skyrider

Yeah......when this info on Don Wierwille broke, it was a WAKE-UP CALL to twi. Twi took notice that Waydale was a force to contend with......and needed monitoring 24/7 by their inner circle collaberators. Lxnder and co. got a new "nametag"......WayGB.

Yep......all credit to twi and no blame. Also, when professional people came to twi........like Dr. Rxwlins and others.......twi liked to front them as much as possible. As if to say.......we (twi) are the reason for their success. Rarily.....if ever......did some "lowly believer" apply those believing principles and rise to "great heights in the world's acclaim." Seems that most all who were professionals....were ALREADY that way......before they came to twi.

One of the news reports said that Cheney was hunting with a 28 guage shotgun. This lightweight shotgun is used for small bird/game hunting. On Fox News today, they illustrated the pattern of the small bbs on a silhouetted figure......and it was a fairly tight pattern (left jaw, neck and upper chest & shoulder. The closer the target (or unintended target), the tighter the pattern. I am no expert......but I wouldn't be surprised if the two men were about 22 - 25 yards apart. Gun experts will also note aspects of the primer, the powder, and the size of those bbs to measure the velocity of the shot traveling from gun to Whittington. In south Texas, I would think that Whittington would have been wearing lightweight hunting apparel.

Reminds me of those post-fog years (1989-1992)..... After the dust cleared from lcm's loyalty letter......the trustees were SO FRIENDLY AND APPROACHABLE to all those who stayed with twi. The anal protocol issues were brushed aside and the "head table announcements" were low-keyed. Meals at headquarters were more like "the BRC days." WELL.................by mid-1992, the OLD WAYS HAD RETURNED WITH A VENGENCE. And, after lcm was ousted in 2000.......what has rosa-lie done to change twi, really??? :unsure:

Why???? Because.............twi is eeeeevviiillll.

Yeah, Belle......an assigned area for napping OR the osc office workers can return to their comfy chairs and doze while singing ladies of the way is playing as background music. Besides......lowering the lights for another hour saves $$$. And............it's an inside "perk" for an aging staffer that others don't have. And............it keeps one lulled into submission. And............it helps the security guys get extra rest for their hectic night schedules. And............rosa-lie is at that retirement age anyways. And............its behind closed doors and the believer's abs pays for the salaries. And............few ever visit twi anymore except at a sunday service, if that. But.............this might all be hearsay and speculation on my part.

When I was on staff at hq.....some 25 years ago.....there were Ambassador One flights, witnessing weekends, way production concerts, a high country caravan series, video filming projects, vendors luncheons, hundreds of interim corps each block, wow promotions and mailings, international outreach summer school, new building projects, etc. etc. etc. A 65-hour work week was about normal. Today........what could possibly keep those staffers busy? The way rag seems to be rehashed. No research department.....no roa......no emporia campus.....no rome city campus. The corps program is in gunny-sack....and all but dead. By some estimates, there are only about 2500 active "members" in twi......and about 280 (??) staffers. Seems like innies on the field keep leaving twi.........but most hq staffers stay (and pray) to keep job. I dunno.....maybe twi NEEDS more accountants and security guards to protect their interests. Does twi now allow their hq staffers a nap time after their lunch?????

About two blocks from my house......there is a mexican flag on a flagpole. I live in a middle-class neighborhood and one of the better school townships. And, so far......it's the only one I've seen. Maybe it's just me, but it struck me as inappropriate. Now granted, I know that international flags are displayed in public areas, in schools, at airports, etc............but not in a neighborhood. Have any of you seen this? Is this a growing trend?

God honors the believing of His promises. The small stuff.......green lights, parking places, short grocery store lines, the last valentine's teddy bear in a store, no mosquito bites on a camping trip, etc........is highly debatable.

When I was 16 years old.......my best friend and I were pheasant hunting. We were in a harvested cornfield and about 40 yards apart and nearing the end of the field when this ring-necked specimen tried to make his escape. I, at the time, was "blocking" the end of the field to keep this bird from running and escaping out the back end. As the bird flushed, my friend pulled up and shot. With a 12-guaged shotgun, the small bb's went whizzing past my head. A very close call.....for sure. And, I scolded him for his stupidity and we rarily hunted pheasant after that. In my opinion, quail hunting is much more challenging and unpredictable. A small covey of quail, when flushed, will fly in all different directions. And, when the hunter swings to shoot.....he must be fully aware of his surroundings and hunting partners. Like any sport, there is a risk factor.

In the early 80s, as some good people left twi.........I took notice and pondered the whys. After vpw and the poop paper plunged into twi.........the paper was arrogant and agenda-laced. Wierwille was lauded as "twi's father in the word" and the current trustees were labeled "murderers." All was too "them versus us"........but still, raised plenty of intriguing questions. By the mid-90s, the questions were overloading my waybrain......the homo purge, the genuine suspicion doctrine, the walls of zion isolation, the debt doctrine, the present truth and lies, mark and avoid dogma, character assassinations of several corps, the cold and calloused hq leadership, and more. I started to LOOK for the door......preparing myself for the inevitable exit. When I walked away from twi.......a computer-savvy friend showed me things on the internet. The ex-way sites were limited, but helpful. And, when I posted on those boards, I was able to get in touch with many friends from years gone by. Then Waydale came on board.......and WOW, WHAT A RIDE. Waydale was loaded with current information. I stayed online for hours at a time. The martindale sex-predator side was coming to light. The Allxn lawsuit was filed. New folks, old grads chimed into the conversations and posted away. Top ex-twi leadership......like ralphd.....blasted the twi image. And, finally the mog status of wierwille and "God's true household" was debunked and...the scales fell from my eyes. The adulation of wierwille and his teachings were the last to be usurped. I have separated the scriptures from the wierwille-induced idolatry in twi. Thanks Waydale and GS. Greasespot has done an admirable job of exposing countless issues from.......duped to fxxks (er, soup to nuts). Now, I spend lots of time "finding myself." Today, life is just fine.

Dispensationalism aside.............what about the other teachings? Like..........The Jews, the Gentiles and the Church of God Or............A Believer's Standing and State Or............The Two Resurrections With each passing year.......the more I uncover.........the more I see that piffle was a "copy and paste" compilation. Nothing really new or original, at all. The emporer was wearing STOLEN clothes.

For me.....already had two or three run-ins with cgeer years earlier. He flat out lied about some things and distorted the context of these situations. Others knew.....but didn't want to get near the flames. So, I opted to stay with twi...........little did I know, at the time, that BOTH CHOICES were bad. Yep, the school of hard knocks.....I graduated with honors.

Great post, Belle. AMEN....to all you said.

The lcm-driven arrogance of twi had reached a new zenith.......after the wap class release. And, the "promised land" terminology fueled this elitist attitude. Calculated confrontation was the order of the day. Enough was enough. Many nearby churches were offering a whole lot more.

Is the Scofield Correspondence Course work part of the Moody Bible Institute? Could it be that veepee ordered and studied some of Scofield's work thru Moody.........of which, wierwille never turned in any completion work thru Moody? Just a thought.

Thanks Raf & WW, Scofield, Bullinger and Larkin are roughly contemporaries to each other.....oftentimes writing on the same topics. Okay, that makes sense.....thanx. William E. Cox writes......"The father of dispensationalism, Darby, as well as his teachings, probably would be unheard of today were it not for his voted follower, Scofield.......Darby was a prolific writer, and also spent much time lecturing in different countries. Scofield came to know him and became enamored by his teachings. These two men had at least two things in common--both had practiced law, and both had untiring energy in advancing their beliefs...." Furthermore, Cox writes....."Scofield was converted in 1879, and three years later was ordained a Congregational minister. With no formal theological training he wrote his reference Bible. Except for his work, it is doubtful whether this man's name would be remembered any more than would Darby's. Taking the King James Bible and adding his own Notes to it [emphasis added], he assured himself a place in the memory of all who read that version of the Bible This was in violation of the policy of all well-known Bible societies, who rules have been: 'Without Note or Comment'........" "Scofield's worst critics are men who have come out of his camp, and who remain true to the Bible as the infallible Word of God....." "The gist of the entire controversy at this point, it seems to me, lies in the fact that many of Scofield's most devoted disciples equate his Notes with the inspired words of the writers of the New Testament." ......say it isn't so......."most of his devoted disciples equate HIS NOTES with the inspired words of the writers of the New Testament." Wierwille's devoted disciples do the same.......nothing new under the sun.

Did VPW study Scofield's work.....and adapt its contents? I don't recall C. I. Scofield's name credited in vpw's "search for truth like it hadn't been known since the first century." But when I was looking thru his body of work on a link given in another thread, it sure has all the fingerprinting of piffle. ===== Cyrus Ingerson Scofield (1843-1921), Bible student and author, was born in Lenawee County, Michigan, reared in Wilson County, Tennessee, and privately educated. Converted at 36, he was ordained to the congregational ministry in 1882, and served as pastor of the First Church, Dallas, Texas (1882-1895), and again (1902-1907), and of the Moody Church, Northfield, Massachusetts (1895-1902). He spent his later years lecturing on biblical subjects on both sides of the Atlantic. The work for which he is best remembered is his 1909 dispensational premillennial Scofield Reference Bible. _____ Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth _____ Chapter 1 The Jew, the Gentile, and the Church of God Chapter 2 The Seven Dispensations Chapter 3 The Two Advents Chapter 4 The Two Resurrections Chapter 5 The Five Judgments Chapter 6 Law and Grace Chapter 7 The Believer's Two Natures Chapter 8 The Believer's Standing and State Chapter 9 Salvation and Rewards Chapter 10 Believers and Professors ===== [*internet link to Scofield*] I understand that this topic has probably been discussed before and I missed it. Thanks in advance.

Welcome Seeker46. I don't know about this paper......but wanted to say hi.

Mark......I couldn't agree more. On a further note, you bring alot of depth "to the table" here at Greasespot Cafe. I certainly appreciate that. Whereas, some of us......like me......spent 24 years in twi's cultish environment and experienced the warpness, exploitation, and devastation firsthand. It has taken me YEARS to de-waybrain. Keep sharing.......just clarify it a little better.......for people like me.

Thanks Mark.......had no idea you were referring to groups like Franciscan Friars, Dominicans, members of Catholic Worker houses.....etc. Silly me......I was reading through this thread, TWI's "No Debt" Policy in the About The Way forum and the opening post with references to twi, BOD, innies, etc. and the posts that followed. When I came to your post, no specifics were introduced to cause me to think you were discussing something other than the aforementioned twi no-debt policy. Thanks for clarifying.

Yeah.........my mileage DOES VARY. First of all, "called to be available at a moment's notice to relocate in order to serve" is......imo, a twi-fabricated concept. According to the Book of Acts and some epistles, many men carried out their ministries in one area. Of course, there were those who did itineraries and all.....but periods of 2-5 years was not uncommon. Secondly, doctor w-w-wierwille spent 16 years in Van Wert, before relocating to the wierwille homestead till the day he died. Marindale never moved from 1976-2000......until he was ousted. And, if one looks at Christian church leaders.......long stints of pastoring churches is common. Twi has such an OVERBLOATED, BIZZARE CULT SET-UP......that one must re-examine the hypocrisy from which these "debt statements" and such are originating. What?????.....some 300+ staff at twi's property in ohio to serve the mogs/mogettes their meals, do their laundry, mow the lawns, run their errands, clean their homes, etc. Why doesn't twi DO THE WORD...???....and follow the patterns of the first century church? Why all the bureaucratic levels (like worldly organizations)...and NO full-time staff in dozens of states??? This whole twi "no debt policy" is LOADED and DRIPPING with hypocrisy. They hire some 1200 corps full-time in 1995.....and tell them to abandon all past employment to be "available to serve." WITHIN WEEKS.....corps are being released (fired). Most here on GS have heard the details of this blundering fiasco by twi. Twi plays favorites.......always have! The corps on the field are playing "jump the hoops that the region guy sets before you" or ELSE. If he doesn't like your personality, or your physical appearance, or your teaching style, or your corps reports, or whatever......YOU are likely to be on the chopping block. NO RECOURSE OF ACTION........because the cultish chain of command will ONLY support the region guy. Yes.......in an environment of Christian living and leading.......a spiritually-even playing field......then, I would agree that the debt issue should have strong parameters. But.......in twi......an ever-changing cultish commune of collaberating commanders......IT DOESN'T WORK and never will. Imo, many corps alumni stepped down willfully from their corps status because they didn't trust twi with their lives, their families, their future. One ex-limb guy.....who STILL adheres to twi doctrine.....told me outright that, "He doesn't give a shix about twi's policies and wants twi to stay away from his shix." And, this guy, along with his wife and family are considered "followers of twi" and on their books as "faithful."

Mrs. Wierwille's book, Born Again to Serve journals vpw's life......from 1916 - 1961. Volume 2 of vpw's life (from 1961 - 1985) has yet to be written. Here is how the book, Volume 1, ends. ====== p. 264 Moving day arrived. It was now Thursday, February 2, 1961, a very blustery, frigid winter day. The temperature reached ten degrees with blizzard conditions. Some of our lady workers arrived early at our remodeled home to get an idea of which rooms the boxes, and furniture were to be delivered to as they arrived from Van Wert. The ladies lit the living room and basement fireplaces to help the furnace in heating the house. At 1:30 p.m. the Wierwille Upholstery Company trucks arrived with the first loads of our furniture and household goods. The easiest way to move the furniture and boxed things was through the four-foot sliding glass doors off the east porch. The brisk wind also forced through the house each time the door glided open. What a day! That evening we had our first fellowship in the living room in that new home. There still was no carpet on the floor, and the chairs had not yet been delivered, so the next best thing to sit on were boxes, the stairs, and pillows on the floor. Those present wer ladies and children: Rhoda, Miney Shroyer, Jan George, and her children (Susan, Mark, Paul, Tim and David), Evelyn Jones, Mary Wierwille (Rueben's wife), and myself with J.P. and Sara. The men were still out with the moving trucks, which were hauling the last loads of furniture. They arrived at 10:00 and 10:30 p.m. Dr. Wierwille, myself, and our family had spent over sixteen years in Van Wert. For Dr. Wierwille these years were filled with many hours of research in God's Word as well as many miles of travel in search of the truth. That had also been Dr. Wierwille's time of pastoring the congregation of his church with sermons, radio broadcasts, choir rehearsals, women's guild meetings, weddings, confirmations, counseling, and other church-related activities. Dr. Wierwille was busy learning about people and the practical application of the Word he was researching. This was his life-style in Van Wert. From the following letter you will see his vision, his goal to reach people with God's rightly divided Word has not changed. [Letter to followers] THE WAY, INC. NEW KNOXVILLE, OHIO February 20, 1961 Dear Followers of The Way: We are moved! Praise God--not only for our new headquarters home, but for those who prayed and believed and for everyone who helped us to get moved in. What a task, considering both offices, etc. Our address is New Knoxville, Ohio. Phone: 4545. We opened officially on Sunday Night (Lincoln's Birthday) February 12th with a great song service and an inspirational fellowship culminating in an alive and vital communion service. The spirit of fellowship was the sweetest this side of Heaven and how I wish all of my friends could have been blessed with us. Representative Martin Feigert from Van Wert supplied our Ohio State flag and State seal and U.S. Representative Walter Moeller has volunteered to send us the U.S. flag flying over our National Capital on Washingtong's Birthday, the ounder of our country. Isn't that wonderful! Open House for everybody on Saturday afternoon and evening, March 25th. We have a wonderful teaching fellowship each and every Sunday Night at 7:30 at Headquarters and we invite you to join us whenever possible. Thursday, at 8 p.m. each week is our local prayer group joining with our prayer groups across our Nation. We maintain a 24 hour a day telephone line open for prayer. Call 4545, New Knoxville any hour any day, we are at your service in His behalf. Ministers and wives, missionaries, full time Christian workers: Class on Power for Abundant Living, Y.M.C.A., Xenia, Ohio, Contact Headquarters or write Rev. Paul Crockett, R.D.#3, Xenia, Ohio, Phone: Drake 2-5274. The class will meet in the mornings only at 8:30 a.m. I will pay you to get your minister and his wife into this class. Perhaps you have a minister or missionary friend you could bring in. this may be the most outstanding class The Way has ever offered. Sincerely, In His Service, Victor Paul Wierwille [End of letter] In moving from Van Wert to The Way farm, life kept forging ahead. Dr. Wierwille seemed to have a fountain of plans for serving God's people. As he many times said, by keeping our hands joined in "one mind with one spirit" we would together move God's Word. We had made the transition from the Van Wert pastorate to giving our full-time believing efforts to The Way Ministry. With our move to Dr. Wierwille's childhood land, we continued to be challenged to depend upon God to open doors of utterance. We were doing everything we knew to spread the dynamic knowledge of His Word, the Word we had been given and which we were eager to share. [End of book] ========= A couple of comments..... (from letter)......."I WILL PAY YOU [emphasis added] to get your minister and his wife into this class." ......"With our move to Dr. Wierwille's childhood land......" Now, HE will answer to NO ONE and has more leverage to establish COMPLETE CONTROL.

Chef, My take on it..... In pfal, veepee taught that "The word takes the place of the absent Christ..." In all veepee's pontificating......he relegated Jesus Christ as absent after pentecost, and that the written word was now center stage. Hence, it was always...."da verd, da verd, and nuttin' but da verd."

Yeah.....there were isolated incidents of homosexual influences within twi "long before the 90s." BUT......in reference to this thread, "Why the Purge?"........the incidents that led up to the infamous 1990s homo-purge had raised the stakes of infiltration. 1) Martindale was furious that it involved HQ staff. 2) Martindale was outraged that corps were succumbing to this "homo-infiltration." 3) Multiple confrontations --- no longer isolated incidents, but infiltration. 4) Twi's theme around this period of time was Living Sanctified. In my 24 years with twi.......this 1990s homo-purge was a focused, relentless "war path against gays."