. Heck, wierwille always bloviated about his "believing exploits"......he championed hitch-hiking. Hell.....he was indeed the biggest spiritual hitch-hiker in all of twi. :anim-smile:/> .

He said, you assumed, he said, you implied......and the topic is dragged into Johniam's backyard. ppffftt. This topic.... Evidence: Letters VPW wrote to the Way Corps and subtitle.. VPW's letters reveal his twisted thinking For me, these letters validate wierwille's manipulative, deceptive and guilt techniques to keep the corps' allegiance. How many times does he lament those who are leaving the fold? How does wierwille not realize that corps NEED to pay their bills? develop careers? help their spouse and/or children? Gawd, these letters just sound like he's writing letters in a time-capsule.....to corps who go forth to witness, build the ministry and work at a fast-food joint. You know, you've "got the word" and money will be put on your doorstep every Friday to pay the bills. YET......wierwille was on Church Payroll UNTIL AUGUST 7, 1957. After he and dorothy eloped, and she kept working while he finished seminary.....wierwille quickly went on church payroll with parsonage package for 16 years as they took on their first menial congregation in Payne, Ohio and then, in Van Wert. These letters are like robo-donate-your-time-and-resources TO BUILD THE VP-MINISTRY. No thought, no empathy for the needs of the corps......just a series of guilt tactics. This compilation of letters give insight to all non-corps "the wierwille mystique" that was vaunted by staffers, corps and insiders. You want to know the deeper secrets that wierwille is teaching the corps......then, you've got to GO CORPS. pppfffftt. And, here I got a front row seat in one of wierwille's private meetings BEFORE going in-residence and wierwille stated unequivocally that these three 8th corps men "had devil spirits." Same ole, same ole generic slanderings that wierwille used when leaders over and over again.... yet when did wierwille ever actually encounter or cast out a devil spirit?

Well.....what I DO know is that wierwille lied. He stated in that October 20, 1978 corps letter that he had "not spoken or written" about these three 8th corps men until this corps letter. That was a lie. I heard wierwille's version, sharp tone and saying that they "had devil spirits." Yeah, right....... Are portions of this corps letter full of lies? When a liar lies.....does he write factual truths?